simonsay Posted April 20, 2006 Share Posted April 20, 2006 Have to say that after a small survey in a very small circle, I thought ss would, in the numbers game, exceed L-10 and production combined. So far I've been wrong. Does anyone see it getting any better? How much better? Predictions please. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChuckS Posted April 20, 2006 Share Posted April 20, 2006 simon, I guess it depends where you look! There are 69 SS shooters and 59 production shooters at this match: West Coast Single Stack/Production Dual Championship Later, chuck Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeFoley Posted April 20, 2006 Share Posted April 20, 2006 SS has been outnumbering L10 and Production at recent local matches in Kentucky. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
simonsay Posted April 20, 2006 Author Share Posted April 20, 2006 simon,I guess it depends where you look! West Coast Single Stack/Production Dual Championship Later, chuck I'm trying to get an idea when the shooter has all the divisions to pick from. Your numbers are encouraging and thanks for the response. BTW, you forgot to make a prediction. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oddjob Posted April 20, 2006 Share Posted April 20, 2006 Its been small at the local clubs I've been shooting at too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
simonsay Posted April 20, 2006 Author Share Posted April 20, 2006 Its been small at the local clubs I've been shooting at too. I have discounted local club numbers for the following reason. If the intent of ss is to "draw" shooters from another sport, yet you will not receive a classification if you shoot it, why would you? Shoot L-10 with your ss until you get classified. And, why would you shoot anything else locally? Maybe I'm missing something. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron Ankeny Posted April 20, 2006 Share Posted April 20, 2006 The clubs here in Wyoming are really small so we certainly are no measure of the popularity of SS division. So far, I haven't heard of a shooter playing in SS Division. Our new shooters are either shooting Production, or in the case of 1911 guys, they are buying a handful of ten round magazines and going L10. I am glad to hear SS is gaining ground in other parts of the country, but I think around here it's not going to fly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gary Stevens Posted April 20, 2006 Share Posted April 20, 2006 Guys we are three plus months into a three year project. I have noticed that some matches, State/Sectional matches have forgoten to include the division on the application and had to add it to a webpage as an afterthought. Nothing malicious, just something new. Some local clubs have not downloaded the patch to include Single Stack for EZ Winscore, so they have just been putting the Single Stack shooters in L-10 or even Revolver. It is hard to get any relevant numbers in this circumstance. I fully expected the first year to be extremely slow. We are still working to get the 1911 manufactuers involved in this project. The Single Stack Classic, this years USPSA 1911 Nationals, have added 40 new slots and filled the match very early. My information is 20+ of these were new members who were dedicated IDPA shooters. This is exactly what I was looking for. Will the final product be a success? Only time will tell. However, the choice will be with the membership, which is as it should be, IMO. Gary Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
simonsay Posted April 20, 2006 Author Share Posted April 20, 2006 (edited) It is hard to get any relevant numbers in this circumstance.Gary Are the local numbers counted? Seems they would be skewed for the reason stated above. Thanks Edited April 20, 2006 by simonsay Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeFoley Posted April 20, 2006 Share Posted April 20, 2006 I wouldn't discount the local match data just yet. This is where USPSA stands the most learn about practical shooters, not from the Nationals. I think in spite of not getting classifiers, the division is already very popular around here, and people are building new SS guns to shoot in this division all over the country from what I have read on this forum. I predict that it will make it based on the activity it has spurred already. I will not speculate on how this will affect L10, mainly because I do not want to sabotage this discussion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SmittyFL Posted April 20, 2006 Share Posted April 20, 2006 I think it's been pretty successful around here. I don't have any numbers to back it up, just seems like it. We've even started a Tues. night single stack only match and that is drawing a lot of non-uspsa shooters. Starting this month we are having a sanctioned single stack only match on every 5th Saturday. That happens to fall on the SS Nats, so I'll miss it. I know it's gotten me to dust off the SS and start shooting it again. I'd almost forgotten what recoil felt like. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChuckS Posted April 21, 2006 Share Posted April 21, 2006 simon, I guess it depends where you look! West Coast Single Stack/Production Dual Championship Later, chuck I'm trying to get an idea when the shooter has all the divisions to pick from. Your numbers are encouraging and thanks for the response. BTW, you forgot to make a prediction. Now, Let me discourage you now: 8 April match at Norco: Total shooters: 80 Open:26 Limited: 34 L-10: 10 Prod: 10 SS: ZERO Revo: ZERO You can see from the open and ltd numbers that the stages may lean toward hi-cap guns. Some of the L-10 shooters are using single stacks. Perhaps 8 round mags are just too much hassle. One thing about Norco is the dirt. You drop a mag, it's dirty. You spend a lot of time cleaning mags between stages. And don't give me that Glock crap, I see them have mag problems just like the other guys. And there may not be any incentive to shoot in the new division since there is no shortage of GM shooters around here to kick your butt in any division here except maybe revo. Predictions? The sun will rise tomorrow. and there were 1911 shooters in 1911, there are many now, there will be many in the future. Remember, this it the 12th year of the Single Stack Classic where a bunch of SS minded folks get together to get beat by TGO. (Got that gun running, Taran?) If I am not mistaken, the match has gotten larger each year and will go on no matter what happens in USPSA but I don't see the SS division going away... Again, Thanks Gary! Later, Chuck Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Merlin Orr Posted April 21, 2006 Share Posted April 21, 2006 SS is here to stay. Bye Bye to the SS wannabe/pretender. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chuck D Posted April 21, 2006 Share Posted April 21, 2006 "Bye Bye to the SS wannabe/pretender." Didn't take long for that bomb to be thrown... if the division does nothing more than encourage manufacturers to loosen up the purse strings and manufacture better than average guns for public consumption...it's a success. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Run n Gun Posted April 21, 2006 Share Posted April 21, 2006 Here in Northwestern Oregon (where it seems EVERYONE is issued a 1911 at birth) at my home club, Albany Rifle and Pistol Club there has been exactly TWO to sign up for that Division this year (one at the February match and one at the April match). Knowing that I shoot a single stack, I was asked if I was shooting the new Division during sign up and my reply was "I will always shoot a single stack gun but I will NEVER shoot the Single Stack Division, I came to play IPSC not IDPA!" Granted, harsh words, but every single stack shooter I've talked to feels the same way. Ed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oddjob Posted April 21, 2006 Share Posted April 21, 2006 Forgot to make my prediction......Yes it will get better (and bigger) and as refinements are made it will get better. Maybe after awhile the rules could allow SS Sig 220's, S&W's and other SS guns to compete. I have noticed that`at the local matches I shoot at the "way to go" would be to shoot minor with 10 rounds due to stage design (gotta keep the others happy). Some of the USPSA shooters I know that left for IDPA told me they are coming back for SS Division though. I have seen a few "new" faces in Production and that is encouraging. The SS shooters are the same faces, but are having more fun. I think after three years it will be here to stay. I hope so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gary Stevens Posted April 21, 2006 Share Posted April 21, 2006 "I will always shoot a single stack gun but I will NEVER shoot the Single Stack Division, I came to play IPSC not IDPA!" Very clear statement. Although NEVER can be a long time in Open or Limited. Gary Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caspian_45 Posted April 21, 2006 Share Posted April 21, 2006 I have shoot SS every match I have been to this year. My prediction is that course designers are going to decide if SS will make it through the provisional stage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeorgeInNePa Posted April 21, 2006 Share Posted April 21, 2006 "Bye Bye to the SS wannabe/pretender."Didn't take long for that bomb to be thrown... And... They're off! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
konkapot Posted April 21, 2006 Share Posted April 21, 2006 Why would manufacturers respond better to a Single Stack division (in terms of marketing, R+D, etc) than they have (not) been to L-10? FY42385 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Merlin Orr Posted April 21, 2006 Share Posted April 21, 2006 "Bye Bye to the SS wannabe/pretender." Didn't take long for that bomb to be thrown... And... They're off! Predictions - just predictions.... Caveat: Predictions were requested - that is mine. Does not necessarily reflect the opnion of the poster. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveZ Posted April 21, 2006 Share Posted April 21, 2006 I think the one positive that SSD brings is "rules consistancy" for all of the single stack matches that spring up over the country. But other than that....I see very little participation here locally and like Oregon, single stack guns are issued with birth certificates. Everyone here is shooting single stacks.....in L10. My prediction (since you asked for it)....it won't make it. If it doesn't make it...I hope the one take away is "lets all run the same rules" for single stack only matches. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JD45 Posted April 21, 2006 Share Posted April 21, 2006 I hope it does stay, and I agree that course design is what keeps many out of the division. You have to face the fact that not many shooters like to see their name drop way down in the results at every monthly club match. We sometimes have local matches called single stack matches. In those matches you can pretty much predict that several good skinny gun shooters will fall just below the top Limited shooters in the results. Now, switching to a regular monthly USPSA match, if those same guys shoot SS division, their names will be way down the list. Their usual 70-75% points standing will now be 45-55%. I see people grabbing their Limited pistol, or even shooting Limited minor with a production gun, at regular matches. They probably feel better about seeing their name up higher in the results. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dpeters Posted April 21, 2006 Share Posted April 21, 2006 I still think that the single stack numbers would be better at local matches if the SS classifiers counted. Doug Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Run n Gun Posted April 21, 2006 Share Posted April 21, 2006 "I will always shoot a single stack gun but I will NEVER shoot the Single Stack Division, I came to play IPSC not IDPA!"Very clear statement. Although NEVER can be a long time in Open or Limited. Gary Sorry Gary, I must be particularly dense today, but I missed your point. If you meant that we're fortunate to even HAVE divisions to play in other than Open and Limited I would agree completely. However, if the divisions we suddenly reduced to only those two options, I would strap on my CR Speed belt, Safariland holster and mag pouches loaded with 10-rounders and happily go play in Limited. Which, by the way, is my plan if you guys ever muck-up L-10. Respectfully, Ed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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