Racinready300ex Posted September 12 Share Posted September 12 A friend of mine is having some odd malfunctions in his 2011. The gun if it matters is a Atlas. I think Atlas recommended tuning the mags. The gun will either double feed, and true double feed as in two live rounds. Or the round might end up in front of the extractor and not be able to go in battery. Other times the round will end up with the rim on the face of the extractor claw and and everything just comes to a stop. Happens with Atlas tuned mags, and staccato mags. 4 or 5 different mags in total. The gun was having this problem then the extractor broke. So we thought that must of been the issue and he replaced the extractor and it seemed good at first. But now it's happening again. So we're wondering if the extractor failing was just another symptom of the issue and not the cause. So far it seems to be only happened with reloads, so maybe that's the issue. But his reloads worked fine in my 2011, and a DWX we tested it in even using his mags in my 2011. Ammo passes case gauge. We've also played with longer OAL thinking short ammo might be the issue. So he's going to run factory ammo for a while to see if he can recreate it with that. But last night practicing he could duplicate the malfunction on almost every mag with reloads and it didn't happen with blazer. Mags clean doesn't matter, clean or dirty gun doesn't matter. Gun is oiled. What would you check. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Racinready300ex Posted September 12 Author Share Posted September 12 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sfinney Posted September 12 Share Posted September 12 If it runs fine on Blazer but not reloads - could be the reloads. Are they cleaned, and feeding out of the mag smoothly, or sticky? And definitely check feed lips width (you can do this yourself - does not require a Pro to tune) Maybe bullet shape of the reloads is a factor, are they lead? In any case I'd definitely load long. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yigal Posted September 12 Share Posted September 12 Apparently the mags fit this gun.? check if extractor tuned properly and mag lips in proper dim... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Racinready300ex Posted September 12 Author Share Posted September 12 54 minutes ago, sfinney said: If it runs fine on Blazer but not reloads - could be the reloads. Are they cleaned, and feeding out of the mag smoothly, or sticky? And definitely check feed lips width (you can do this yourself - does not require a Pro to tune) Maybe bullet shape of the reloads is a factor, are they lead? In any case I'd definitely load long. Coated bullets, truncated cone 135's, summit city loaded from 1.10 out to 1.14. They look fine seem to feed fine, nothing visibly obvious looking at them. Mags are clean and follower moves smoothly. He said he spent few hours tuning all the mags a few weeks ago. I haven't personally checked the feed lips. Next time I see him I may have him try my mags, (can't remember if we did that) and I can take my calipers to check his lips myself maybe compare to mine. I have not tuned my mags, they just work in my gun so why bother. My thinking is it's probably something with the mags or the ammo. But, when other guns run the ammo fine it's not unreasonable to expect the atlas to also run it. And I ran a couple mags of his ammo, with his mags in my 2011 and it was fine. Somewhat baffling. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steveac1 Posted September 12 Share Posted September 12 (edited) Like sfinney said - Try reloads with a different bullet like RN. and definitely load long. 1.18. I used TC for short time and went back to RN with no issues. Edited September 12 by steveac1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeyScuba Posted September 12 Share Posted September 12 Could have nothing to do with this problem but I just had my 2 guns retuned and he reamed and polished the chamber. Maybe worth a look? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sfinney Posted September 12 Share Posted September 12 (edited) If it’s trying to double load (two live unfired cartridges) sounds like the feed lips are spread to wide? Or sensitive to the OAL being short/truncated cone. Try round nose. if it’s feeding a live round that’s jamming up on a spent case, it’s extractor more than likely. looking at your pic, I’m more concerned with the height and angle the bullet is hitting the top of barrel hood. It’s either released early, or it’s bouncing off feedramp and up? Edited September 12 by sfinney Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
konkapot Posted September 12 Share Posted September 12 Mike I get frustrated just reading this. The only thing you didn't mention is a different recoil spring. Maybe go 2lbs higher and 2lbs lower? The fact that it will sometimes try to feed two live rounds is really what grabs my attention. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steveac1 Posted September 12 Share Posted September 12 for whats its worth and I was a betting man, I'd lean heavily towards the shape of the bullet and length. (No issues with of the shelf ammo which is mostly RN) The TC bullet may be most of your issue as well as the springs on the mags. If your chamber can take it, go as long as you can on OAL. Blue Bullets, SNS Casting, Bayou for Hi-Tek bullets. Never had an issue in 40 or 9mm. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe4d Posted September 12 Share Posted September 12 did it always do this or did it just start ? You check the measurements on the breach face ? is it an one piece slide or one of those switch or roo breach face jobs.. I looked at that pick and my first thought was you got a 40 or 45 slide trying to run 9mm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Racinready300ex Posted September 12 Author Share Posted September 12 5 minutes ago, Joe4d said: did it always do this or did it just start ? You check the measurements on the breach face ? is it an one piece slide or one of those switch or roo breach face jobs.. I looked at that pick and my first thought was you got a 40 or 45 slide trying to run 9mm I don't think Atlas does the switchable breech faces. But, it's worth measuring to make sure the slide is right. I'll look into that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Racinready300ex Posted September 12 Author Share Posted September 12 2 hours ago, sfinney said: looking at your pic, I’m more concerned with the height and angle the bullet is hitting the top of barrel hood. It’s either released early, or it’s bouncing off feedramp and up? To me it looks like the mag must of lost control of that top round and it almost popped free of the slide. You can kind of see the next round under it trying to go into the chamber too. We should of taken more pictures. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maximis228 Posted September 12 Share Posted September 12 To me this sounds like a feed lip issue. Measure and adjust accordingly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CHA-LEE Posted September 12 Share Posted September 12 I had this exact same issue with an Atlas Athena and went down the rabbit hole of Extractor, Ejector, Ammo, Mags, etc. The root cause ended up being the angle cut they make on the disconnector rib (underside of the slide) as it meets the breach face. I swapped the Slide with one that didn't have the angle cut and BOOM..... Crazy feeding issues were gone. That being said, you might want to reach out to Atlas to see if they can give it a "Once Over" to make sure everything is in spec. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RangerTrace Posted September 13 Share Posted September 13 Yep, just send it back. He paid a premium price and it should run. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrewM Posted September 13 Share Posted September 13 Diagnosing feed issues without seeing the gun is tough. One thing I like to do on my own project guns is to take out the FP (or if you have extra/old stuff - modify a FP to make one that can't fire - the ultimate goal is to make sure the gun can't fire), remove the recoil spring, cock the hammer, and then just slowly cycle the slide by hand with a magazine loaded to whatever level you like. You want to feel any place where things hang up, get caught on something, require extra effort, etc. Usually I'll just use dummy rounds, I have been known to make my own 'dummy rounds' on the reloading bench, etc. Just make sure to be safe and render the gun safe if you are going to use live rounds - live rounds + work bench is an abnormal danger situation. And you don't necessarily need to use a full magazine of live rounds, if you have feed issues with the first round, you can drop 2 live rounds in and then fill the rest with dummy rounds, or whatever combo is needed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Postal Bob Posted Monday at 02:16 PM Share Posted Monday at 02:16 PM What weight recoil spring? Had a similar issue with a 9mm with a 9lb recoil spring. As the spring wore out, the slide would hit too hard, and the top round in the mag would literally pop out of the mag, sit atop the next round, and then there were 2 rounds trying to be fed into the chamber. Once I went to a 10lb spring, problem stopped. Also, his COL seems very short for a 2011 gun. These guns were designed for long COL lengths like 1.18 or more. Shorter rounds will tip up in the mag causing problems. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Racinready300ex Posted Monday at 02:47 PM Author Share Posted Monday at 02:47 PM 30 minutes ago, Postal Bob said: What weight recoil spring? Had a similar issue with a 9mm with a 9lb recoil spring. As the spring wore out, the slide would hit too hard, and the top round in the mag would literally pop out of the mag, sit atop the next round, and then there were 2 rounds trying to be fed into the chamber. Once I went to a 10lb spring, problem stopped. Also, his COL seems very short for a 2011 gun. These guns were designed for long COL lengths like 1.18 or more. Shorter rounds will tip up in the mag causing problems. I'm not sure the spring weight, I know it's new but I'll ask him. He did shoot it at a 10 stage match over the weekend using Blazer with no malfunctions like that. I do think he may have gotten hammer follow once, but he wasn't sure in the heat of the stage he just new the gun was in battery but the trigger was locked up. I wasn't close enough to see the hammer. I guess it's possible the round was in front of the extractor and that it was 99% in battery. But, no way to know now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
truespode Posted Monday at 02:49 PM Share Posted Monday at 02:49 PM 30 minutes ago, Postal Bob said: What weight recoil spring? Had a similar issue with a 9mm with a 9lb recoil spring. As the spring wore out, the slide would hit too hard, and the top round in the mag would literally pop out of the mag, sit atop the next round, and then there were 2 rounds trying to be fed into the chamber. Once I went to a 10lb spring, problem stopped. Also, his COL seems very short for a 2011 gun. These guns were designed for long COL lengths like 1.18 or more. Shorter rounds will tip up in the mag causing problems. Same here... I am new to 2011's and got a MPA LOC. Love it but after my 2nd match I started to have the exact issue with feeds. MPA said it was either the ejector (probably dirty) or mags. I run 135 Blue Bullet TC's. I cleaned it and the mags were all measuring exactly the same (12 MBX's). I went from an 8lb recoil spring to a 9lb recoil spring and have had zero malfunctions in 4 matches and a couple trips to the range for chrono. It has shot all my MBX mags, a Prodigy 20 round mag, 2 17 round Checkmate and 1 17 round Prodigy mag with absolutely no issues since going to the 9lb recoil spring. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ddc Posted Tuesday at 03:46 PM Share Posted Tuesday at 03:46 PM On 9/16/2024 at 8:49 AM, truespode said: Same here... I am new to 2011's and got a MPA LOC. Love it but after my 2nd match I started to have the exact issue with feeds. MPA said it was either the ejector (probably dirty) or mags. Ejector or extractor? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
truespode Posted yesterday at 12:56 AM Share Posted yesterday at 12:56 AM (edited) 9 hours ago, ddc said: Ejector or extractor? Oops... Extractor... Thanks for the catch Edited yesterday at 12:58 AM by truespode Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now