Classification question

[DukeSoprano]

I have searched but didn't find anything.

 

IF you get classified M in one division that automatically means you classify no lower than A in any other division? 

 

What if you are classified B in one division, does that mean you will classify no less than C in any other division?

 

Thanks

[varminter22]

Yes.

[waktasz]

Once you have a classifiction in the other division, it can't be more than one lower than your highest. It doesn't mean you automatically are classified in all the divisions. 

[Sinister4]

Question  so if you qualified with PCC as M  your pistol qualification would be bumped  "A" even if you suck with a pistol and had a C ?  Just wondering

[Sarge]

4 minutes ago, Sinister4 said:

Question  so if you qualified with PCC as M  your pistol qualification would be bumped  "A" even if you suck with a pistol and had a C ?  Just wondering

Correct

[echotango]

5 minutes ago, Sinister4 said:

Question  so if you qualified with PCC as M  your pistol qualification would be bumped  "A" even if you suck with a pistol and had a C ?  Just wondering

Yes.

Im a GM in open and have a M in single stack at 24% cuz I shot a classifier match once(in minor).  I suck without a dot, lol. 

Edited August 10, 2022 by echotango

[waktasz]

17 minutes ago, Sinister4 said:

Question  so if you qualified with PCC as M  your pistol qualification would be bumped  "A" even if you suck with a pistol and had a C ?  Just wondering

 

All the PCC GMs I know are like this, lol

[GigG]

USPSA really should put this in the rule book.

[waktasz]

Rifle shooters should just learn how to shoot better

[Sinister4]

19 minutes ago, waktasz said:

Rifle shooters should just learn how to shoot better

lol  I`m sure trying to  

[JodiH]

11 hours ago, GigG said:

USPSA really should put this in the rule book.

There is info about the classification system in the very front of the USPSA Competition Rules, but the most up-to-date info is on the USPSA website: https://uspsa.org/pages/about/classification.  

 

The info about the classification system used to be in the front of the Classifier Diagram book, which we don't have anymore because everything was moved online.  I think the question being discussed here was in that book, but didn't make it to the webpage.  I have a copy of it.  I'll see if I can get it added to the info on the USPSA website.

[JodiH]

Actually the info is on the webpage (https://uspsa.org/pages/about/classification) under the 'C' flag definition:

 

"Scores that are more than one class below the member's highest classification in any other division are flagged with "C." For example, if a member with an ‘A’ classification in Open division submits a C-class score in Limited division, the score will be assigned a "C" flag. An exception to this is if the member has not established a classification in a division. If a member is not classified in a division, all scores higher than 2 percent will be entered in that division until a classification is earned. However, if the resulting classification is more than one class below the other division’s classification, the member will be automatically moved to the classification bracket that is one class below the other division."

[waktasz]

I think what he was saying is that USPSA should put in the rules that shooting to a high class in the dopey rifle division should affect your pistol classification. At least that's what it looked like to me. 

[JodiH]

25 minutes ago, waktasz said:

I think what he was saying is that USPSA should put in the rules that shooting to a high class in the dopey rifle division should affect your pistol classification. At least that's what it looked like to me. 

That is something you need to take to the Board.  The classification system isn't a rules thing, it's a HQ thing.  The previous president was asked often about uncoupling PCC and handgun classifications but said there wasn't data to support the change.  I know a few people who are only A-class handgun shooters and GM in PCC and would like it to be changed.  Maybe there is enough data for the BOD to consider changing it now.

[Sinister4]

10 hours ago, waktasz said:

I think what he was saying is that USPSA should put in the rules that shooting to a high class in the dopey rifle division should affect your pistol classification. At least that's what it looked like to me. 

exactly it should be  totally separate for the pistol and the rifle. 

[GigG]

11 hours ago, waktasz said:

I think what he was saying is that USPSA should put in the rules that shooting to a high class in the dopey rifle division should affect your pistol classification. At least that's what it looked like to me. 

 

Exactly

 

10 hours ago, JodiH said:

The classification system isn't a rules thing, it's a HQ thing. 

 

 

Yet they dedicate 1.75 pages in the rule book to classification.

[Boomstick303]

I have to ask what does it matter how the current system works?

 

If a person is a GM in PCC and then ranked as an M in anything else is they have enough classifiers to be ranked, how does that affect anything in the big picture.  It doesn't.  If anything it does not allow sand bagging.  Its not like the higher classification in a division they are not truly deserving of is going to help them. An Individual's match performance for any given match is their true classification anyway.  Not what a classification systems tells that individual they are.  

 

Unless you care about plastic trophies in level 2 and up matches for a given classification.   

[waktasz]

Yes, that's exactly the point. These dorks that can't shoot and got their EZGM card in PCC never have a chance to win any hardware anymore when shooting a pistol. 

[MHicks]

They still have a chance to be division champ or high master in a pistol division. That's the price to shoot a rifle in a handgun match.

[outerlimits]

40 minutes ago, waktasz said:

Yes, that's exactly the point. These dorks that can't shoot and got their EZGM card in PCC never have a chance to win any hardware anymore when shooting a pistol. 

This^^^

[Racinready300ex]

3 hours ago, Boomstick303 said:

 

 

If a person is a GM in PCC and then ranked as an M in anything else is they have enough classifiers to be ranked, how does that affect anything in the big picture. 

 

I can think of one GM who's won a few sectionals in PCC and has said he'll probably never shoot handgun because he can't shoot one anywhere near M level. Big picture it probably doesn't matter but for him it does. I'm sure he's not the only one. 

 

I guess one way to look at it is it's a good way to keep participation up in PCC. 

[Boomstick303]

1 minute ago, Racinready300ex said:

I can think of one GM who's won a few sectionals in PCC and has said he'll probably never shoot handgun because he can't shoot one anywhere near M level.

 

That is a decision up to each individual.  What does the fact he is ranked as an M having anything to do with shooting pistols in competition in regards to the sport of USPSA or other shooters?  I think ego plays a big part in which division each individual continues to shoot.  They shoot what they shoot best because they want to finish as high as they can for any given match.  Sometimes for that division, sometimes for HOA, sometime both.  

 

Some people have a limited amount of time to be good at any one thing.  If people to not care to shoot multiple divisions, then their ranking in other divisions definitely does not matter.   If they shoot other divisions ranked at a higher classification than they can actually shoot what does it matter?  

 

To be honest, do most people actually shoot matches at the level of their classification on a consistent basis?  I would say no, they do not because the classification system is not a true test of how someone shoots in matches.  So in the end what is the difference?

[waktasz]

That's kind of a silly question because you know why it matters. 
If it didn't, there would be no reason for the classification system at all.

 

And I'd say yes, people generally shoot to their classification. Maybe not at the tippy top of the sport, but if you go to any local match, the GMs are beating the Ms who beat the As and so on, for the most part. 

[Racinready300ex]

 

33 minutes ago, Boomstick303 said:

 

That is a decision up to each individual.  What does the fact he is ranked as an M having anything to do with shooting pistols in competition in regards to the sport of USPSA or other shooters?  I think ego plays a big part in which division each individual continues to shoot.  They shoot what they shoot best because they want to finish as high as they can for any given match.  Sometimes for that division, sometimes for HOA, sometime both.  

 

Some people have a limited amount of time to be good at any one thing.  If people to not care to shoot multiple divisions, then their ranking in other divisions definitely does not matter.   If they shoot other divisions ranked at a higher classification than they can actually shoot what does it matter?  

 

To be honest, do most people actually shoot matches at the level of their classification on a consistent basis?  I would say no, they do not because the classification system is not a true test of how someone shoots in matches.  So in the end what is the difference?

 

I think waktasz summed it up pretty well. 

[GigG]

1 hour ago, Boomstick303 said:

 If they shoot other divisions ranked at a higher classification than they can actually shoot what does it matter?  

They won't when prizes in those other divisions.