Ron Ankeny Posted February 11, 2005 Share Posted February 11, 2005 I feel stupid. I suppose if the shoe fits wear it? This morning I knocked .2 off of my skinny gun reload after years of practice. Promise not to laugh? I was doing my morning dry fire and I remembered a virtual conversation I had in a thread a couple of years ago with Benos. Brian talked about clear intent and shifting mental focus. The light bulb came on. When practicing reloads I listen intently for the buzzer and go for the magazine release with my strong hand as I go for the spare mag with my left hand. I thought, "What if I listen for the buzzer with the intent of grabbing the spare magazine, let the release just happen, then shift my intent/mental focus to the insertion?" I had the par time set on 1.4 seconds (ok not TT but it doesn't exactly suck either). The buzzer went off and the gun was back on target with a fresh magazine with time to spare. I am not kidding, just changing my intent and thought process shaved .2 off of the reload with less "disaster factor". For a guy who has been hanging around this board for years, you would of thought I could have figured this out 100,000 mag changes ago. Slaps foehead, mumbles, fades away... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Merlin Orr Posted February 11, 2005 Share Posted February 11, 2005 Ron I have renewed hope. If you can - after thousands of reloads - have an epiphany and better your reloads by such a substantial margin ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loves2Shoot Posted February 11, 2005 Share Posted February 11, 2005 If you want a trick try this When you see your sight lift (or in dry fire, hear the buzzer) look at the mag you want to grab (gasp) Let me know how it goes for you I'm try to make my shooting 100% visual. And of course you don't "need" to look, but it doesn't take any more time and it gets the weakhand moving fast. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
diehli Posted February 11, 2005 Share Posted February 11, 2005 In a class with Voigt, here's a paraphrase of what he had to say about the reload: "You have two hands: the stupid one and the other one. Get the stupid hand to the mag as fast as humanly possible, then reload." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zen_grasshopper Posted February 11, 2005 Share Posted February 11, 2005 Hey! I just had this realization while I was in my office doing some reading. The magazine I was reading had TGO doing a reload and the magazine was falling out of the gun while the other hand was almost inserting a mag. For some reason it dawned on me that I was trying to release the mag before moving my stupid hand. I thought maybe I would drop my time if I moved my hand first and then hit the button. So I flushed and went to get my gear on. I just got done practicing with my Kimber with no funnel, and KY-TAC mag pouches and was beating my 1.5 sec par time. I am not the quickest person on the planet so that felt freaking fast! (Considering my old times were around 2 seconds, it felt like I was waiting for the mag to leave the gun before I moved to get the new mag) Feeling pretty good about my times, I haven't shot USPSA yet, but I think this summer I will be trying it out. With duty rig I am a bit slower, having to unbutton the snap seems to take forever! Jonathan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twix Posted February 11, 2005 Share Posted February 11, 2005 Hey! I just had this realization while I was in my office doing some reading. The magazine I was reading had TGO doing a reload and the magazine was falling out of the gun while the other hand was almost inserting a mag. For some reason it dawned on me that I was trying to release the mag before moving my stupid hand. I thought maybe I would drop my time if I moved my hand first and then hit the button. So I flushed and went to get my gear on. I just got done practicing with my Kimber with no funnel, and KY-TAC mag pouches and was beating my 1.5 sec par time. I am not the quickest person on the planet so that felt freaking fast! (Considering my old times were around 2 seconds, it felt like I was waiting for the mag to leave the gun before I moved to get the new mag) Feeling pretty good about my times, I haven't shot USPSA yet, but I think this summer I will be trying it out. With duty rig I am a bit slower, having to unbutton the snap seems to take forever! Jonathan "So I flushed and went to get my gear on." I love it when inspiration strikes. Seriously,thanks for the tips, I will try to move my stupid hand and let the smart hand obey at will. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eerw Posted February 11, 2005 Share Posted February 11, 2005 Slaps foehead, mumbles, fades away... Ron.. you give me hope.... (DRIFT) oh..did you hear about the match Weld CO is putting on..5 stage, 300 rounds..or something like that... (Drifting back) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
h4444 Posted February 12, 2005 Share Posted February 12, 2005 I had a similar "well duh" kind of moment not too long ago. Now, occasionally in dry fire I bump the old mag with the new one as I'm getting ready to insert it......Never came close to that before. My moment came as I was trying to figure out what was different about what I did versus a couple other guys locally. I just decided to "go faster" between pushing the mag button and approaching the magwell. H4444 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EricW Posted February 12, 2005 Share Posted February 12, 2005 Ron, I love this thread because there's so many simple things that we can (not) do that pay instant dividends. I did almost the thing last year. I was killing myself trying to do speedy shotgun reloads last summer. I simply could not make my time goals during dry fire. I discovered that I could drop an instant 0.5 sec or better off my reload by simply *not* rotating the shotgun with my strong hand. If I did all the rotation with my weak hand and focused my attention on diving with strong hand for the ammo, I suddenly was making my par time goals. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GRD Posted February 12, 2005 Share Posted February 12, 2005 Another awesome tip, Ron. And here I am stuck at work for the next 8 hours...gah. - Gabe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flexmoney Posted February 12, 2005 Share Posted February 12, 2005 It is amazing what we are capable of. Great job Ron. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
schmitz Posted February 17, 2005 Share Posted February 17, 2005 I was doing my morning dry fire and I remembered a virtual conversation I had in a thread a couple of years ago with Benos. Brian talked about clear intent and shifting mental focus. The light bulb came on. My guess: this is the way to go, like to shave a couple of tenths of my s*****g reload as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
benos Posted February 17, 2005 Share Posted February 17, 2005 How often does a "live" reload have anything to do with a buzzer? If you are practicing reloads with a timer, you could be wasting some of your attention by listening for the buzzer. Once you have the mechanics down, try practicing dry reloads like this: (No timer) Get into position, then clear your mind of everything. Then create and hold a mental image of what the mag well looks like as the new mag is coming toward it. Then - go! As time and the years go by, it may help to occasionally refresh your body and mind with how certain specific aspects of the reload look or feel. For example, once you've established the feeling of your right arm's final position, do some reloads with a one-pointed focus, but instead of holding the mental image of the mag well, hold a mental feeling of how your right arm feels when it's in perfect position and feeling perfectly still. (While it's waiting for the new mag.) As another alternative, only focus on how the new mag feels in your hand as your left grabs it perfectly. Find and isolate the key aspects of the reload then work with them one at a time. be Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pact-Man Posted February 23, 2005 Share Posted February 23, 2005 My head hurts- but I like it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TriggerT Posted February 23, 2005 Share Posted February 23, 2005 I am SO glad to hear Brian say not to use the "BEEP" to start your reload drills. I have done it both ways, and I find the buzzer to be distracting. I visualize the shot breaking, and the sprint into the reload. Often I will do this one mag after the other, working through the 4 mags on my belt. When I check my reloads durring practice I never seem to be less than 1.4. However, when I am shooting at a match I don't think about the reload as much as just let it happen. I haven't been able to check the times during matches, but when several M or GM shooters tell me that my reloads here or there were really smoking, I figure that is pretty good. By the way, this is always with a single stack. If your reload is "On" it shouldn't matter if it is a wide body or not. The mag should feel like it hasn't touched anything other than the mag release. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron Ankeny Posted February 23, 2005 Author Share Posted February 23, 2005 Thanks Brian. I practiced a few reloads this morning with my attention directed on the "perfect grab". Wow, what a difference. Listening for the buzzer (to start) followed by trying to beat the buzzer (par time) might be the conventional practice routine, but it pales in comparison. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
h4444 Posted February 24, 2005 Share Posted February 24, 2005 I quit using a timer a long time ago,,,,actually, I only used it a few times because I DID find myself focusing more on the timer than the skill I was trying to practice. H4444 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Catfish Posted February 24, 2005 Share Posted February 24, 2005 Excellent posts. I had the same sort of epiphany a few weeks ago watching the super squad video from the '03 nats. Watching TT's reloads were just eye popping. One thing I did notice mechanically was that TT holds the pistol up higher than I was. (note - was ) I was essentially keeping the front of the pistol i.e. the front sight covering the target as I brought the gun up towards my face to reload. TT seems to be covering (for lack of a better term) the target with the trigger - for me, this is a difference of several inches "up". I started practicing this and I'll be damned if it doesn't allow me to reload quicker and more smoothly. I think it has something to do with my head and eyes really aren't moving during the load, and bringing the mag well up to eye level, rather than slightly below. Frankly, I'm not sure why it's easier (mechanically) to reload like this, and I'm not sure if I care. But it works! And that's good enough. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
infinity Posted March 5, 2005 Share Posted March 5, 2005 IMHO, bragging aside...i was able to do consistent 1.3sec reloads with a timer but the problem is this...when i tried doing my drill in live fire it seemed that i can't do what i can do during dry practice..what do u guys think i need to do?! thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clay1 Posted March 5, 2005 Share Posted March 5, 2005 I can see practicing without the timer, but my perception of fast or slow and reality is substaintially different. So some practice with no buzzer and some with to verify that I am getting faster or to check my progression? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
j1b Posted March 5, 2005 Share Posted March 5, 2005 I've not ever practiced reloads with a timer so I can't speak to that. I believe most in this forum would echo that generally a live fire drill is a tad slower than a dry fire drill. Not always, but what you describe isn't unusual. So I was thinking about this thread some time ago and believe that each of these suggestions is "the trick of the day." I too have been focusing on the reload, specifically because I felt like I struggled with it last year so horribly. I started this year with some dry firing, then went to a match that I detailed in another post. Ironically, because I had no practice time in nor any real dry fire time invested, I was flying mostly on autopilot. It was a joy, and a lot of fun. I realized then that the best way for me to focus on my reload is to simply know when I want to do one, then do it. Having posted many times on the things that I see, or where the gun is, or any number of other things, I threw all that out and siad screw it - just stuff the mag in like you know how and go. To my great surprise - this worked. I still boof a few but that isn't a major rubbing point. It seems to be working great in dry fire as well. The point was made that in dry fire, if a timer isn't used, how do you mark progress? I still struggle with using a timer in dry fire to practice the reload specifically (I do however implement drills that utilize a reload. Today I have a drill that I draw and shoot two targets - my par time is about 1.3 or so. The next drill is to draw, punch the two then reload and hit them again. Par time 2.6) I think live fire is the true way to know you are making progress on the load. In dry fire, generally speaking, I think you know when you are hitting them smooth and when you aren't. I think inherently you know this. Like a draw, the specifics of what you need to improve on in the reload will not change with or without a timer. Even when you're like Jake and hitting .6 draws all the time, he's figuring out a way to hit .5 everytime. He (I think) goes through the same exercise of figuring out how he can pull time out of the draw be it at the gun, pulling up, acquisition etc. etc. This rule holds true for 2 second reloads as much as it does for .8 reloads. Hoping I am making some sense - if to nobody else then hopefully to myself JB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Interceptor Posted March 5, 2005 Share Posted March 5, 2005 The whole focusing on the off hand as you draw and reload got me thinking the other day. So yesterday when I was working at my department range to help run qualifications, I started experimenting. I carry a Glock 22 in a Safariland Raptor Level 3 duty holster. I have noticed that when I focus on "trying" to draw as fast as I can, I tend flub the draw by not rocking the weapon or fully disengaging the safety systems. So yesterday I told myself that I needed to just focus getting my off hand against my stomach as fast as possible and not think about what my gun hand was doing. I noticed an immediate speed and smoothness improvement in my draw. I was consistently outdrawing some of the detectives who carry open top plain-clothes rigs. It's like my gun hand knows exactly what to do if I just let it go to work, instead of forcing it. Oh well, not scientific, but certainly opened my eyes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
postal Posted March 20, 2005 Share Posted March 20, 2005 I practice dry ,no timer ,then when doing live fire ,I use a timer ,but draw fire one shot ,reload fire second shot use the split time for the reload time ,I feel this is the most accurate at actually getting the correct time of the reload I use this on retention/tactical reloads with full mags Then on slide lock I load one round in the first mag If you prefer you can use two rounds in the first mag since some competitions allow you to change with one in the pipe ,but what ever you choose keep it consistent ,and write it down Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeeper Posted March 24, 2005 Share Posted March 24, 2005 Ron, If I see you at a match I owe you a beer. I was in the middle of a break from doing dryfire when I read your post. I went right back to it afterwards and nocked .2 off my par time with no effort. I guess getting the stupid hand moving really is the key. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
benos Posted March 25, 2005 Share Posted March 25, 2005 Us old-schoolers learned to reload quickly without ever using a timer because there weren't no timers back then. I'm even gonna say that not only do you not need a timer to learn to reload quickly, but that using one might be a hindrance. So if you wanted to learn to reload quickly but didn't have a timer, how would you apply your attention? Even though you must become a master of efficiency... sometimes the reload's speed is determined by the amount of decisiveness present at the beginning. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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