Reloading for CZ's. 124's a Myth?

[Smitty79]

I have heard from the old guy at the range, who owns 7 CZ's, and I have seen in several forums that CZ's are most accurate with 124 grain bullets. Myth or fact? When I look at the bullets Matt Mink sells for competition, I think I should go heavier to start. I have shot his Berry's 147's. My favorite ammo so far. Just a touch better than his BBI 135's.

My new year's resolution is to start reloading and I am thinking about what bullet's to work up first. Current plan is BBI 147s.

I have a modified CZ85. My son has a stock 75 and an SP01 Shadow Target. If I work up a good load for my gun, should I expect it to be good in both of his?

[burningsquirrels]

Anything between 124 to 135ish seems popular. plus or minus a few grains won't turn anyone into matt mink IMO.... lol

so far i have loaded shorter in general at 1.090" OAL with a truncated cone or RN profile bullet. Has worked in several race guns, compacts, and all my friends' CZs no problem. YMMV.

[burningsquirrels]

oh, as for accuracy. i haven't noted any differences between a lot of different bullets, other than a change in the point of impact, usually requiring a different front sight height or an adjustable rear. The heavier the bullet, the higher or lower it hit, i can't remember which way it goes. i found that the 124-125 range is dead on with the factory tactical or competition rear sights and the dawson plain black front sight. there's a thread i started a while back on it that has the measurements.

Edited December 2, 2013 by burningsquirrels

[Czhase]

I have used 147s and 125s in SP 01 both work fine. I have noticed that the CZs seem to have short chambers.

[BeerBaron]

I personally like 125gn pills in my CZ 75 SP01 Shadow. I find shooting them at around 1050 fps for a power factor around 130 is a nice load. I've also shot quite a lot of 135gn round nose at around 950 fps and quite like that load too. and just to through a spanner in I've also shot a 120gn at 1070fps for about 128 PF and it was quite good too.

all were using the same powder (an australian made powder made by ADI called AP50 - it's a moderately fast burning pistol powder) but different loads. between about 3.3gn for the heaviest pill and 3.7gn for the lightest.

my findings where the lighter pills shot faster gave more recoil back into the hand but the gun cycled a little faster and muzzle lift was not much at all. the heavier pill shot slower had less recoil into the hand but a little more muzzle lift and of course cycled a touch slower.

between the heaviest and lightest and fastest and slowest there is not a massive difference. I have not tried the really heavy 147gn stuff which seems to be popular in the US in 9mm production guns. It's rarely used here in aus. most guys I see are using either 125gn or 135gn pills.

as far as types go they are all cast lead pills coated with the hy-tek polymer type coating. I use a 125gn semi wadcutter which has no lube groove, flat base and is slightly oversize at .3565. They shoot nicely with a large bearing surface and the flat base helps with accuracy too I believe. I also shoot 135gn round nose, 120 semi-wads, and 124gn round nose CMJs.

OAL is important and does tend to change POI etc. In the shadow I find 1.080 and as short as 1.060 is just fine (just make sure they feed ok). if going long I never go longer than 1.100 in my shadow. They like the short stuff.

I say load up some of the 147gn at 880fps and load up some 124gn at 1040fps. so you're going to both ends of the scale. Try them back to back. compare POI. compare group size and most importantly see which ones YOU like to shoot. Then once you've chosen your favourite weight, load some at 1.060, 1.070, 1.080 and go up to 1.100 if you want. see what OAL does to the accuracy. once you've chosen your OAL and crimp (try some with 'light', 'med' and 'heavy' crimp) then re-chrono to check they still make a comfortable PF.

Then load up a bunch and enjoy.

I do tend to agree with burningsquirrels. The different weights are no more or less accurate. just shoot flatter or not. changes POI a bit. different deisigns may group tighter though. like flat base vs bevel base. lube groove vs no groove. stuff like that. just have a little play.

[Neomet]

147s are lightweights. LOL My most accurate load is with Bayou 160s.

[burningsquirrels]

YMMV, load at your own risk.

1.090" OAL

mixed brass

federal small pistol primers

4.05 to 4.1 grains Hogdgon Titegroup

very light crimp

Bullets:

xtreme 124 plated

montana gold 124 jhp

montana gold 124 cmj

mid atlantic 125 lead

bbi 125 RN moly

precision 125 cone moly

zero 125 rounded jhp

zero 125 cone jhp

zero 125 cone cmj

rainier 125(?) cmj

bayou 125 moly

set up my press with a seat die that nets about 1.090", and i usually don't adjust it between different bullets. seems to work fine with no adjustments.

chrono is usually 136-138 on the dot all year round. the higher PF means i never worry (went to the chrono more than a dozen times one year at majors) and also works great on big steel that needs extra oomph.

also helps keep me awake while i shoot.

[burningsquirrels]

also, no significant known accuracy differences found between the bullets.

Edited December 2, 2013 by burningsquirrels

[eric nielsen]

I read Gerard's posts on OAL and use the same, also no problems at all. I use Precision Delta 124 JHP's with N320 powder.

At the practice range I can fill a 19-round CZ magazine and blast it all into one target at 15 yards nonstop. I can't do this with any 40-cal ammo that makes Major in my STI.

Tried other bullets with the 9mm Shadow all at around 138 power factor, see no significant difference in controllability, minor differences in the accuracy, major differences in the amount of smoke, so 124 JHP's for me.

Edited December 2, 2013 by eric nielsen

[Carnifex]

I use BBI 125s with N320. I tried some 147s but found them less accurate and I didn't like the feel. I'm sure if I took my time tuning the load the 147s could be just as accurate as the 125s. I found the 125s flatter, faster, and snappier. I prefer them.

[poopshooter]

147 grain ibejiheads.com 3.3 grains of N320

I tried all the different weights and settled on these, I’ve burned about 30k with great satisfaction

[CDPMatt]

Pretty sure Mink's loads are Xtreme plated, not Berry's.

He likes the 135's, I like his 147's. 124's shoot well too. Find one that shoots well in your gun.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[gose]

Tried a few different 147s and a couple of different VV powders, but never got results as good as with 115s and 124s.

Pretty much same story for my Tac Sports, Czechmate and SP01s.

[pmt]

YMMV, load at your own risk.

1.090" OAL

mixed brass

federal small pistol primers

4.05 to 4.1 grains Hogdgon Titegroup

very light crimp

Bullets:

xtreme 124 plated

montana gold 124 jhp

montana gold 124 cmj

mid atlantic 125 lead

bbi 125 RN moly

precision 125 cone moly

zero 125 rounded jhp

zero 125 cone jhp

zero 125 cone cmj

rainier 125(?) cmj

bayou 125 moly

set up my press with a seat die that nets about 1.090", and i usually don't adjust it between different bullets. seems to work fine with no adjustments.

chrono is usually 136-138 on the dot all year round. the higher PF means i never worry (went to the chrono more than a dozen times one year at majors) and also works great on big steel that needs extra oomph.

also helps keep me awake while i shoot.

4.0 - 4.1 gr Titegroup with any 124ish gr bullet is a very common load for a lot of 9mm pistols. I use the same in my H&K USP and it works well my friends Glock 17.

[rowdyb]

Well I have a 75B converted to SAO coming and plan on shooting 147 gr xtreme round nose, 3.1 titegroup with an overall length of 1.150 which seems a much longer oal that everyone else is posting.....

Should I expect issues? This round works awesome in my tuned G34, but do you think i need to go shorter for reliable function in the CZ75B?

[Magsz]

Drop test your barrel and see what the longest you can get away with is.

None of the CZ's ive run into will run rounds that long but my sample size is only four guns.

[frankie]

Every CZ that I've had needed shorter oal. without exception they were all short chambered.

[Neomet]

Don't forget that bullet ogive has a huge impact on what OAL you can run. A blanket "no more than X" for everything just doesn't work. I run 121/124 MGs at 1.100 and I doubt I could go much further. My 160s have a very different profile and I run them at 1.160. The only way you can tell for sure is to test until the length doesn't work. The exception to this are the Tac Sports where the limiting dimension is the magazine which will not handle bullet lengths much if at all beyond 1.135.

[Andreas]

Every CZ that I've had needed shorter oal. without exception they were all short chambered.

A couple seconds with a throating reamer will solve that.

[RaylanGivens]

147s are lightweights. LOL My most accurate load is with Bayou 160s.

What OAL are you using with Bayou 160's in your CZ?

I'm currently using Bayou 160's in my Glock 34... CZ 75 SP-01 Shadow coming soon... Wondering whether to stick with the 160's or switch to the Bayou RN 135gr...

[Neomet]

147s are lightweights. LOL My most accurate load is with Bayou 160s.

What OAL are you using with Bayou 160's in your CZ?

I'm currently using Bayou 160's in my Glock 34... CZ 75 SP-01 Shadow coming soon... Wondering whether to stick with the 160's or switch to the Bayou RN 135gr...

1.160. Because of the ogive you can run these longer than other projectiles. The normal caveats. Make sure it works in your gun. Look both ways before crossing the street. Not responsible for injury or global warming for following what I do.

[MickB]

I run Precision Delta 124gr at 1.15" OAL and have no issues....

Mick

[RaylanGivens]

147s are lightweights. LOL My most accurate load is with Bayou 160s.

What OAL are you using with Bayou 160's in your CZ?

I'm currently using Bayou 160's in my Glock 34... CZ 75 SP-01 Shadow coming soon... Wondering whether to stick with the 160's or switch to the Bayou RN 135gr...

1.160. Because of the ogive you can run these longer than other projectiles. The normal caveats. Make sure it works in your gun. Look both ways before crossing the street. Not responsible for injury or global warming for following what I do.

Thanks!

I've been loading them to 1.155 for my Glock. Was curious if they would shoot in my new CZ.

[RaylanGivens]

Thanks!

I've been loading them to 1.155 for my Glock. Was curious if they would shoot in my new CZ.

I can now answer that question... Shot 100 of my Bayou 160gr 1.155 OAL rounds out of my new CZ 75 SP-01 Shadow this afternoon. All 100 cycled the gun correctly with no issues. Used the OEM magazines and the nickel plated 17 round magazines from Automatic Accuracy - both magazines worked perfectly.

[Laughingdog]

regarding bullet length for CZs, I have an SP-01, and did some drop testing with various bullets I have on hand.

For Berry's plated flat-point, I have to load down to 1.040" for it to drop free from the barrel (i.e., lands aren't engaged). Granted, loaded that small, I get horrendous issues with misfeeds.

For Bayou Bullets 124g and 135g RN (same coating as BBI, but different profile), I can load these to 1.160" with no problems.

For Bayou Bullets 147g (similar to BBI 147g profile, but Bayou looks like a slightly smaller flat-point), I had to get down to 1.140" for them to drop free.

I've also dropped in various range pick-up ammo I've gotten from working matches. Every RN profile I've tried works fine at the 1.150"-1.160" OAL range. But truncated cones just don't play nice with the barrel at all.