USPSA edicate question

[Sandbagger123]

i was at a match and a newish shooter came up to me with a frown on his face. He told me he got a ass chewing for doing something wrong.

Apparently he went to the next stage over to watch another squad, and proceeded to walk and airgun the course while the squad was still there. One of the people noticed an informed him that its was not proper unless he was helping tape. according to that person, he was told that it could also be considered unsportsmanship like conduct, and could be DQ'ed for what he did.

So any truth to what he was told?

Edited September 18, 2013 by Sandbagger123

[yoshidaex]

It's called common ipsc etiquette.

You wait till the squad ahead of you is finished. Once they're done and you get the stage briefing you'll get your 5 minutes.

It's rude to your squad mates if you don't stay with your squad to help with resetting the stage.

Not sure about the USLC if the shooter is a noob but if he's a regular and continues to do it, I'm sure the md/rm/RO/Cro will claim USLC and issue a DQ

Edited September 18, 2013 by yoshidaex

[Maksim]

I know in IPSC they really follow it, in USPSA I would think it is common sense and etiquette.

Think of it this way, it is a volunteer sport, and the whole squad is there together to help keep it running together. It is a lack of respect when you shoot your stage, ditch your stage and squad and go over to check out next stage. Even more fu'ish is slowing down another squad while you are air gunning the stage while the squad ahead is still shooting.

Typically it is new people who just don't know better and if you explain it once, they are ok with it. Although there are always a few constant people who leave their squad to go get a few extra minutes and check out the squad ahead of you shoot the stage.

[Flatland Shooter]

Breach of etiquette, YES.

But a DQ?

That would take a real hard a** of a match official to try to pull that off. And once word got around, I wouldn't be the only one striking that match off my competition calendar.

The DQ is a tool to be used to keep our matches safe and fair. Let's keep it that way.

JMHO.

Bill

[Maksim]

Breach of etiquette, YES.

But a DQ?

That would take a real hard a** of a match official to try to pull that off. And once word got around, I wouldn't be the only one striking that match off my competition calendar.

The DQ is a tool to be used to keep our matches safe and fair. Let's keep it that way.

JMHO.

Bill

What if you had a person do that 3 or 4 times after you repeatedly told them yourself, plus countless other people?

[Flatland Shooter]

Breach of etiquette, YES.

But a DQ?

That would take a real hard a** of a match official to try to pull that off. And once word got around, I wouldn't be the only one striking that match off my competition calendar.

The DQ is a tool to be used to keep our matches safe and fair. Let's keep it that way.

JMHO.

Bill

What if you had a person do that 3 or 4 times after you repeatedly told them yourself, plus countless other people?

Do like the Amish. Try shunning.

If you have someone that cannot accept the rules and etiquette of the game, suggest they find a new game. Or go the peer pressure route. We had problems with a foul mouth competitor that just could not behave himself around others. It was made clear that his future attendance would not be permitted if he couldn't play well with others. He took the hint and did not return. I think he decided to try IDPA.

[sperman]

Breach of etiquette, YES.

But a DQ?

That would take a real hard a** of a match official to try to pull that off. And once word got around, I wouldn't be the only one striking that match off my competition calendar.

The DQ is a tool to be used to keep our matches safe and fair. Let's keep it that way.

JMHO.

Bill

What if you had a person do that 3 or 4 times after you repeatedly told them yourself, plus countless other people?

IMO, that's when 10.6.1 comes into play: "failing to comply with the reasonable directions of a Match Official," and 10.6.2 "interference with the operation of a course of fire"

If it is a new guy, then he should understand when the CRO explains the situation. If he continues to interrupt the squad on the COF, after repeated warnings, then he deserves the DQ. There is nothing unreasonable about expecting a shooter to stay off the course if they aren't on the squad shooting the stage. Like others have said, it is only common courtesy. He will have his 5 minutes when his squad arrives. Until then, stay off the stage. (No, you don't get a pass if you help paste. You stay off the stage until the squad ahead of you is done.)

[vluc]

Agreed he should not be doing it. New shooter - nobody bothering to show him the ropes, introduce themselves to him or take some responsibilities? Reference the shooting with better shooters thread - if all of us just choose to shoot with better shooters all the time and not work with newbies, how do we grow the sport? Certainly he failed, but so did we as fellow shooters.

[Gary Stevens]

Agreed he should not be doing it. New shooter - nobody bothering to show him the ropes, introduce themselves to him or take some responsibilities? Reference the shooting with better shooters thread - if all of us just choose to shoot with better shooters all the time and not work with newbies, how do we grow the sport? Certainly he failed, but so did we as fellow shooters.

Vince there you go with that common sense thing again. When are you going to learn?

Edited September 18, 2013 by Gary Stevens

[Atlgentlegiant]

I have seen some form of this from experienced shooters as well. There always seem to be some who believe that they are so important that they cannot be bothered to help reset the stage but instead as soon as they shoot it is off to watch another squad on the stage next door. They typically do not jump in and start walking the stage but they do leave their squad behind.

In this case it appears the butt chewing had the desired effect. I am not sure I would have brought up USLC and DQ with a new shooter but definitely would have used it as a "coaching opportunity".

[High Lord Gomer]

There is this but it does no specify any penalty for breaking it:

8.7.3 No person is permitted to enter or move through a course of fire without the prior approval of a Range Officer assigned to that course of fire or the Range Master.

[vluc]

Agreed he should not be doing it. New shooter - nobody bothering to show him the ropes, introduce themselves to him or take some responsibilities? Reference the shooting with better shooters thread - if all of us just choose to shoot with better shooters all the time and not work with newbies, how do we grow the sport? Certainly he failed, but so did we as fellow shooters.

Vince there you go with that common sense thing again. When are you going to learn?

Hopefully never, Gary. Hopefully never.

[JAFO]

I mostly see people looking ahead if the next stage is complicated and they want to see how other the squad ran it.

As far as an on-deck squad starting to walk through while we're still taping/resetting and we still have shooters remaining, we politely ask them to get the hell off the stage until we're through.

[Flexmoney]

Agreed he should not be doing it. New shooter - nobody bothering to show him the ropes, introduce themselves to him or take some responsibilities? Reference the shooting with better shooters thread - if all of us just choose to shoot with better shooters all the time and not work with newbies, how do we grow the sport? Certainly he failed, but so did we as fellow shooters.

Vince there you go with that common sense thing again. When are you going to learn?

+1

Well said, Vluc

[lawboy]

Taking a quick look at the next stage is not necessarily a big deal. I do it. I challenge anybody to accuse me of not working the stage with my crew. I R.O., design stages, build stages, donate props to the club, show up for clean up day and prop. construction days, serve as MD ... If I want to peep my head over to the next bay for two minutes to see the stage I will and do. I DO NOT get on the stage to airgun or for any reason. I stay at the rear of the bay and look. In my opinion, where the new shooter went wrong was interfering with the squad that currently was operating on the bay. That is a no-no.

Looking at the stage, big deal. Hell, you can do that on your way to and from the rest room, stats shack, or hot dog vendor. People should lighten up on that one.

[Nimitz]

Agreed. If for some reason i want to look at the next stage I do it after we're done pasting and while the next shooter is getting ready and shooting. Once he's done I'm back helping paste again. Don't see anything wrong with that as long as you're just looking from the back and meeting you responsibilities with your squad.

[walter hornby]

In IPSC the rule is 8.7.3 No person is permitted to enter or move through a course of fire without the prior approval of a Range

Officer assigned to that course of fire, or the Range Master. Violations will incur a warning for the first

offence but may be subject to the provisions of Section 10.6 for subsequent offences.

As an match official i enforce it pretty religiously as i don't like to see other people horn in on a squads time or on an individual shooters prep time.

The USPSA rule is 8.7.3 No person is permitted to enter or move through a course of fire without the prior approval of a Range Officer assigned to that course of fire

or the Range Master. No mention of a DQ in USPSA.