Is the Lee product as bad as they say?

[TimBoettcher]

In my experiences, you get what you pay for. I had a Lee Turret for about 2 months and was directed to the Dillon world, never looked back!

[98006]

I have 3 lees. a lm that i load 9 and 40 and a pro 1k for 45 Acp. And last a single stage Lee. I don't have any problems with the 45 pro 1k. pumps ammo out consistantly. The LM works perfect in 40 SW. I have had some problems with the 9mm which I have figured out might be caused by Lee having 1 plate,the 19s to be used for both 9 and 40. It allows 9mm,because 9mm brass,in my experience varies so much, to move around too much. this allows brass with very tight pockets to get crooked occasionally. My fix for that was to add a 9mm sizing die,without the stem to the open hole where the primer stage is. This holds the brass straight and not allowing any lateral movement while priming.

I have found since doing this that it will even prime crimped brass. Also, they need to be mounted on solid,no movement benches.

I loaded thousand of round through my Lee's with only these few problems. Would like to try a Dillion,but have never found the need to spend that kind of money

Edited January 25, 2011 by 98006

[midvalleyshooter]

In the early nineties I had a Lee Pro 1000. I started loading .38 Special and it worked pretty good for that. Then I did .45 ACP and 9mm and discovered you really need a 4th station for a separate crimp operation. I labored on with the Pro 1000 though. Until I started loading 9x21 for my EAA race gun. This brass was HARD to resize and I ended up breaking the soft main casting that held the shell plate! No problem though because I had picked up a couple of used pro 1000's for $25 dollars each:)

Then I got a Dillon 550 and eventually a 1050.

Dillon is the best:)

Keith

[briansea2]

I must be 1 of very few that is happy with the lee loadmaster. It gets me about 600 an hour in .40 or 9. I do resize in the same station as the prime stage so it is always aligned. Sometimes I can only do 450 because I screw up. It is a good press for the money but I need about 4 times the output now I shoot open Still a good press. Takes about 5 min to switch between 40 and 9 and when I want to do 223 well that takes about 7 min to get it ready.

[Bob DuBois]

I've had good luck with Lee dies in fact have replace several Dillon dies with Lee. The only Lee Press I've owned was a Pro 1000. One of the best feeling I've had was when it went down the driveway with a new owner. It was set up in 223 and I spent way more time unjamming it that I did loading on it.

I like the decapping pin in the Lee sizer, more times than not it will push up and not break if there's something in a case. Think I've broken two in the last ten years and many thousands of rounds. I'm loading on a 550 so the hands on brass is a plus, you'll usually see a problem before it hit's the shell plate. I'll check brass by rolling it on a white plastic tray to check for problems, cracked brass, bent cases, rocks in cases etc. before loading.

The Lee U die will let range brass run through my 40S@W Limited guns when a Dillon die would wouldn't clear Glocked brass.

It sizes closer to the extractor groove than Dillon. I've seen the U die solve feeding issues in many 40 limited pistols and a friends nine major open gun, it works.

Another plus for Lee is the bulge buster, I found this week that I could use the Lee powder through die with the bulge buster attachment and re-size the rim on 38 Super. I've only done about 600, took about two hours and I was checking them regularly. While many wouldn't spend the time a lot of my Super brass was old and it loaded much easier after sizing. This is not something I would do at every loading session but it did bring new life back some old brass for very little money spent. I just purchased the bulge buster and haven't tried on any other calibers yet and used an old single stage press for the process.

[Alvarez Kelly]

Well, I can say I love their dies. Also, the basic presses work fine. They are good value for an entry level reloading set-up. That said, I'd never give up my Dillon presses for their sheer speed and corensponding volume. The Lee and Dillon presses are in two different worlds. Kinda depends on what your needs are...

[lvipscshooter]

I started with the Lee 4-Hole Classic Turret press. Loaded @ 20k rounds on it the 1st year I had it. Absolutely nothing wrong with that press at all, aside from a max of @ 200 rounds in an hour. I now have a Hornady LNL AP with a case feeder, allowing me to run @ 600 in an hour. If I didn't need the volume, I'd still have the Lee. It has found a new home on a friends loading bench and is still running strong

[Mike_Kerr]

I agree with Alvarez Kelly. I really like Lee dies. Lee's simple presses and equipment are great for the new reloader or low volume reloading. However their progressives can not compare to Dillon's or Hornady's. They just can't.

Regards,

[Kyreb]

I am a die hard blue fan but i have kept at least one Lee single stage press mounted on my bench for 20+ years. Never has a problem sizing up to .444 Marlin brass. They are quite handy for small jobs or precision work.

[wmspdi]

I have been loading on a Lee Pro 1000 for about 20 years. The only problems I had were when I was using RCBS dies from my old RCBS Jr single stage press. Now all of my dies are Lee and the 1000 runs like a well tuned race car for me. I tear it down once a year to clean and lube it. Caliber switch overs are quick and easy for me. I keep an eye on the primer feeder and give it a little tap every 6 or 7 rounds (out of habit) so I don't have any misprimed shells. I don't use an automatic bullet feeder as I prefer to visually check each powder charge and place the bullet on the case. I load 6 different calibers on the Lee 1000. It's not as fast as a Dillion but I just never saw the need to drink the $$$ blue Kool-Aid. I never had any problems with the Lee, and I wasn't looking to impress anyone, so why change. Maybe I just got a good one.

[sonicslam]

The short answer is: YES.

Buy what you want, but lower your expectations GREATLY if you expect ANY Lee product to compete with its market equivelent.

Buyer Beware.

[98sr20ve]

I started with the Lee 4-Hole Classic Turret press. Loaded @ 20k rounds on it the 1st year I had it. Absolutely nothing wrong with that press at all, aside from a max of @ 200 rounds in an hour. I now have a Hornady LNL AP with a case feeder, allowing me to run @ 600 in an hour. If I didn't need the volume, I'd still have the Lee. It has found a new home on a friends loading bench and is still running strong

Lee Classic Turret is a great press. I sold mine for the same reason as you. I should have kept it. Bought a 1050 3 years ago when I had the money. Kept the LCT for all the other calibers I barely shoot.

For the record the Classic Turret is much nicer then Lees regular turret. Feels like a mini 550 in some ways.

Edited February 25, 2011 by 98sr20ve

[Jman]

I started with the Lee 4-Hole Classic Turret press. Loaded @ 20k rounds on it the 1st year I had it. Absolutely nothing wrong with that press at all, aside from a max of @ 200 rounds in an hour. I now have a Hornady LNL AP with a case feeder, allowing me to run @ 600 in an hour. If I didn't need the volume, I'd still have the Lee. It has found a new home on a friends loading bench and is still running strong

Lee Classic Turret is a great press. I sold mine for the same reason as you. I should have kept it. Bought a 1050 3 years ago when I had the money. Kept the LCT for all the other calibers I barely shoot.

For the record the Classic Turret is much nicer then Lees regular turret. Feels like a mini 550 in some ways.

I load the occasional .40 S&W and .223 on mine to this day. Great press, especially for my rifle ammo.

[Vermont John]

The Lee product is not as bad as they say and many who own them love them. I have two Lee Pro 1000s. One was my first progressive. I have to say that they are a good value for the money. You have to adjust the indexing properly, and blow out the mechanism once is a while if drift from inside your brass gets in it, but they work. The Pro 1000 is clearly for pistol, though they say you can reload .223. Consider this: you get a Lee Pro 1000 with all the dies and a case feeder for about $170 on Midway. That same setup puts you around $700 with other presses. The other presses are nice - don't get me wrong. The Lee is a great value for most pistol shooters given the volume that they reload.

[StaTiK]

Buy what you want, but lower your expectations GREATLY if you expect ANY Lee product to compete with its market equivelent.

Buyer Beware.

That's exactly the point, there really isn't a market equivalent to a Lee progressive. A P1K is $150, a Loadmaster $220... both complete with dies and case feeders. Of course Dillon presses are better made, but they are also 4x the cost. I think the argument is whether "good enough" fits your personal circumstance, or whether you're willing to pay more for a more enjoyable reloading experience.

That said I've seen several people content with their Lee having never owned a blue press, but I've never seen anyone actually get rid of their Dillon press for a Lee.

-StaTiK-

[sonicslam]

Buy what you want, but lower your expectations GREATLY if you expect ANY Lee product to compete with its market equivelent.

Buyer Beware.

That's exactly the point, there really isn't a market equivalent to a Lee progressive. A P1K is $150, a Loadmaster $220... both complete with dies and case feeders. Of course Dillon presses are better made, but they are also 4x the cost. I think the argument is whether "good enough" fits your personal circumstance, or whether you're willing to pay more for a more enjoyable reloading experience.

That said I've seen several people content with their Lee having never owned a blue press, but I've never seen anyone actually get rid of their Dillon press for a Lee.

-StaTiK-

You are making my points for me. Even though the Lee is cheaper, it is a 5 station, auto indexing progressive. It has market contemporaries. That would be the Dillon 650 and the LnL AP. Don't look at purchase price as a starting point. The Dillon or Hornady will blow the doors off the Lee any day. So while you are trying to get the loadmaster to feed primers, the rest of us will be out shooting. After 5 years of service, you will still have a loadmaster. Never look at purchase price to make a decision.

Edited April 7, 2011 by sonicslam

[BBBB]

My experience has been that Lee comes out with some innovative and inexpensive solutions for simpler things like the FCD, or the bulge buster kit, or bullet sizing dies, etc. These items seem to have a market and most people seem to say good things about them. I have used some of these items myself and found them to be a good solution to a particular problem or situation.

When it comes to building a reliable progressive press my experience has been very negative with Lee. I got into reloading back in 91 or 92. Back then there was no 650. A 1050 was well above my price point so I was comparing the 550B to the then fairly new load master. Some of you may remember Lee and Dillon having a sort of public debate in the gun press about the merits of their product compared to the other's. I didn't know anyone that had a progressive reloader and make a purchase purely on what I read. At the time the Lee seemed to be a less expensive option with more features (e.g. - auto indexing, case feeding). I bought the Lee.

I fiddled with it for a couple of weeks. I made several calls to both the factory and the dealer I bought it from. After all of this I had managed to load only 3 or 4 rounds. I had reached a point where I knew I would never be happy with it and tried to send it back. The dealer was pretty unhappy about it. In the end we agreed that he would take it back but I would pay a 20% restocking fee. I took the 80% added whatever else I needed and bought a 550B. It was obvious from the start that Dillon machine was of a superior design and construction. I was able to set it up using the manual in a short time and start loading. I used it for a long time before ever having to call the factory. When I did call the factory the person that answered the phone actually understood how the machine worked and was able to help.

Is it perfect? No. Certainly not. I've had a few problems over the years but have generally been able to get very good support when needed. The warranty is also better than any I have seen whether the product is shooting related or not.

I was going to write that it's a case of getting what you paid for. Actually I think if you buy the Lee you probably get what you paid for. If you buy the Dillon I think the equipment is worth what you pay for it. If you consider the support and warranty that is included I think you get more than what you paid for.

Edited April 8, 2011 by BBBB

[NuJudge]

I have little experience with Dillon products, but a good bit on RCBS and Lee progressives, and a lot on single stage machines. I load match ammo on a single stage, and progressive for everything else.

A lot of people have noted that the problems with the Lee Pro1000 are 3-holes for dies, and the priming system. The problem with the LoadMaster is just the priming system. The directions from Lee on setup and dealing with problems are inadequate. There is a website that will walk you through problems on a LoadMaster:

http://forums.loadmastervideos.com/forums/index.php?sid=2150e52faa883f3e058da738cd9355c8

They have a group of YouTube videos that are also very helpful:

http://loadmastervideos.com/

The Lee priming systems problems can be dealt with. Firm mounting, clean everything regularly, smooth motion through the entire arc, appropriate lubrication, and watch everything (especially powder charges, primers dropping and the decap pin). Task lighting is very helpful.

I shoot a lot of cast bullets, and the bullet lubricant building up in a progressive seating die is a real problem. The Dillon pistol caliber seating die, which allows disassembly without losing adjustment, is a really nifty thing that every cast bullet pistol shooter should have.

[roadapple]

I have a Lee Auto Prime that is so old that the plastic has yellowed. It still works fine. I have a Lee Safety Powder Scale, a Lee Handpress, Lee powder scoops, Lee dies, and a Lee Challenger Breech-Lock. All are serviceable, and still in use. I had problems with the Lee 1000 a long while back. My progressives now are a Hornady LnL, and a Dillon RL550b. It took a while to work the bugs out of the LnL. The Dillon has worked just fine since the day Fed Ex brought it to my door. If I had to do it all over again, I would buy a 550 and probably not even try any other brands. The Dillon really is that good. I am not going to say anything bad about Lee products. A lot of people get into reloading because of Lee's affordability. Lee has also been very inovative, and has come up with some clever products. If they were as bad as some people claim, they would no longer be in business.

[sonicslam]

I have a Lee Auto Prime that is so old that the plastic has yellowed. It still works fine. I have a Lee Safety Powder Scale, a Lee Handpress, Lee powder scoops, Lee dies, and a Lee Challenger Breech-Lock. All are serviceable, and still in use. I had problems with the Lee 1000 a long while back. My progressives now are a Hornady LnL, and a Dillon RL550b. It took a while to work the bugs out of the LnL. The Dillon has worked just fine since the day Fed Ex brought it to my door. If I had to do it all over again, I would buy a 550 and probably not even try any other brands. The Dillon really is that good. I am not going to say anything bad about Lee products. A lot of people get into reloading because of Lee's affordability. Lee has also been very inovative, and has come up with some clever products. If they were as bad as some people claim, they would no longer be in business.

You said you had "bugs" with the LnL that took a while to work out. Mind saying what the bugs were. I know I'm interested.

Thanks

[roadapple]

I have a Lee Auto Prime that is so old that the plastic has yellowed. It still works fine. I have a Lee Safety Powder Scale, a Lee Handpress, Lee powder scoops, Lee dies, and a Lee Challenger Breech-Lock. All are serviceable, and still in use. I had problems with the Lee 1000 a long while back. My progressives now are a Hornady LnL, and a Dillon RL550b. It took a while to work the bugs out of the LnL. The Dillon has worked just fine since the day Fed Ex brought it to my door. If I had to do it all over again, I would buy a 550 and probably not even try any other brands. The Dillon really is that good. I am not going to say anything bad about Lee products. A lot of people get into reloading because of Lee's affordability. Lee has also been very inovative, and has come up with some clever products. If they were as bad as some people claim, they would no longer be in business.

You said you had "bugs" with the LnL that took a while to work out. Mind saying what the bugs were. I know I'm interested.

Thanks

The LnL did not seat the primers flush. I researched the LnL before I bought it. Most of the information I found was Blue vs. Red stuff. High primers were reported, but no more than Dillon. I found the rest of the posts (high primers) after I bought the press, and had the same problem. The problem occured with both large, and small primers, with different shellplates. The "fixes" I found was anything from glueing a coin to the frame, to changing out the subplate. I did it all. Hornady was good about sending parts at no charge. They sent new primer-ram assemblys, and a new subplate. None of this worked. Most of Hornady's techs were patient and courteous, but one of the techs told me that he had never heard of that problem before. I doubt that, because I found posts about high primers going back to 2006. I finally fixed the problem. The LnL will finally seat the primers flush, but not below flush. I tried the loads at the range, and all function just fine. The "fix" was adjusting the timing, and more important, replacing the case retention spring. The original spring had a very small kink in it. It was so small, I did not think it would cause a problem. The last Hornady tech I spoke to was the one that suggested the spring. He said the springs are sometimes too tight, causing the case to tip ever so slightly. I also had to press a .38 Special case onto the adjustable rod that actuates the case-feeder pivot block. The rod was too short, and would not move the pivot block enough to drop a case. This was adjusted all the way out. The 38 case made the rod long enough to do it's job, and provide additional adjustment. I became very frustrated trying to rectify the high primer problem, and purchased a Dillon RL550b from Brian. There may be some "Blue snobbery" out there, but I loaded over 100 rounds after I set the 550 and had no problems. I have some friends that have, and recommend, the Dillon 550. I have found that I can actually load faster on the 550, than I can on the LnL, and the LnL has a case-feeder. There are a lot of people out there that swear by the LnL. They report no problems at all. I still use mine. Right now, I have the LnL configured for small primers, and the 550 configured for large primers. One last thing: The LnL had to be taken apart and cleaned with a solavent to remove the anti-rust oil applied at the factory. I used the Hornady One Shot, as was recommended by the factory. I went through two cans of it, at $8.00 per can. I used the One Shot to clean all of my new dies as well, so I think you can get by on one can for the press. One Shot is a good product (I bought another can). When I set the Dillon 550, I called Brian and asked if I needed to clean the press parts before use, like the Hornady, because I did not find instructions to do so in the press literature. Brian told me that the 550's ship ready to load, no cleaning required. I am happy to have both presses, but if I had known how much work it is to clean the LnL, and how much trouble I would have with it, I would have passed on the LnL and just bought the Dillon. The solution to the LnL's problem was simple, but the trouble-shooting took a long time and was frustrating. I hope this information helps.

[sonicslam]

I have a Lee Auto Prime that is so old that the plastic has yellowed. It still works fine. I have a Lee Safety Powder Scale, a Lee Handpress, Lee powder scoops, Lee dies, and a Lee Challenger Breech-Lock. All are serviceable, and still in use. I had problems with the Lee 1000 a long while back. My progressives now are a Hornady LnL, and a Dillon RL550b. It took a while to work the bugs out of the LnL. The Dillon has worked just fine since the day Fed Ex brought it to my door. If I had to do it all over again, I would buy a 550 and probably not even try any other brands. The Dillon really is that good. I am not going to say anything bad about Lee products. A lot of people get into reloading because of Lee's affordability. Lee has also been very inovative, and has come up with some clever products. If they were as bad as some people claim, they would no longer be in business.

You said you had "bugs" with the LnL that took a while to work out. Mind saying what the bugs were. I know I'm interested.

Thanks

The LnL did not seat the primers flush. I researched the LnL before I bought it. Most of the information I found was Blue vs. Red stuff. High primers were reported, but no more than Dillon. I found the rest of the posts (high primers) after I bought the press, and had the same problem. The problem occured with both large, and small primers, with different shellplates. The "fixes" I found was anything from glueing a coin to the frame, to changing out the subplate. I did it all. Hornady was good about sending parts at no charge. They sent new primer-ram assemblys, and a new subplate. None of this worked. Most of Hornady's techs were patient and courteous, but one of the techs told me that he had never heard of that problem before. I doubt that, because I found posts about high primers going back to 2006. I finally fixed the problem. The LnL will finally seat the primers flush, but not below flush. I tried the loads at the range, and all function just fine. The "fix" was adjusting the timing, and more important, replacing the case retention spring. The original spring had a very small kink in it. It was so small, I did not think it would cause a problem. The last Hornady tech I spoke to was the one that suggested the spring. He said the springs are sometimes too tight, causing the case to tip ever so slightly. I also had to press a .38 Special case onto the adjustable rod that actuates the case-feeder pivot block. The rod was too short, and would not move the pivot block enough to drop a case. This was adjusted all the way out. The 38 case made the rod long enough to do it's job, and provide additional adjustment. I became very frustrated trying to rectify the high primer problem, and purchased a Dillon RL550b from Brian. There may be some "Blue snobbery" out there, but I loaded over 100 rounds after I set the 550 and had no problems. I have some friends that have, and recommend, the Dillon 550. I have found that I can actually load faster on the 550, than I can on the LnL, and the LnL has a case-feeder. There are a lot of people out there that swear by the LnL. They report no problems at all. I still use mine. Right now, I have the LnL configured for small primers, and the 550 configured for large primers. One last thing: The LnL had to be taken apart and cleaned with a solavent to remove the anti-rust oil applied at the factory. I used the Hornady One Shot, as was recommended by the factory. I went through two cans of it, at $8.00 per can. I used the One Shot to clean all of my new dies as well, so I think you can get by on one can for the press. One Shot is a good product (I bought another can). When I set the Dillon 550, I called Brian and asked if I needed to clean the press parts before use, like the Hornady, because I did not find instructions to do so in the press literature. Brian told me that the 550's ship ready to load, no cleaning required. I am happy to have both presses, but if I had known how much work it is to clean the LnL, and how much trouble I would have with it, I would have passed on the LnL and just bought the Dillon. The solution to the LnL's problem was simple, but the trouble-shooting took a long time and was frustrating. I hope this information helps.

I guess if the primers were seating "high" (as in not pressed far enough into the case)you could take the part that holds the pin in the press (the primer pin goes through a nut that has male threads on one end and the pin is retained by a clip) and machine .020-.030 off the bottom of the nut. This would allow the pin to push the primer further in the case. Seems like it would work better than a nicle or something.

[benos]

I shoot a lot of cast bullets, and the bullet lubricant building up in a progressive seating die is a real problem. The Dillon pistol caliber seating die, which allows disassembly without losing adjustment, is a really nifty thing that every cast bullet pistol shooter should have.

Yes, Dillon's seat dies are very smartly made dies.

I remember way back when I used to load lead bullets, with an RCBS seat die, when I needed to clean/disassemble the die, I'd remove the die from the press, clamp it in a bench vice, and clamp a pair of vice-grips on the seating plug, to get it out.

be

[roadapple]

I have a Lee Auto Prime that is so old that the plastic has yellowed. It still works fine. I have a Lee Safety Powder Scale, a Lee Handpress, Lee powder scoops, Lee dies, and a Lee Challenger Breech-Lock. All are serviceable, and still in use. I had problems with the Lee 1000 a long while back. My progressives now are a Hornady LnL, and a Dillon RL550b. It took a while to work the bugs out of the LnL. The Dillon has worked just fine since the day Fed Ex brought it to my door. If I had to do it all over again, I would buy a 550 and probably not even try any other brands. The Dillon really is that good. I am not going to say anything bad about Lee products. A lot of people get into reloading because of Lee's affordability. Lee has also been very inovative, and has come up with some clever products. If they were as bad as some people claim, they would no longer be in business.

You said you had "bugs" with the LnL that took a while to work out. Mind saying what the bugs were. I know I'm interested.

Thanks

I guess if the primers were seating "high" (as in not pressed far enough into the case)you could take the part that holds the pin in the press (the primer pin goes through a nut that has male threads on one end and the pin is retained by a clip) and machine .020-.030 off the bottom of the nut. This would allow the pin to push the primer further in the case. Seems like it would work better than a nicle or something.

We looked into that early on. Place an empty, de-primed case in the primer seating station with no primers on the ram. See if the ram will enter the empty primer pocket. While holding the ram in the empty primer pocket, see if you can remove the case / rotate the shellplate. If the ram is inserted into the case where the casecannot be removed, then there is plenty of ram stroke; and no need to machine any metal off the bottom of the nut on the primer-ram assembly. Like I said, several of us have tried this. By the way, the primer actually seated better without the coin glued to the press frame. Let me know if anyone discovers the miracle to adjust the LNL to precisely seat primers.

[LexTalionis]

I've been reloading for about a year now - started with a 30 year old Rockchucker then graduated to a Lee Pro 1000. As I've been learning how to reload, I've battled myself a whole lot (stupid mistakes) and battled the press a little bit. I've got close to 20k rounds through my Lee now, and it runs very smoothly. I can comfortably run at 300+ rounds per hour including all of the peripheral activities that go with the process. Here are some of my thoughts on the Lee 1000:

Things I love:

• Casefeeder. Pure genius. When I look at the $200+ I'd have to spend for a LNL or 650 equivalent, it makes me cringe. Seriously, it would cost me more just to buy a casefeeder for a 650 than my entire Lee setup cost me.
• Primer refill. Also genius. It takes me less than 30 seconds to load up 100 more primers and be back in action. No messing with tubes or picking up individual primers.

Things I hate:

• Three die positions. This is the primary reason I want a different press. Since I load cast lead, I need to be able to seat and crimp separately. Right now, I have to crimp my match ammo on my single stage.
• Disk powder system. I've run into some roadblocks with this. My ideal load is in between two holes on the disk. With my powder, one disk gives me 125PF exactly, and the next hole up gives me 137PF. I'd love to be able to dial my load in at 132PF, and it sucks that I can't tweak +/- .1 grains.

So will I buy a new press? Eventually. But I'm not in a hurry. This little press can really churn out the ammo. And, for the price, It can't be beat. Seriously. A progressive press with a casefeeder for $150? For those of us with limited resources, this press has been a godsend. Buying the Lee enabled me to get into competitive shooting at a serious monthly round count. Last year when I started, I wouldn't have been able to afford $600+ on a nicer press while still buying components for thousands of bullets. And this press will continue to serve me while I save up the money for a Dillon.