Apex 10 and other Mark 7 goodies

[XrayDoc88]

Good point!  I meant several thousand rounds!

[Rich406]

16 hours ago, XrayDoc88 said:

Are there any other owners of the Apex 10 out there that have truly solved the priming issues?  I want to be able to reload several hundreds of rounds without a primer jamming the system.

Mine runs mostly fine. I have an automated apex. The most important thing I’ve found is it must be clean. Once you get any powder or primer residue under the disk, the problems start.

 

also I’ve found that cci primers run best, federal and Winchester are much more finicky.

 

I usually do a 2k reloading session with minimal problems. 

[XrayDoc88]

Thanks Rich406.  What happens when a primer jams and you're automated?  Are there any automatic shutoffs or do you have to watch every reload and quickly smash the off switch?

[Posvar]

24 minutes ago, XrayDoc88 said:

Thanks Rich406.  What happens when a primer jams and you're automated?  Are there any automatic shutoffs or do you have to watch every reload and quickly smash the off switch?

Mine didn’t set off the clutch stop when primers jammed. You had to watch it like a hawk. 

[iroquois]

New Apex 10 user with primer disc woes. 

I just got my Apex 10 this week and set it up for 9mm. Low and behold I'm also getting missed primers with powder everywhere and my first primer jam. 

pealandco suggestion about the sizing die over the priming station makes logical sense. Generally a hold down die doesn't apply any pressure. It only holds the brass down. In the case of the sizing die, that's applying a lot of pressure against the shell plate which then makes contact with the the primer disc causing some flex. If you carefully watch the sizing/priming station while sizing a brass, you can see it flex. 

After reading this thread, I will be switching to a two step methodology. Brass processing then loading. I ended up going that route for 223 on my Dillon 1050 with a mark 7 autodrive. It definitely removes the extra variables. I also plan to follow tenx100s steps for getting the primer system aligned correctly. Thank you for your write up!

On a side note, I find it ridiculous that we have to take the Apex 10 apart to make sure all the priming parts are aligned correctly. For the price point we should have a BMW out the door and not a pinto kit car. 

 

[iroquois]

Quick update: 

I discovered what was causing the missed primers. If all three screws are screwed down all the way for the transparent primer disc cover, the primer disc will intermittently jam causing the missed primers. 

You can see in the photo below where one of the main friction points are. After loosening these screws, I'm not getting any missed primers or jams. 

Also, I made sure to follow the mark 7 video "Apex 10 Priming System Setup Guide" and tenx100s write up. 

 

[cool]

The linear primer feed works perfectly on both of my EVO PRO presses.

On my APEX 10 I had to make adjustments for it to work properly, and it should not exceed 1500 cartridges per hour

I don't like this priming system it's junk.

Since the takeover by Lyman the quality has gone down.

[Chris]

Posting this in case some people are not aware, but MK7 has released an update to the APEX 10 priming system.

 

The original design would allow the bearing to move in the event the alignment pin crashed into the primer disc. This would cause things to get out of alignment and binding (see Step 4 in the linked document).  The new disc has additional clearance under the disc to deal with debris and prevent binding in case of a crash.

 

I have the new disc installed and realigned the bearing according to the document and it is working 100% better.  I have been processing more than loading, but it has processed about 5k without binding and loaded about 2k of 9mm with no smashed primers.  There is some adjusting to do, but this has solved the issues I was having.

 

https://www.markvii-loading.com/amfile/file/download/file/32/product/1859/

Edited July 7, 2022 by Chris

[XrayDoc88]

Thank you for that update.  I have held off pulling the trigger on this press because of the inconsistent priming issues.  Can anyone else confirm that the improved primer disc is truly working well?

[SJBriggs]

2 hours ago, XrayDoc88 said:

Thank you for that update.  I have held off pulling the trigger on this press because of the inconsistent priming issues.  Can anyone else confirm that the improved primer disc is truly working well?

What he said.  This sounds like really good news for those of us who have been hesitant to purchase an Apex 10 due to all the priming issues.

[cool]

Hello thanks for the information

 

Edited July 8, 2022 by cool

[Sincerd]

I purchased a bnib apex 10 from 3-21. It had the old disc. I was able to get it working fine. If you partially lower the handle while looking at the primer go into the case, you can see exactly what you need to adjust. I also run mine without the plastic cover on my disc. Maybe I'll make a video if I get time. 

 

I did send in for a kit, installed it, need to make different adjustments, but now that's working fine too. Running hand crank slow or fast, haven't had an issue. Autodrive/primer Xpress is next

Edited August 14, 2022 by Sincerd

[dave148]

Anyone tried the toolhead LED for this press yet?:

https://www.doublealpha.biz/us/complete-daa-toolhead-led-lighting-system-mark-7

[BPSReloading]

I purchased the Apex 10 kit from DAA along with an additional light for spare tool head. It works very well, can dim it to the desired brightness. It floods the entire shell plate are with good lighting, can see powder charges very easily. 

[Woollymonster]

On 11/15/2021 at 7:33 PM, tenx100s said:

Update on the Apex10 saga. If you have been reading this thread you know that I have been pretty frustrated by some little issues and a major one, namely the primer feeding. Here is what I have learned. I do not know why but adjustments you make with the tool head off do not seem to remain the same when the tool head is installed. Also, I have made my adjustments without modification to any factory supplied components. Discussion of that will come later if necessary. Another thing, my bench is pretty rigid and so should yours be. If you are bouncing things around on the bench when operating the handle you could be bouncing the primer after it leaves the security of the shuttle. Remember it is sitting on top of the punch for a short unsupported travel before it begins to locate and seat into the primer pocket of the brass. Having said that now to the adjustments.

First, the shell plate has to be snug and timed correctly. The manual gives instructions on how to accomplish that. 

Second, The primer punch resting position must be flush or slightly below the surface of the primer punch bushing. I used a depth micrometer to set mine .001-.002 below the surface so a primer can transition onto the punch in both directions without "snagging" on either edge of the punch or punch bushing. If you allow the punch to rest "proud" of the bushing you have a sharp tangent edge for the primer to snag on even though there is a small radius on the bottom of the primer. If you keep the punch rest position no deeper that a couple of thousandths below the bushing the radius on the primer will meet a concentric edge and is less likely to snag. Theoretically, the depth could be almost half of the primer cup radius but why test fate?

Third, the shuttle position is critical particularly when picking up the next primer. The manual suggests loading only 5-10 primers while proving primer pick up but I suggest that you lower the handle and drop ONE primer down the installed tube. That will position a single primer without any additional weight directly on the top of the shuttle so when you raise the handle that primer should drop into position on the shuttle. You can see that when you lower the handle and seeing the primer in the slot on the shuttle. If not present then adjust the setscrew that stops the shuttle travel a very small amount and recycle the handle. Continue until a single primer will drop into the slot on the shuttle. If you started this procedure with the slot centered as well as you can see or slightly early (left) of center you will be able to sneak up on this. A single primer without the primer back up rod in place should load every time.

Fourth, You're not out of the woods yet. Now you want to adjust the primer delivery position over the primer punch as centered as you can get it. The engineers at Mark7 have put a locating punch in place to correct the final position prior to seating the primer but don't expect that to correct serious misalignments. Remember that primer is just sitting there on top of the punch with a small gap before it begins seating into the primer pocket. I have not tried to determine if that timing would allow a primer to bounce or slide off center. A side note here: the shuttle in the priming position can vary on my press with how rigorous the handle is operated so while setting it up I move the handle at a steady speed approximating what I will be doing while loading. You want to adjust the shuttle in the priming position just until it contacts the spring plunger on the adjusting set screw. If you set it so it rotates too far that set screw will not have enough tension to reliably reposition the shuttle correctly.

Finally, On my machine the primer back up rod is too short (when used with the alarm) to ensure it makes contact with the last primer in the tube as the shuttle rotates to pick it up. The non-concentric radius on the primer slot of the shuttle may or may not be enough for a primer to hang up rather than dropping cleanly. I have not proven that one way of the other but if you have already made sure that a single primer drops cleanly and you have the primer backup rod adjusted to maintain contact with that last primer until it drops into the slot on the shuttle you should be good to go.

 

After all this fussing around and seeing my previous posts it is appropriate to ask why did I go through all of this. Better yet would be to ask if I am keeping the press. YES, I am keeping the press. Some forum postings have complained about how slow tech support is at Mark7 and how superb they are at Dillon. I don't know about Dillon support but the Mark7 people have reached out to me on several occasions, even when I voiced my frustration, proving they want to build a satisfied customer base. I have no experience with Dillon tech support and only operated a 1050 for about ten rounds. I originally chose the Mark7 for its feature rich and robust design. I'm keeping it because it is one beautiful and smooth machine. There are NO moving zinc (pot) metal casting components to wear out on the Mark7. Who else can say that?

One forum poster suggested that maybe it is the BMW of reloading presses. I've owned two BMW motorcycles and he has that right.

I am definitely not into all this hassle. I need to reload reliable cartridges expeditiously for competition. My Mark 7 Apex 10 has been a total train wreck followed by a dumpster fire.

 

I bought this machine mainly to have the added swage station along with the added stations for bullet feeder, powder check, etc. Crimped primer pockets were causing some occasional issues loading on my XL750.

 

I bought this machine (manual Mark 7 Apex 10) based on Gavin's review on Ultimate Reloader. Obviously a sponsored review. I wish I had read this thread first. I have yet to load one completed cartridge on this machine. 

 

Out of the box:

- The primer system will not pickup and feed primers. It jams every time and has to be disassembled and cleared. I have tried all the fixes contained in this thread to no avail. It will prime just fine as long as I hand feed each primer.

- Station 3 (swage) threads are machined out of spec. The hold down die has to be forced in with a wrench. This eliminates the "feel" needed to properly set up the swage station. 

- Minor issue but the cartridge bin was smashed to bits. Some of the hardware on the Chinese case feeder had worked loose in the box. I found it all.

 

There may be other issues down line i.e., powder drop, etc. but, I have not gotten past the primer feed station yet. 

 

I will initiate a return/refund today and go back to my XL750 for now. Glad I did not sell it. 

 

"A bird in the hand....."

 

Thanks all,

Wooly

 

 

[Woollymonster]

11 hours ago, Woollymonster said:

I am definitely not into all this hassle. I need to reload reliable cartridges expeditiously for competition. My Mark 7 Apex 10 has been a total train wreck followed by a dumpster fire.

 

I bought this machine mainly to have the added swage station along with the added stations for bullet feeder, powder check, etc. Crimped primer pockets were causing some occasional issues loading on my XL750.

 

I bought this machine (manual Mark 7 Apex 10) based on Gavin's review on Ultimate Reloader. Obviously a sponsored review. I wish I had read this thread first. I have yet to load one completed cartridge on this machine. 

 

Out of the box:

- The primer system will not pickup and feed primers. It jams every time and has to be disassembled and cleared. I have tried all the fixes contained in this thread to no avail. It will prime just fine as long as I hand feed each primer.

- Station 3 (swage) threads are machined out of spec. The hold down die has to be forced in with a wrench. This eliminates the "feel" needed to properly set up the swage station. 

- Minor issue but the cartridge bin was smashed to bits. Some of the hardware on the Chinese case feeder had worked loose in the box. I found it all.

 

There may be other issues down line i.e., powder drop, etc. but, I have not gotten past the primer feed station yet. 

 

I will initiate a return/refund today and go back to my XL750 for now. Glad I did not sell it. 

 

"A bird in the hand....."

 

Thanks all,

Wooly

 

 

Progress!  Well after 4 and 1/2 hours tearing down this machine that included an hour on the phone with technical support. The tech could not really figure out why the Primer Disk Shuttle would not fully cycle to it's original position and pick up a new primer.

 

He was not about to stay on the phone with me for the next 3 hours while I tore the machine apart and checked everything.

 

I was able to prime 10 consecutive cases without a failure! I guess that is a start. It blows my mind how much teardown/disassembly is required just to change primer size or clean the primer system. Dillon guys (I am one of them) know that you have to remove two bolts to remove the entire primer assembly. Not so with he Mark 7. 

 

When I got it all apart, here is what I found:

 

- No debris to speak of under the disk. Cleaned it up anyway. 

- The Primer Punch was not level with the Primer Punch Bushing. So, I leveled it up with the end of a machine square.

- The Load Plate may have been too close to the Disk Shuttle and causing it to bind. Fixed that.

- The Shell Plate indexing was off. Adjusted it so the stations lined up when cycling. 

 

Again, 4 and 1/2 hours. Maybe I will get faster if I ever have to do this again. I hope I never have to do it again but, I would not bet on it. I reload to shoot. Not to tinker with finicky machines. 

 

Ohly 6 more stations to go! Maybe my dies will get in sometime soon. 

 

Edited November 22, 2022 by Woollymonster

[HOGRIDER]

After watching a video of a loaders Apex 10 running like a Swiss watch, I inquired as to his die(s) setup; particularly stations #2 - #5.  His generous reply was:

 

Quote

my set up is as follows:

station 2 resizing/decapping Dillon die ( I use this die only for the convenience of finding the decapsulating rod tips)

station 3 FW arms dynamic hold down die (the best I see in the market today - THANKS AGAIN TO Will Aerni!!!!!!)

station 4 re-sizing Undersize die. Let me point out that the sizing die I use in the primer station is a U-die from Lee. As you can see from the videos I posted the shell plate has almost imperceptible zero twist. The trick I used is as follows: from the Lee's Undersizing die, I removed the tip of the decapsulating rod ( just twist the tip slightly and pull it off because it is press-fitted. Then you have to spend a little time adjusting the height of the inner rod, but with good dexterity you can get the end to push on the inner bottom of the case) . This gave me a rod that I adjusted as told so that when the primer punch pushes up to insert the primer the case doesn't move upward and also undergoes a double recalibration of the case body.

station 5 swage die Redding or Lyman. Actually I prefer the first one just because I find it faster to adjust the swaging depth because you adjust only the rod and not the whole die as with Lyman

Wondering if anyone uses the Lee U-Die over the priming station?  

 

Thanks @Josh Biondi!!!!!!

 

 

Edited November 24, 2022 by HOGRIDER
update

[Murzikrv]

Just got new Apex and auto drive

Set it up manually first wit the handle. Smooth operator. Run all stations. No issues.

Connected auto drive. Running in 1000 per hour and 1500 per hour No issues.

The moment switching to 2500/h autitrdive difital clutch activates on the down strike. When pressing finish cycle it goes down no problem.

Also looks like I was sent used or broken motor. Barcode label looks worn out. Not even mention missing part for the case feeder.

 

https://www.facebook.com/100000939983154/videos/pcb.1198625987531013/841571910487903