AHI Posted June 23, 2020 Share Posted June 23, 2020 Solsand your purity good at taking pictures if you will take two more and post. one with a sized case empty(no bullet) in the barrel like you were plunking a round. The other one with one of your loaded rounds. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Solsand Posted June 23, 2020 Author Share Posted June 23, 2020 48 minutes ago, AHI said: Solsand your purity good at taking pictures if you will take two more and post. one with a sized case empty(no bullet) in the barrel like you were plunking a round. The other one with one of your loaded rounds. Will do first chance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
radny97 Posted June 23, 2020 Share Posted June 23, 2020 Given that you plunk tested every round I’m going to change my opinion and go with double charge. I don’t think the press was the culprit. I think it was the process of removing every round and you somehow accidentally double charged. I did the same thing when i first started reloading, trying to triple check everything. In my first 100 rounds i ended up double charging a 38 special case with 231. Thankfully it was a midrange powder charge and i was shooting out of a Ruger 357 mag. The double charge was still in excess of 357 mag data, but not by much. No harm to the gun or me. Taught me a lesson that you’re often safer to trust your press than you are to remove stuff. I now use a small flashlight to check the powder drop every 100 rounds or so. I’ve never had another double charge tens of thousands of rounds later. I use the Lee auto disk on a couple of different Lee presses. The problem wasn’t your press in my opinion. Glad you’re unhurt. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Solsand Posted June 23, 2020 Author Share Posted June 23, 2020 4 hours ago, radny97 said: Given that you plunk tested every round I’m going to change my opinion and go with double charge. I don’t think the press was the culprit. I think it was the process of removing every round and you somehow accidentally double charged. I did the same thing when i first started reloading, trying to triple check everything. In my first 100 rounds i ended up double charging a 38 special case with 231. Thankfully it was a midrange powder charge and i was shooting out of a Ruger 357 mag. The double charge was still in excess of 357 mag data, but not by much. No harm to the gun or me. Taught me a lesson that you’re often safer to trust your press than you are to remove stuff. I now use a small flashlight to check the powder drop every 100 rounds or so. I’ve never had another double charge tens of thousands of rounds later. I use the Lee auto disk on a couple of different Lee presses. The problem wasn’t your press in my opinion. Glad you’re unhurt. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Agreed. And Thanks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Solsand Posted June 23, 2020 Author Share Posted June 23, 2020 @AHI here you go. The empty case is the Fiocchi. The Federal is case/bullet at 1.135. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AHI Posted June 23, 2020 Share Posted June 23, 2020 (edited) so from the side does it look like the one on the left I pulled this picture from the Sig forum Edited June 24, 2020 by AHI Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Why Posted June 23, 2020 Share Posted June 23, 2020 Based on the last series of pictures, I agree with out of battery. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1911in9mm Posted June 24, 2020 Share Posted June 24, 2020 Based on the series of pictures, I’d say that’s a 2 part problem. Out of battery and double charged. Per Hodgdon 3.2 gr is a start charge on a 147xtp at COAL of 1.1 with at 22,500 cup pressure. Based on how that case is blown out and bulged just at/above the case web, that’s an extreme pressure event that happened. The scorched carbon in the primer pocket and where the case head fractured tells you it was way hotter than a “book” load. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Farmer Posted June 24, 2020 Share Posted June 24, 2020 Wow there really is allot of the case head hanging out there. I checked my xd and it seats to the extractor rim. Is that case sloppy in the bbl or is it just the lighting? I would have that checked/gauged unless that’s normal for that gun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AHI Posted June 24, 2020 Share Posted June 24, 2020 this is normal for these guns .a very loose chamber and known to fire out of battery. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ddc Posted June 24, 2020 Share Posted June 24, 2020 My ammo plunks in my two X5's pretty much like those pictures show. Both barrels have the bevel cut at the case mouth. However I've never had any brass that looked anywhere close to those pregnant guppy pictures. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HesedTech Posted June 24, 2020 Share Posted June 24, 2020 (edited) I’ll admit, I had no idea the X5 had so much brass unsupported. I took a picture of my Tanfoglio S2 with a loadEd cartridge plunked and an empty one shot from the same barrel, what a difference from the Sig. I guess they didn’t learn from Glock or just expected everyone to use factory ammo. Okay to be fair I grabbed an aftermarket barrel for an HK, BTW not a good barrel, to compare this is the same round fully seated and there’s a bit more base showing, but not as much as the X5. Edited June 24, 2020 by HesedTech Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cherokeewind Posted June 24, 2020 Share Posted June 24, 2020 (edited) If this was, as I believe, an over charge situation (double charge) I would expect that at the instant of ignition, the slide and barrel would begin to unlock allowing even more of the case to become unsupported, leading to the results shown in the pictures of the ruptured case. I know that the slide/barrel are still locked as they begin to recoil but the unlocking begins very early in the sequence. Edited June 24, 2020 by Cherokeewind Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Solsand Posted June 24, 2020 Author Share Posted June 24, 2020 1 hour ago, Cherokeewind said: If this was, as I believe, an over charge situation (double charge) I would expect that at the instant of ignition, the slide and barrel would begin to unlock allowing even more of the case to become unsupported, leading to the results shown in the pictures of the ruptured case. That’s what makes sense to me. One led to the other, or “facilitated” the other, IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Solsand Posted June 24, 2020 Author Share Posted June 24, 2020 @AHI sorry it took me so long. Looks like the photo on the left. Here is mine... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Solsand Posted June 24, 2020 Author Share Posted June 24, 2020 14 hours ago, Farmer said: Wow there really is allot of the case head hanging out there. I checked my xd and it seats to the extractor rim. Is that case sloppy in the bbl or is it just the lighting? I would have that checked/gauged unless that’s normal for that gun. @Farmerhas to be the lighting. Not at all sloppy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Solsand Posted June 25, 2020 Author Share Posted June 25, 2020 I wanted to update everyone because I have received an enormous mount of advice and expertise from so many people. In any case, I have some pertinent news. I started my bullet pulling project yesterday and the first 200 rounds were on point -- 3.0gr, almost all of which were exactly that. These first 200 I loaded using my Lee Auto Pro as a single-stage press. As a beginner I wanted to learn the process and not make any mistakes. (Footnote- I'm REALLY happy with the consistency of my Lee Auto Drum). That said, I moved on to the first case of 100 that I did when I first started using the press as an actually ammo maker -- set up the case feeders and started setting bullets with each pull of the handle. HOWEVER, what I kept doing on a regular basis (because I was a little too OCD) was stopping the press after a powder drop, pulling it, dumping it, weighing it, setting it back in the press, etc., etc. But what I think happened is, even though I was stopping to pull cases from time to time, the shell plate still had cases "waiting in line" and at some point I pulled the handle, wasn't paying attention and double-charged a case. I know this for a fact now because in this first batch of 100 that I made in "full auto mode" I found TWO case with 6.0gr! TWO out of 100! I totally f****d up the process and, as several of you have already mention, I just didn't trust my equipment or the process it was designed to implement. So, something good (IMO) has come from this accident. I now know for certain that my issue was caused by a double-charge. This doesn't mean that the over-pressure event didn't inadvertently create an OOB as well, maybe it did maybe it didn't, but I know with 100% certainty that I caused the problem. I have another 300 hundred to pull, can't WAIT to see what I find. On a related note, please see my photo. Should I just throw all of the pulled bullets away (they all look like this from the collet on my RCBS bullet puller)? Or can I re-use them? Remember I'm green as grass... ?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cherokeewind Posted June 25, 2020 Share Posted June 25, 2020 Is your bullet puller an inertia puller (hammer type) or an actual collet that grips the bullet and pulls it from the case? At the short ranges most pistol shots are taken, I would reuse the bullets if they look as good as the one pictured. For 50 yard slow fire bullseye competition maybe not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
s2000red Posted June 25, 2020 Share Posted June 25, 2020 Solsand, I have tremendous respect for you for posting about your error. Glad to hear you figured it out and really glad that you are okay. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Solsand Posted June 25, 2020 Author Share Posted June 25, 2020 6 minutes ago, Cherokeewind said: Is your bullet puller an inertia puller (hammer type) or an actual collet that grips the bullet and pulls it from the case? At the short ranges most pistol shots are taken, I would reuse the bullets if they look as good as the one pictured. For 50 yard slow fire bullseye competition maybe not. @Cherokeewind it's an actual collet/die type that fits into my other Lee single stage press, you tighten down on the bullet, lower the handle and it pulls the bullet. I would just be using it for match practice drills. They all look like the one in the photo. Thanks for the reply, I wasn't sure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Solsand Posted June 25, 2020 Author Share Posted June 25, 2020 9 minutes ago, s2000red said: Solsand, I have tremendous respect for you for posting about your error. Glad to hear you figured it out and really glad that you are okay. @s2000red I appreciate the kind words. And I really appreciate the way so many people chimed in to help me and advise me. Every single comment was constructive and helpful. I'm hoping some other newbie can learn from my mistakes. Great forum. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ddc Posted June 25, 2020 Share Posted June 25, 2020 1 hour ago, s2000red said: Solsand, I have tremendous respect for you for posting about your error. Glad to hear you figured it out and really glad that you are okay. I agree. You received a lot of good feedback. Some of it was worded rather firmly. You took it all in stride and maintained your balance throughout. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Farmer Posted June 25, 2020 Share Posted June 25, 2020 Glad you found the problem! Good for you for not giving up on finding the problem and taking some abuse along the way. You didn’t get hurt but it sux that your gun got beat up. On the bullets if they didn’t get undersized by the brass I’d just shoot them. Even if they did they would work for practice. Marks and dings don’t really make any difference. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George16 Posted June 25, 2020 Share Posted June 25, 2020 10 hours ago, Solsand said: @Cherokeewind it's an actual collet/die type that fits into my other Lee single stage press, you tighten down on the bullet, lower the handle and it pulls the bullet. I would just be using it for match practice drills. They all look like the one in the photo. Thanks for the reply, I wasn't sure. You can reused those bullets. Just make none of them has a scratched up coating exposing the lead. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Solsand Posted June 25, 2020 Author Share Posted June 25, 2020 10 hours ago, Farmer said: Glad you found the problem! Good for you for not giving up on finding the problem and taking some abuse along the way. You didn’t get hurt but it sux that your gun got beat up. On the bullets if they didn’t get undersized by the brass I’d just shoot them. Even if they did they would work for practice. Marks and dings don’t really make any difference. 2 hours ago, George16 said: You can reused those bullets. Just make none of them has a scratched up coating exposing the lead. Good deal. Thanks. Quick question- no "scratched up coating exposing lead" because...? Once again, new to reloading. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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