Leaving a position faster and sooner

[Goodonpaper]

Guys I was watching some match videos and it looks like I’m sluggish coming out of a position even though I feel like I’m pushing hard. I was trying to work on my hustle at this match. 

I feel like I move into a position fairly well, either shooting or ready to when I get a sight picture but it looks like an eternity from my last shot to my second step out.

 

Do you guys have any drill, suggestions or ah ha moments that helped moving out of a stopped position?

[Winny]

I do a kettlebell routine several times a week that includes jump rope in it.  Since getting started in USPSA several months back I have started to make the jump rope more aggressive and speed based to get quicker feet.  I have also incorporated using a speed ladder in my workouts now with various foot work skills.  I can tell my footwork speed has increased over the months.  

[Goodonpaper]

I think basic conditioning will help across the board. That may be half the equation. The other half (or more) seems to be the mental part of leaving just after the sight lifts on the last target. I feel like I’m decent at minimizing stops and shooting pretty well into them when needed it looks like the leaving part is the low hanging fruit.

 

I looked at the last match results and while I shot more points than the division leader I was 20 seconds slower...

[MemphisMechanic]

When was the last tome you honestly practiced easy exits and hard exits in live fire, and not in a match? Be honest... although we probably already know the answer.  

[perttime]

Is it about slow acceleration, or a long time before you start moving at all?

Edited August 13, 2018 by perttime

[DKnoch]

When was the last tome you honestly practiced easy exits and hard exits in live fire, and not in a match? Be honest... although we probably already know the answer. [emoji6] 

This is the answer. I improved exits from using Ben Stoegers dryfire book. Load weight onto the leg you're exiting towards, when you engage last target on easier array. You can even start leaning if it's easy enough of a target you're exiting on

[Goodonpaper]

5 hours ago, MemphisMechanic said:

When was the last tome you honestly practiced easy exits and hard exits in live fire, and not in a match? Be honest... although we probably already know the answer.  

Ha you do already know the answer! 

Unfortunately my live fire movement options are very limited for right now and my dry fire isn’t a whole lot better. Maybe my best bet is to figure out the mechanics of the easy and hard leave in slow motion with the space I have available and then take it from there. 

5 hours ago, perttime said:

Is it about slow acceleration, or a long time before you start moving at all?

It’s not a long time like a second, more like .5 or less but it loooks like I have a hard time gaining any explosive momentum leaving.

[SCTaylor]

What is limited space? 3' or 10'?  It doesn't really matter as the mechanics are very similar.

 

I found, very recently, that getting back into some conditioning has increased my leg strength & flexibility which allows me to get going much more quickly.

[Goodonpaper]

I’m currently working out of town for a few weeks so I’m stuck in a hotel room but you guys are right I really only need to take the first two steps...

Watching the videos again it looks like I wasn’t ready to move when the last shot of the position was fired so it looks like I need to program my mind to be preparing as the second to last is fired and then take action when the last shot sight lifts. 

[HoMiE]

A lot of people struggle with this because when they come into a position they prairie dog and stand up. So to leave out of position they need to transfer weight back down to legs to get a good launch. See if you are keeping your legs loaded when you come in to position so that your are ready to leave. 

Edited August 13, 2018 by HoMiE
Speeling

[MemphisMechanic]

Are you standing up tall when you fire that shot, feet barely more than shoulder width?

 

You either need to be standing so that you’re prepped to exit (wiiiide stance, legs bent in a squat, shoulders shifted atop the leg that’s in direction of expected travel) or you need to make a drop-step a natural occurence.

 

Drop step: Halfway through a stage, when you’re leaning hard around the LEFT side of a wall and you need to move to the right next? Throw a foot out of bounds and push off with it, instead of slowwwwwwly trying to fall into movement away from your current lean.

 

Example: John does a pretty obvious one at the front left position:

 

 

[Goodonpaper]

So in watching that video I learned two things....

1. I’m slow as molasses in January 

2. I need to be much more aggressive in my stance.

I thought I was set pretty well but I need to bend my knees considerably more and widen my stance. I am/was leaning in to the move and letting gravity cause the momentum where I need to be pushing instead. 

I was going to ask which should be the driving leg, the one toward or away from the movement, but with the wider lower stance it pretty much has to be the toward movement leg correct? 

The wider stance should help with driving transitions which has been a dry fire focus lately. 

 

Thanks so so much for your input, this is probably pretty basic stuff for most of you but it’s a new layer of the onion for me.

 

Now can you tell me how to quit missing mini poppers at 25yds?

 

Dave

[andrewtac]

Power cleans for explosive conditioning. 

 

Aim at 25yds

[MemphisMechanic]

27 minutes ago, Goodonpaper said:

I was going to ask which should be the driving leg, the one toward or away from the movement, but with the wider lower stance it pretty much has to be the toward movement leg correct? 

 

If you don’t feel a burn in your thighs from the squat, you can likely be lower. And should. If you’re comfortable, you’re standing tall. Standing up tall is bad in any explosive-movement sport.

 

Confused on your “toward movement leg” thing...

 

In the video example, you’ll always be trying to get your center of gravity far enough to the right so that your left leg can drive you. Just like a sprinter leaving the starting blocks. That cannot happen if your center of gravity isn’t low and well inside of the driving leg. (Sprinters get low, they don’t stand up in the blocks.)

 

Sometimes you can begin to fall in the desired direction of travel.

Sometimes you can stand deep and wide and push off hard without moving your feet. 

Sometimes you need to dropstep - usually where a fault like prohibits a wide stance while shooting.

 

Quote

Now can you tell me how to quit missing mini poppers at 25yds?

 

Focus on actually feeling how much pressure your index finger’s pad is applying to the trigger shoe. After getting the front sight into focus, move your mental attention there. This will stop you from doing the “prep and slap” thing that’s common under time pressure.

 

Edited August 13, 2018 by MemphisMechanic

[Goodonpaper]

1 minute ago, MemphisMechanic said:

 

 

Confused on your “toward movement leg” thing...

In the video example, you’ll always be trying to get your center of gravity far enough to the right so that your left leg can drive you. Just like a sprinter leaving the starting blocks. That cannot happen if your center of gravity isn’t low and well inside of the driving leg. (Sprinters get low, they don’t stand up in the blocks.)

 

 

I may be a little confused too

So if I need to go to the left I feel like I should be pushing off with my right, that’s what feels more natural but it makes sense to move my center to the left to start the movement and then push off with the left leg. 

I’ll have to play with this a little tonight and see what feels more correct. 

[MemphisMechanic]

No.

 

In the video, John moved to his right. He stepped out of bounds and pushed off with the left.

 

To drive hard to your left you would do the opposite; set up in a wide stance with lots of bend in the knees and then push off with your right leg.

 

Edited August 13, 2018 by MemphisMechanic

[SlvrDragon50]

43 minutes ago, Goodonpaper said:

I may be a little confused too

So if I need to go to the left I feel like I should be pushing off with my right, that’s what feels more natural but it makes sense to move my center to the left to start the movement and then push off with the left leg. 

I’ll have to play with this a little tonight and see what feels more correct. 

Follow JJ on IG if you want to learn about agility. He's by far the best in movement IMO. He admits that he places high due to his movement ability, not his shooting ability.

[Goodonpaper]

So I set up a wide transition to out of the box dry fire drill last night, it must be working because man am I sore!

 

Thanks guys!

[CTJer]

Lot's of good tips in this thread.   

 

Set up drills to practice various exits.   Could be Box A to Box B.   Vary target difficulty.  7yd open you can probably shift your weight and start leaning out while taking that 2nd shot.   Steel, better confirm hit before leaving.

Wall with fault line extending back at either side.   Practice your drop step to power into next position.  Keep going back and forth.  (I like to set up a steel just in line with that wall edge/fault line so you have a lean)   Can always move it inward too and make it harder.

Edited August 16, 2018 by CTJer

[Goodonpaper]

Yeah this has definitely helped me have the skills to leave more aggressively. 

[sbo76]

On 8/12/2018 at 8:43 PM, Winny said:

I do a kettlebell routine several times a week that includes jump rope in it.  Since getting started in USPSA several months back I have started to make the jump rope more aggressive and speed based to get quicker feet.  I have also incorporated using a speed ladder in my workouts now with various foot work skills.  I can tell my footwork speed has increased over the months.  

What is a kettle ball routine?  I need to speed up my entry and exits too.

[hiflyer51]

I  added  agility ladder and cone drill workouts to my training. It has helped with my quickness and agility.

 

I do the cone drills seen on YouTube  "5 Best Cone Drills for Speed and Agility" by Profect Sports. I do these as described in video full speed , and then with gun

stopping at cones obtaining sight picture and exiting  to next position.

 

I do the agility ladder drills as seen on YouTube  "13 Speed Ladder Drills For Faster Footwork & Quickness" by King Sports.

 

Edited August 30, 2018 by hiflyer51

[obsessiveshooter]

I lose time leaving positions as well, and I know it's because I am standing tall every time. I bet I could drop my stage times by 5% if I would just fix this. Its low hanging fruit.

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