Being accurate, but not fast

[IHAVEGAS]

For what it is worth.

Have been focusing just on accuracy the last half a dozen matches or so. Results have been probably better, certainly no worse, so apparently taking that extra tenth or whatever for a good called shot has not effected my speed that much.

Anyway, with a goal of all Alpha's, it seems like I am now learning at each match, when there are bad shots I seem now to know what happened and what methods to change or skills to work on. When I was trying to be faster, I don't think I was gaining any understanding about where my Mike's came from, rather than finding specific things to improve a lot got assigned to - 'just trying to go to fast' .

[kamikaze1a]

This won't make you any faster but it will demonstrate to you how quickly you are capable of completing that COF.

Time a COF shooting at your usual pace then re-shoot/time the same COF while shooting as quickly as you can with no regard for accuracy.

The 2nd time will should give you a very good idea of what you are physically capable of in terms of speed. Calculate your hf for the first string and then play with the score and times. e.g.; If I shot the COF with the 2nd string time but points from 1st string or if I cut x seconds but gave up x points, where would my hf be? Then apply what you learn about time vs points to adjust how you shoot the next COF...

In USPSA, speed often trumps accuracy.

[tanks]

...In USPSA, speed often trumps accuracy.

True that.

Had my first official USPSA match today. First stage I shot, 26 alphas 4 charlies. Scored at 38% for that stage (Limited minor). I guess I need to work on my overall speed for the next match.

Edited May 15, 2016 by tanks

[bradsteimel]

I might suggest LOTS of dry fire. When it becomes automatic to draw and have the gun come up on target, that's fast. And when you transition to the next target with your eyes... and the gun magically appears on target, that's fast. Dry fire helps speed up USPSA times and especially Steel Challenge times. Give it a try

[Steve RA]

I've posted this before, but I think that if you come from an accuracy background, as in Bullseye or Silhouette, it is then harder to become "fast" than it is to come from being fast and inaccurate and gaining accuracy skills.

[b1gcountry]

...In USPSA, speed often trumps accuracy.

True that.

Had my first official USPSA match today. First stage I shot, 26 alphas 4 charlies. Scored at 38% for that stage (Limited minor). I guess I need to work on my overall speed for the next match.

I'm also starting to realize there are different sorts of accuracy. There is shot to shot accuracy, but there is also inaccuracy caused by lapses in attention. You could be the most accurate shooter in terms of hit percentage, but you might still trip into a no shoot, or alpha Mike a target. That isn't caused by you shooting too fast, needing better sight pictures, etc. It is because you probably stopped focusing on the target you were shooting, and started thinking about the reload you need to do, or the 20 yard headshot that was coming up next.

The ability to shoot all alphas is universal. Everyone in the sport can do it given enough time.

The focus needed to call every shot on a stage under time pressure is something completely different. That takes a lot of practice, and it is not about the mechanics of shooting. It is purely mental.

Edited May 15, 2016 by b1gcountry

[bradsteimel]

I've posted this before, but I think that if you come from an accuracy background, as in Bullseye or Silhouette, it is then harder to become "fast" than it is to come from being fast and inaccurate and gaining accuracy skills.

Kind of like a bullseye shooter trying to learn to shoot trap. The idea of swinging through the target is very difficult for that stationary bullseye shooter to wrap his head around. Not impossible, but tough.

[IHAVEGAS]

I've posted this before, but I think that if you come from an accuracy background, as in Bullseye or Silhouette, it is then harder to become "fast" than it is to come from being fast and inaccurate and gaining accuracy skills.

Kind of like a bullseye shooter trying to learn to shoot trap. The idea of swinging through the target is very difficult for that stationary bullseye shooter to wrap his head around. Not impossible, but tough.

I think if someone is fast, there is a high probability that they can develop accuracy skills.

If someone is accurate, they might be able to develop speed skills to an acceptable degree also, and they might not. Natural ability plays a much bigger role.

[SCTaylor]

As another new guy to USPSA, I agree that dry fire is making a difference. Just watching my times come down on the drills, along with the site picture coming in faster is going to have a big impact next match.

[BrianKr]

I've posted this before, but I think that if you come from an accuracy background, as in Bullseye or Silhouette, it is then harder to become "fast" than it is to come from being fast and inaccurate and gaining accuracy skills.

You might be right, it also might be my problem. I've shot both disciplines. I'm accurate but not terribly fast. Hmmm.

[GetAwayDriva]

Working on speed drills like Bill Drills and changing your thought process during the stage and stage planning will give you the speed you are looking for.

What thought process are you changing during the stage and stage planning?

[kells81]

I started out trying to shoot accurately and would end up near the top accuracy wise at matches. It wasn't until I had my daughter start recording my runs that I noticed things that I was not aware I was doing. Looking over the sights after a shot was the biggest time killer I had. My best match to date is after I was having an eye issue and went ahead and competed. I couldn't focus on the sights so I just let the bullets run. Its the only time I have ever finished 2nd on a stage. I have only been doing IDPA 7 months now and I am staying around the middle of the pack for the most part. I am still trying to find a good medium of accuracy and speed though. If I hurry I make huge mistakes which make me slower on paper.

I guess my point is if you don't have game film you might get some from another persons view. That has helped me the most because I didn't notice I was doing some things.

Edited July 16, 2016 by kells81

[wimms]

IPSC shooter gave me a very rough rule of thumb to start thinking along these lines - if you score below 80% of stage points, you're going too fast; if you score over 90%, you're wasting some time and should push yourself faster.

Of course, exact percentage is meaningless. It's just the gist of the approach - you don't win stages with 100% alphas and you need to learn to let go of being perfect while not letting yourself become too careless.

For beginners though, he would insist bringing 100% alphas until they reached 60-70% of local match scores, claiming that speed comes with experience while discipline and focus needs to be conciously trained.

[fastluck13]

If your accurate then maybe your shooting speed isn't as big of a problem as what your doing when your not shooting. (Reloads, Movement) If you can I would try video taping yourself because in the middle of a match we all feel like we are going fast. You can review the match tapes and see what's slowing your times down and improve on those areas.

Video will tell the story. You see where you are slower than others. On huge video tip is to get the feet in frame.

[GunBugBit]

I know guys with pretty slow feet who can shoot a good variety of stages quite fast. If a stage is movement-intensive, like running between 4 boxes that stretch darn near from Peoria to Scottsdale, their slower footspeed really shows up in their scores. For most other stages, their ability to get fast and accurate hits keeps their overall scores pretty good.

[bigbob21]

I think the issue most under A class people have is the "speed" in which we transition the gun from target to target... Getting the gun pointing at brown isn't really the issue, it's getting the sights aligned for a good scoring shot. I think the majority of able body died guys who are slow have this problem > their feet.

Most people tell themselves when they see their sights aren't straight either a) slow down and get good hits or b ) shoot 2 fast shots and hope for the best... Sometimes the latter works out ok for score (mostly locally where a lot of places have hoser type stages) usually the former just means means your slow.

Hence the majority of us either rank up fast and can't push the podium in the higher class or rank in the lower classes and struggle finding speed.

I find at I'm sort of in the middle, I love going fast and can usually tame my shots to either AA or AC on paper depending on how bad the first shot was.... But I find myself missing steel at 15+ yards and really having to stop my feet and go slooooow....

Can't figure it out, especially since half my live fire practice is with static steel at medium to far distances.... (Most of my dry fire is fast transition stuff)

I just chalk it up to experience... Only been competitively shooting for less than a year and figure I (like most of us) need more time with the gun in my hand, working on lining up the sights on draws and transitions...

Nothing worse than going for target to target fast, but your sights weren't line up right and your shooting a D on your first shot with a makeup A/C...

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

Edited August 2, 2016 by bigbob21

[fastluck13]

I think the issue most under A class people have is the "speed" in which we transition the gun from target to target... Getting the gun pointing at brown isn't really the issue, it's getting the sights aligned for a good scoring shot.

Add to this, changing the speed targets are engaged based on difficulty. Ever watched someone start an array with a partial target and they never speed up or start on an open target at 5 feet and shoot the 15 yrd zebra at the same speed? Switching gears within an array holds a lot of time and or points.

[Just4FunLP]

I'm still on my quest for speed and accuracy myself, but these are some of the things that has helped me.  (I should have taken training long ago. I'd probably be farther along, and would have saved a lot on ammo during my years of trial and error.)  

Read some good books, and do what they say.  Take small bits at a time and figure out ways to put them into practice.  Don't get overwhelmed.  There are a lot of techniques to master, but that's what keeps it interesting over the years   

Perfect practice.  Push for speed, but don't get in the habit of ALWAYS trying to beat the par timer.  I think I heard Max Michel say the majority of his dryfire is at about 70% speed so that he's teaching himself perfect habits.  This has been a big problem for me. 

I think Ben Stoeger's book has a drill where you look at a target, close your eyes, and then transition.  It's hard to be right on target, but when you open your eyes the sights shold be aligned.  I need to do this more often  

BE stresses rolling your eyes to the next target as quickly as possible.  There's something magical about this.     Somehow my sights seem to show up where I'm looking, and it even feels faster. I have two big signs above the targets in my garage that says "Perfect Practice" and "Roll Your Eyes".  

Run intire mags fast on targets at 7 yards while using the various grip techniques the pros teach on YouTube.  Keep working it out until you can track your sights.  When you hit apon something that works you'll know it.  You can see it in your sights, and on the paper.  Write everything down about your grip and arm position before you leave the range and put it into practice in dryfire.  Try to discribe everything you do with words.  Aggressive and intensity are now my favorite words.  Every run in dryfire and live fire have to be perfect, and you have to give it everything you've got.  No wimpy practice runs.

Early on it became apparent that to improve hit factor, moving between shooting positions has to be mastered.  I'm no where near mastering it, not to mention my old body is falling apart.  Shooting comes first, but I think it's important to train yourself to move fast. Stoeger sums it up in one of his YouTube videos.  "Just haul a$$".  I've seen quite heavy guys walk up to a stage and take off like a rocket when the buzzer goes off.  You've got to figure out a way to practice this.  If you never do it in practice, how do you expect to do it in a match when you're focusing on the stage.

I wear cheap Nike football cleats at matches and have zero traction issues.  Though they are terribly uncomfortable.

Practice staying low.   My early videos showed that I tended to pop up when I shoot, and drop down as I took off to the next position.  As with shooting you have to eliminate the things that are unnesessary.  Strengthen your legs. 

When you're leaving a shooting position where you're leaning around a barrier with you're foot on a fault line, shift both your feet over in one quick move to allow you to launch in the other direction.   (This may only work with cleats)..??  

Practice changing mags while running fast.    

Be aggressive in practice.  

Walk the stages!  It blows my mind when I see people not walking the stages over and over, then get up and try to figure out where the targets are after the buzzer goes off.  It's almost like they're embarrassed to be out there before they shoot.   I went to the World Shoot as a spectator and the one thing I noticed was that after the stage briefing these guys lined up nut-to-butt and walked the stage with intensity as many times as they could.  Once I saw Stoeger cutting the line to get past these guys.  I think the top shooters can think about twice as fast as the rest of us, so when they transition they instantly go directly to the next target as fast as humanly possible.  I think walking the stages more than averyone else, and visualizing while others are shooting makes a big difference, especially for dimwits like myself  

Dont be afraid to draw out a memory stage on a piece of paper before the match and work out all your shooting before you burn it in during the walk through.  I did this recently, and while everyone else were confused and totally stressing themselves out, I was building my confidence and shot it fast and accurately.  In fact all the shots turned out to be easy were easy.   

I think learning to train yourself is what I love most about this sport.  

Edited September 18, 2016 by Just4FunLP

[FTDMFR]

I started making big gains in speed when I accepted the fact that becoming faster is an ugly, messy process that involves shooting way more misses than I had been previously comfortable with.

[motosapiens]

22 hours ago, FTDMFR said:

I started making big gains in speed when I accepted the fact that becoming faster is an ugly, messy process that involves shooting way more misses than I had been previously comfortable with.

that's one way to do it.

I'm never comfortable with misses, but when I see them from the sights, I don't mind nearly as much as when I am surprised by them.

[FTDMFR]

that's one way to do it.

I'm never comfortable with misses, but when I see them from the sights, I don't mind nearly as much as when I am surprised by them.

Agreed. I should have said "not great hits" instead of "misses".

I still want to see what's happening when working on speed. I just let points take a back seat to time.

[toothguy]

Another one of Patrick Kelley's great videos showing depending on the distance, you don't need to have a perfect sight picture to get good hits.

[benos]

All good info - well presented. 

[NicVerAZ]

Can I say one last thing?

We all shoot slow.

 

[kells81]

   I didn't really start to gain anything until I started having my daughter film me.  I then started to notice I would lift my head almost every shot.   You might consider setting up something/someone to film you from the side.  It has helped my ground game a LOT because I was doing things that I didn't really know I was doing.