Fuzz Posted January 4, 2015 Share Posted January 4, 2015 Ok looking for a little help. I have a Legacy Citadel 9mm 1911. I have purchased 6 - 10 round mags for it. ( Tripp Cobra mags ) The problem is when I have 10 rounds in the mag and I try to put a mag with 10 rounds in the gun it is very tight and difficult to lock in place. This is only with the slide forward battery. If I take 1 round out and only have 9 rounds it will lock up like it is supposed to. The gun will function, fire, and feed properly even with the 10 rd mag loaded full. The only problem with this is when changing mags. You really gotta smack them to get them to lock up. I am using this gun as a USPSA trainer and even in a few matches that are not sanctioned and such.Getting them to lock up quickly is important. Plus it is just not the way they are supposed to be. I am wondering if the spring is bottoming out and just not giving enough room for the last round. If so could I cut one section of the mag spring off ? That would take the pressure off and give a little more room for the last bullet that is fitting too tight. What do you boy's and girls think. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SWprotected Posted January 4, 2015 Share Posted January 4, 2015 A friend of mine has the same gun and just got some 10rd mags, he had the same issue. I would load them up and leave them loaded for a few days, it could just be the new springs are strong and will free up with some use. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve RA Posted January 4, 2015 Share Posted January 4, 2015 I've got a 9mm Citadel and Tripp mags and have no problem with them. You might try loading them full and let them sit for a week or so. Many times this will solve your problem. If this doesn't solve the problem then there are other ways to solve your problem. You could get another - or modify yours - mag release and lower the area the mag slot rests on. Only problem with that is you might develop a problem feeding rounds into the chamber. Or, call Tripp and see what they suggest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fuzz Posted January 4, 2015 Author Share Posted January 4, 2015 I have tried loading them up and let them set full for 2 weeks. No difference. I also polished the mag release which really made a difference in the smoothness of the release but it did not help with the issue at hand. I have not called Tripp I will do that and get their opinion. Thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bunsen Posted January 4, 2015 Share Posted January 4, 2015 I would call tripp but does the gun already have a raised mag catch installed in it? If so you may want to switch that out back to a standard mag catch and see if that helps and you don't get nose dives etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fuzz Posted January 4, 2015 Author Share Posted January 4, 2015 I would call tripp but does the gun already have a raised mag catch installed in it? If so you may want to switch that out back to a standard mag catch and see if that helps and you don't get nose dives etc. No I have the factory mag release in it. I did polish it up a bit which smoothed it out for sure but did not help with the issue at hand. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bountyhunter Posted January 4, 2015 Share Posted January 4, 2015 The original design of the 9mm mag (standard length mag shell) is 9 rounds. To get ten rounds in, they basically have to squeeze everything. That makes it a little flaky and prone to problems. I have had the same problem with CMC ten round mags in my Trojan. As stated above, you can file the locking slot in the mag shell to make it lock in a bit lower in the frame, but that might cause feeding issues with the round too low with respect to the ramp. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yeti Posted January 4, 2015 Share Posted January 4, 2015 Fairly common. If you have any extra room at all... Try leaving the mags loaded to full capacity to see if they free up slightly, which may give you that small margin needed. Trimming the spring may give you last round failure to feed and/or slide lock failures. Option B is to use a different follower/spring combo. IMHO, Tripp followers are the best, but are a little thicker. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RJH Posted January 4, 2015 Share Posted January 4, 2015 If you can't get them to work, I have the same gun and use metalform 10 round mags and they seat very easily. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mulrick Posted January 5, 2015 Share Posted January 5, 2015 This is just my .02 but I have never followed the line of thinking that leaving a magazine loaded will help. Now I base this on magazines that have stayed loaded for years, and then shot, vs competition mags that get used all the time. In my experience it is stress-strain cycles play a much larger role in spring wear. Ferrous material like most steels exhibit an infinite lifetime under a particular amount of stress amplitude - not the absolute stress, which is generally far less - (the so-called "fatigue limit"). Less ductile materials like aluminum and titanium have a finite cycle life regardless of the stress amplitude; however, parts designed with these materials generally have lifetimes in the millions of cycles and fail by different modes long before the lifetime is reached. So obviously, the life of the spring depends on proper design and materials choice. The spring steel that your gun would most likely use is a moderately-high carbon steel, with potentially nickel, silicon and manganese alloying agents in small quantities. It should, even at full capacity be far short of the "fatigue limit" and would exhibit no change. So basically this is a long winded way of saying it might be more beneficial to sit in front of the TV and load and unload the mags a few hundred times... Read more: http://www.physicsforums.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
motosapiens Posted January 5, 2015 Share Posted January 5, 2015 my tripp 45 mags (almost brand new) have a bit of a hitch in them. When I load them full (8 rds) they sometimes are hard to seat. If i push the rounds down past that 'hitch' they seat easily. It feels like the spring is just hanging up on something in there. It seems to be getting gradually better. You might try seeing if the rounds can be pushed down any further with a little force. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bountyhunter Posted January 5, 2015 Share Posted January 5, 2015 (edited) This is just my .02 but I have never followed the line of thinking that leaving a magazine loaded will help. Now I base this on magazines that have stayed loaded for years, and then shot, vs competition mags that get used all the time. In my experience it is stress-strain cycles play a much larger role in spring wear. Ferrous material like most steels exhibit an infinite lifetime under a particular amount of stress amplitude - not the absolute stress, which is generally far less - (the so-called "fatigue limit"). Less ductile materials like aluminum and titanium have a finite cycle life regardless of the stress amplitude; however, parts designed with these materials generally have lifetimes in the millions of cycles and fail by different modes long before the lifetime is reached. So obviously, the life of the spring depends on proper design and materials choice. The spring steel that your gun would most likely use is a moderately-high carbon steel, with potentially nickel, silicon and manganese alloying agents in small quantities. It should, even at full capacity be far short of the "fatigue limit" and would exhibit no change. So basically this is a long winded way of saying it might be more beneficial to sit in front of the TV and load and unload the mags a few hundred times... Or with a single stack mag: you can take a sharpie and just push the follower up and down against the spring while you watch TV. Same effect. Problem with the mags where they are trying to cram in an extra round beyond original design: the fully loaded state may actually crush the spring past the range of elastic deformation so it may shorten the life of the spring. Edited January 5, 2015 by bountyhunter Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mulrick Posted January 5, 2015 Share Posted January 5, 2015 Or with a single stack mag: you can take a sharpie and just push the follower up and down against the spring while you watch TV. Same effect. Problem with the mags where they are trying to cram in an extra round beyond original design: the fully loaded state may actually crush the spring past the range of elastic deformation so it may shorten the life of the spring. Yep, that is also the conclusion I came to. Leaving mags originally intended for less rounds fully loaded could potentially cause the spring to deform, its fairly unlikely. If we were talking about HD mags that are loaded and left for the oh $#*! moment, then downloading 1 is probably suggested especially if left for long periods of time. But if we are talking about compressing the spring enough to seat a little better, then the Sharpie method above will produce results the fastest without removing metal from the tubes (which I would not do until I was positive its not just a new spring that is really tight.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shotgunone Posted January 5, 2015 Share Posted January 5, 2015 (edited) I had this same problem with Wilson 9mm mags and I cut one coil off the spring. Still plenty of tension and works much better. Edited January 5, 2015 by shotgunone Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
repins1911 Posted January 6, 2015 Share Posted January 6, 2015 I ran Wilson mags in my DW Pointman 9, had zero issues. Buddy had a Springer 9mm and had to use Cobra mags. Try a few different brands if you can to see if your pistol prefers one over the other. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lee blackman Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 I have an STI Trojan 9mm. It has a ramped barrel. Using MG JHP's, when I CRAM 10 rounds in a Tripp mag, I sometimes get nosedives on the first round of the mag if wedges on a closed slide. Going to a more rounded nose bullet and tweaking the OAL almost solved the problem, but it still wasn't 100%. Changing to Dawson mags however did seem to fix it. I don't know if there is just more room for the spring to compress and the follower not get squashed all the way flat, but the nose of the top bullet seems to have enough upward angle left not to nose dive. Could be something with the base pad maybe? I recommend buying just one Dawson mag and seeing if it is a fix. If not, it will be easy to move fast in the classifieds section. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bountyhunter Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 I have an STI Trojan 9mm. It has a ramped barrel. Using MG JHP's, when I CRAM 10 rounds in a Tripp mag, I sometimes get nosedives on the first round of the mag if wedges on a closed slide. Going to a more rounded nose bullet and tweaking the OAL almost solved the problem, but it still wasn't 100%. That is the plague of the single stack 9mm 1911. Main problem is the 9mm tapered case makes the nose prone to go down. One of the mag makers has a patented design where they molded a mini feed ramp into the front of the mag shell to prevent that but I don't remember whose it is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mach1soldier Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 I had a similar problem with my Wilson mags. I ended up trimming like two coils off the spring. It helped was still is hard to seat with ten rounds in it. I ended up loading 11 at the start of a stage, deciding how I was going to shoot it, and then putting 9 in the mags if I couldn't make use of the 10 on the stage. It's not ideal but it is what it is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cakedog02 Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 What are the best most reliable 9mm single stack mags? Dawson? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
motosapiens Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 What are the best most reliable 9mm single stack mags? Dawson? That's what my research suggested. I've only had my gun a few weeks (sti uspsa 9mm), but the dawson mags feed like butter with the plated RN's i use (at 1.15), and they seat easily when loaded all the way up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sporky Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 I think you should just buy my STI 9MM 1911....never had any issues with that gun or any of the mags at all. I probibly have 700 + rounds through it with factory and reloads and not one issue at all... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mulrick Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 I really like Tripp and Dawsons. I think they are the best, especially with 10 rounders. Dawsons have CNC basepads that are pretty slick I think you should just buy my STI 9MM 1911....never had any issues with that gun or any of the mags at all. I probibly have 700 + rounds through it with factory and reloads and not one issue at all... And to this I would say 700 rounds really isn't a great indication. I mean that is less than 100 reloads... I can burn through 700 rounds in a day of practice and one match... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve RA Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 (edited) Loading long will help with the nose diving problem. May not solve it but doesn't cost much to give it a try. If you decide to try this, be sure and do a "plunk" test to make sure the round isn't too long for your chamber. Edited January 8, 2015 by Steve RA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bluemooncricket Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 Dawson mags have fun very well in my RO. No problems with coated lead, plated, FMJ, TC, and JHP. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cakedog02 Posted January 8, 2015 Share Posted January 8, 2015 Thanks for the advice. I'll pick up a couple dawson mags & try them in my range officer 9mm. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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