Craig N Posted October 12, 2014 Share Posted October 12, 2014 I shoot 40 S&W in ESP/SSP. 125 PF in a 180 grain 40 load is stupid soft. It's really the perfect gamer load. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
v1911 Posted October 13, 2014 Share Posted October 13, 2014 I shoot 40 S&W in ESP/SSP. 125 PF in a 180 grain 40 load is stupid soft. It's really the perfect gamer load. Not to derail the thread... But how does the 180gr do at 30yrds at that low of a PF? I ask because my 147gr 9mm is already 5-6 inches low at that distance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wgj3 Posted October 13, 2014 Share Posted October 13, 2014 Simply adjust your sights for a more distant zero... Now get back to the brilliant and uber-logical IDPA rule set regarding approved calibers, etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elguapo Posted October 13, 2014 Share Posted October 13, 2014 I shoot 40 S&W in ESP/SSP. 125 PF in a 180 grain 40 load is stupid soft. It's really the perfect gamer load. You know what's a gamer load? 44 Special in SSR.......240 grainers @ 450 fps. I don't even think cowboy loads go that slow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Koski Posted October 17, 2014 Share Posted October 17, 2014 You can stop those with a heavy wool blanket hung over a clothesline. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Agent #1911 Posted October 21, 2014 Share Posted October 21, 2014 or good luck shooting the movers with slow bullets. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UCOShooter Posted November 10, 2014 Share Posted November 10, 2014 I see both sides of it: 1. You know if you want to be competitive in SSP or ESP, you are going to want to shoot soft 9mm reloads or at least 9mm factory. You will have to make that .40 really soft to keep competitive. 2. If .40 major was allowed in CDP, both .40 and .45 guys would be equal in competition. It would even the spectrum out a little. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
9x45 Posted November 29, 2014 Share Posted November 29, 2014 (edited) Because IDPA is about real-world self-defense, and no one in the real world uses .40. Not federal LE, not local LE, not ccw-holders. meow. No, its easier than that. USPSA power floors are caliber based, not division based like IDPA. So when I shot alot of IDPA I would run my G21(at 8+1) in CDP as major, 230grs going 780fps and minor in SSP, 230 grs going 580fps. So because USPSA runs 40 cal minimum as major in Single Stack, Limited, and Limited 10 it will never be allowed in IDPA. I have found that every rule in IDPA is the opposite or different from USPSA. After all the game was invented by one of the greatest IPSC shooters of all time, BIll Wilson. Read the article in the Front Sight archives, March/April 2006. www.uspsa.org/frontsight_archive/a/2006-03.pdf Edited November 29, 2014 by 9x45 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
9x45 Posted November 29, 2014 Share Posted November 29, 2014 I shoot 40 S&W in ESP/SSP. 125 PF in a 180 grain 40 load is stupid soft. It's really the perfect gamer load. You know what's a gamer load? 44 Special in SSR.......240 grainers @ 450 fps. I don't even think cowboy loads go that slow. SASS rules for minimum velocity is 400 fps. But the cowboys are the only ones with maximum velocities.... Seventeenth Edition January 2011 minimum power factor of 60 and no velocity may be less than 400 fps. The maximum velocity standard for revolvers is 1000 fps. The maximum velocity standard for rifles is 1400 fps. Pocket pistols, derringers, and long-range rifles are exempt from the power factor and velocity requirements. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Hostetter Posted November 29, 2014 Share Posted November 29, 2014 If you are focusing on finding a gun/load with the absolute softest recoil you are searching for the wrong thing. What you should be looking for is a combination that gives you are reasonable amount of felt recoil/muzzle flipping but cycles very fast. It doesn't matter if you are waiting for the muzzle to come back down or for the slide to close, you are still waiting for the gun to settle. Try thinking in terms of the shortest recoil event in terms of time. The faster your gun settles after firing a shot the sooner you can see what you need to see to fire the next shot. Time is important is a sport where success is measured by time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chirpy Posted November 29, 2014 Share Posted November 29, 2014 UCO, if IDPA allowed .40 major in CDP they would be ahead of those using .45 major because of mag. capacity! They can't limit the number of rounds loaded in .40 major because that goes against their rules! I'm shooting .40 minor in IDPA SSP and USPSA Production and love it! It's easier for these old eyes to see the .40 cal. holes! I still use .45 for CDP, SS, Limited and L10 for the same reason. Not gunna win anyway but after 30+ years am still having fun! Richard Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Hostetter Posted November 29, 2014 Share Posted November 29, 2014 Why couldn't they limit the 40 to 8+1 just like the 45? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cnote Posted November 30, 2014 Share Posted November 30, 2014 Why couldn't they limit the 40 to 8+1 just like the 45?They could , just like single stack division Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
9x45 Posted November 30, 2014 Share Posted November 30, 2014 Why couldn't they limit the 40 to 8+1 just like the 45? They could, but they won't.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Hostetter Posted November 30, 2014 Share Posted November 30, 2014 (edited) IDPA limits everyone competing in CDP to 8+1 now, the addition of another caliber wouldn't change anything. Edited November 30, 2014 by Bob Hostetter Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lee blackman Posted November 30, 2014 Share Posted November 30, 2014 IDPA hates the 40.... Thats for sure. Which boggles me because its been one of the most popular law enforcement duty sidearm cartridges in the US for going on 2 decades now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
v1911 Posted November 30, 2014 Share Posted November 30, 2014 (edited) There isn't anything prohibiting a shooter from using a .40 in IDPA. Plenty of room in SSP and ESP for it. From what I've seen from a civilian standpoint, most LE use .40 in Tupperware guns, that would play in ESP and SSP and reserve the 1911 for .45, CDP. Why they don't allow other calibers into CDP is probably only something Bill himself could answer. .40 is still welcome in IDPA, just not in CDP. Edited November 30, 2014 by v1911 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GOF Posted November 30, 2014 Share Posted November 30, 2014 Those 'Tupperware' .45 ACPs do just fine in CDP. Does Bill make 1911s in .40 S&W? I don't know. But, if he (or Nighthawk) don't, then I can understand why a .40 at 8+1 and a 165 PF is verboten in CDP Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chirpy Posted November 30, 2014 Share Posted November 30, 2014 Their rules are set up so that you have to load mags to legal limit. Unless you have a factory mag that was 8 rounds you would have to load all .40 mags to 9 or 10 + 1 and that would be against CDP rules. If some full size ss .40 came out with 8 round mags they might consider it but I doubt if they would change anything. They could also rewrite the rules but they will never do that just like they will never change rules to make sense. Also, you have to remember that IDPA was conceived and started by many of the same individuals who conceived and started USPSA. Back when USPSA came into being .45 was king and everything else was an afterthought. They reluctantly accepted 9mm in the Hi Power after a while and then other cals. and pistols as they became available. IDPA has not and probably will not accept the .40 as equal to the .45. FWIW Richard Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jane Posted December 1, 2014 Share Posted December 1, 2014 Those 'Tupperware' .45 ACPs do just fine in CDP. Does Bill make 1911s in .40 S&W? I don't know. But, if he (or Nighthawk) don't, then I can understand why a .40 at 8+1 and a 165 PF is verboten in CDP Sure he does. One of many: http://wilsoncombat.com/new/handgun-classic.asp#.VHvRCMk_cYg (Buy it for me, Chris???) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jane Posted December 1, 2014 Share Posted December 1, 2014 Their rules are set up so that you have to load mags to legal limit. Unless you have a factory mag that was 8 rounds you would have to load all .40 mags to 9 or 10 + 1 and that would be against CDP rules. [...snip] Richard Nope. You have to load mags to either the gun's capacity or the division capacity, whichever is less. Ernie Langdon won CDP at Nationals some years back with a SIG (loading to legal CDP capacity). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elguapo Posted December 1, 2014 Share Posted December 1, 2014 Their rules are set up so that you have to load mags to legal limit. Unless you have a factory mag that was 8 rounds you would have to load all .40 mags to 9 or 10 + 1 and that would be against CDP rules. If some full size ss .40 came out with 8 round mags they might consider it but I doubt if they would change anything. They could also rewrite the rules but they will never do that just like they will never change rules to make sense. Also, you have to remember that IDPA was conceived and started by many of the same individuals who conceived and started USPSA. Back when USPSA came into being .45 was king and everything else was an afterthought. They reluctantly accepted 9mm in the Hi Power after a while and then other cals. and pistols as they became available. IDPA has not and probably will not accept the .40 as equal to the .45. FWIW Richard Uhhh, fail. Please read the rule book. CDP: 8 in the mag max, regardless of how many cartridges actually fit in it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GOF Posted December 1, 2014 Share Posted December 1, 2014 Jane, If I bought one for you where would you shoot it? Certainly not in that "other game" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cnote Posted December 1, 2014 Share Posted December 1, 2014 (edited) Their rules are set up so that you have to load mags to legal limit. Unless you have a factory mag that was 8 rounds you would have to load all .40 mags to 9 or 10 + 1 and that would be against CDP rules. If some full size ss .40 came out with 8 round mags they might consider it but I doubt if they would change anything. They could also rewrite the rules but they will never do that just like they will never change rules to make sense. Also, you have to remember that IDPA was conceived and started by many of the same individuals who conceived and started USPSA. Back when USPSA came into being .45 was king and everything else was an afterthought. They reluctantly accepted 9mm in the Hi Power after a while and then other cals. and pistols as they became available. IDPA has not and probably will not accept the .40 as equal to the .45. FWIW Richard Uhhh, fail. Please read the rule book. CDP: 8 in the mag max, regardless of how many cartridges actually fit in it. I thought all 3 mags must be capable of "holding" the same amount of rounds, ie. one only holds 7, all must me loaded to seven in cpd. This would take out the gaming guys that have attempted in going to slide lock prematurely when round dumping was illegal. example---First mag 8+1 for that array with the popper, then 7+1 for next four targets etc Same thing for 40 or 38super in ESP when guys ran 1911's. Not all mags are 10+1 Edited December 1, 2014 by cnote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Hostetter Posted December 1, 2014 Share Posted December 1, 2014 Chirpy, just to be sure ... if I start using my STI in 40 in ESP I can load it to 15 rounds as long as I use the 126mm magazines so it will fit in the box? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now