Production Rules Question

[ss+P]

In Production Division is it legal for you to change the caliber of the gun.

I am bringing a new guy to a local match and he has a glock 35 (.40 cal), but has a 9mm drop in barrel. I am sure no one at the club would mind for a first time shooter, however I am trying to steer him in the right direction for future matches.

Thanks

[GrumpyOne]

I don't think so....

Appendix D4. Paragragh 21.3

Edited May 1, 2014 by GrumpyOne

[Nghthwk1911]

It is not, as that is not the "Production" run for that version of Glock, but the G35 in .40cal is on the production list, so unless this is an ammo issue, just have him shoot it stock.

[spanky]

Not legal.

[kneelingatlas]

The conversion barrel is a larger diameter than the G34 barrel, adding more weight to the front end.

[fishsticks]

Not legal as others have said. For a first match if suggest having your friend shoot limited minor. Less reloading to think about and with all the other things to concentrate on minor scoring is low on the list of concerns. If he sticks with it plenty of folks shoot minor power factor 40 in production so that would be an option later on.

[beltjones]

Not legal as others have said. For a first match if suggest having your friend shoot limited minor. Less reloading to think about and with all the other things to concentrate on minor scoring is low on the list of concerns. If he sticks with it plenty of folks shoot minor power factor 40 in production so that would be an option later on.

Or limited major with 15 round mags.

[ss+P]

I didn't think it was legal. it is an ammo issue. he doesn't have enough .40cal. I sent the MD the question to see if he will allow him to shoot it. he isn't a member yet so it wouldn't go toward his classification.

thanks for the input

[alma]

He could alway shoot L10 minor then and compare his stores to the Production crew after the match.

[bikerburgess]

I'm with fishsticks for the first match just shoot limited minor and load the mags up all the way. First time shooters have so much ti think about having extra bullets just makes it easier

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[motosapiens]

The conversion barrel is a larger diameter than the G34 barrel, adding more weight to the front end.

Which is of course a HUGE advantage, which is why all those limited and open shooters make slide-lightening cuts.... wait, what? lol.

It is illegal, for sure, but not for a good reason.

[BayouSlide]

Other division options available that are perfectly legal, as mentioned.

So why would a match director start off a new shooter with the idea that rules are made to be broken…Rules don't bend, they just get broken.

Your bud will have just as much fun shooting Limited/Limited 10 minor and not risk affecting the results of people playing by the rules.

Curtis

[ss+P]

I get what you are saying Bayou Slide, but you have to get them into the sport some how. I know that's why a few of the clubs don't require you to be USPSA members to shoot your first match with them. so you can learn.

I didn't even think about limited or L10 minor. we have enough 9mm and went to production right away b/c that's what I am shooting.

[kneelingatlas]

I say Limited, you can shoot to learn and bring what you've got, just make the appropriate division on the score sheet.

[motosapiens]

I get what you are saying Bayou Slide, but you have to get them into the sport some how. I know that's why a few of the clubs don't require you to be USPSA members to shoot your first match with them. so you can learn.

I didn't even think about limited or L10 minor. we have enough 9mm and went to production right away b/c that's what I am shooting.

there are clubs that require you to be a uspsa member to shoot a level 1 match?

[BayouSlide]

I get what you are saying Bayou Slide, but you have to get them into the sport some how. I know that's why a few of the clubs don't require you to be USPSA members to shoot your first match with them. so you can learn.

I didn't even think about limited or L10 minor. we have enough 9mm and went to production right away b/c that's what I am shooting.

I'm with you entirely on getting new people into the sport…that's why I wasn't being critical, just saying for a new shooter it's best to just get them into a division that already fits their present gear (Limited/L10 in minor) rather than asking for an unnecessary rule waiver (which any RM worth his or her salt should be hesitant to provide). They will have a good time no matter what they shoot so why not slot them into a place where they fit the rules. I usually wear some USPSA-type shirts when practicing to encourage interested shooters to inquire about area competition. I'll ask about their gear and guide them into the right division for their first match.

Once they get their feet wet, the hook will be set and they can figure what equipment path they want to take as they work towards that D/C/B/A/M/GM card.

Curtis

[Jaxshooter]

Have him shoot the match for no score and do not include him in the results. That way he understands the rules will not be broken for any reason. He can see if he likes it and if he is coming back he can get some 40 minor ammo before the next match.

[kneelingatlas]

Have him shoot the match for no score and do not include him in the results. That way he understands the rules will not be broken for any reason. He can see if he likes it and if he is coming back he can get some 40 minor ammo before the next match.

Why not just have him shoot Limited??? Does he deserve to be punished? As far as I've heard he hasn't broken any rule thusfar...

[JAFO]

I agree to just have him sign up as Limited Minor. We usually suggest new shooters do that anyway, because they often don't show up with enough magazines to finish some longer stages if they only load to 10 rounds.

On a side note, I emailed Troy back in February regarding whether he thought that perhaps the "original caliber" restriction in Production should be removed. There are a number of guns being produced these days that advertise the ability to switch calibers with ease. It doesn't make sense that just because someone bought a gun in .40 with a spare 9mm top end they can't shoot it, but if they buy a 9mm with a .40 top end they're fine. I never got a reply, though.

[RammerJammer]

The conversion barrel is a larger diameter than the G34 barrel, adding more weight to the front end.

Which is of course a HUGE advantage, which is why all those limited and open shooters make slide-lightening cuts.... wait, what? lol.

It is illegal, for sure, but not for a good reason.

The slide moves... and slams rearward and forward. The barrel and guide rod stay stationary counteracting this. Thus the popularity of tungsten guiderods and the weight restriction on them for production.

[spanky]

I get what you are saying Bayou Slide, but you have to get them into the sport some how. I know that's why a few of the clubs don't require you to be USPSA members to shoot your first match with them. so you can learn.

I didn't even think about limited or L10 minor. we have enough 9mm and went to production right away b/c that's what I am shooting.

Member or not, you still have to follow the rules.

[ss+P]

ok so if I am reading everything correct he cannot have a caliber conversion barrel in production, however in limited/limited 10 he can.

the problem we are having is he doesn't have and cannot purchase 40 cal at the time. he has plenty of 9mm

[JAFO]

ok so if I am reading everything correct he cannot have a caliber conversion barrel in production, however in limited/limited 10 he can.

Correct.

[Jakobi]

Shoot L or L10 Minor and don't worry about it. If he finds .40 then shoot Production, L Major, or L10 Major. I don't know why you would shoot a .40 with factory ammo in Production though.

-Jake

[Craig N]

I'd start him in limited. Full 9mm mags and he gets the fun of shooting instead of planning mag change points.

And reloading a 40 down to minor Power Floor is a really sweet load for production when he gets around to reloading.

Edited May 2, 2014 by Craig N