ProGunGuy Posted February 9, 2013 Share Posted February 9, 2013 (edited) I have been loading 9mm for many years and 10 of thousands of rounds with little problem. this is with lee dies and FCD. I got a rcbs dies set recently and have been playing around with it. I just use the crimp/seat die as crimp die only in place of the FCD. Now playing with the dies, the only way to make round that drop free is to adjust the dies till it has, what it seems, a light roll crimp. when i pull the bullet, it leaves a ring around the bullet. Is this normal?? my FCD does not do this. bullets used are BC 147gr. I measured, as best as i can the crimp at .378-.379. so am i doing it right?? Edited February 9, 2013 by ProGunGuy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ltdmstr Posted February 9, 2013 Share Posted February 9, 2013 (edited) [deleted duplicate] Edited February 9, 2013 by ltdmstr Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ltdmstr Posted February 9, 2013 Share Posted February 9, 2013 SAAMI spec for crimp on 9mm is .380". .001 or .002 under is not going to hurt anything. http://www.saami.org/PubResources/CC_Drawings/Pistol/9mm%20Luger%20-%209mm%20Luger%20+P.pdf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lugnut Posted February 9, 2013 Share Posted February 9, 2013 A slight ring from my experience doesn't seem to matter for the shooting I do- USPSA/IDPA. What do you mean "drop free"? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hi-Power Jack Posted February 9, 2013 Share Posted February 9, 2013 As long as rounds chamber freely, drop freely and are accurate, all is good Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BSeevers Posted February 9, 2013 Share Posted February 9, 2013 That is how I load mine Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ProGunGuy Posted February 9, 2013 Author Share Posted February 9, 2013 here is what i am speaking of the left came from my fcd and the right the rcbs. Both drop out of the chambers of my 9mm's freely Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ProGunGuy Posted February 9, 2013 Author Share Posted February 9, 2013 (edited) Edited February 9, 2013 by ProGunGuy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob DuBois Posted February 9, 2013 Share Posted February 9, 2013 To much crimp can affect accuracy and may cause a bullet to keyhole, tumble. Mike the bullet in the case subtract .002,.003 for crimp setting. .380 crimp would set at .298. I have used and recommend Lee Dies. Like Lee's first stage sizer and seating die if I'm using the FCD I back it up a little and use it as a crimp die. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve RA Posted February 9, 2013 Share Posted February 9, 2013 One on the right appears to have too much crimp. Sides of case should be parallel - look at factory ammunition. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lugnut Posted February 9, 2013 Share Posted February 9, 2013 Yeah- left looks good. Right one too much crimp by a lot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bassochist Posted February 9, 2013 Share Posted February 9, 2013 way to much crimp or the wrong crimp on the one on the right side. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rishii Posted February 9, 2013 Share Posted February 9, 2013 It's been a while since used a rcbs 3 die set, But I seem to remember the combo seater/crimp die has a roll crimp, and if you wanted a tamper crimp, You had to buy a separate taper crimp die I would use the rcbs die to seat & your FCD to taper crimp Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ProGunGuy Posted February 10, 2013 Author Share Posted February 10, 2013 way to much crimp or the wrong crimp on the one on the right side. i need to crimp it this much or it will drop freely from the chambers of my 9's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DougCarden Posted February 10, 2013 Share Posted February 10, 2013 get a Dillon crimp die. That is not going to work well, and if you load any plated or soft lead you will have nothing but problems.... DougC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
L3324temp Posted February 10, 2013 Share Posted February 10, 2013 Way too much crimp. If that is the amount of crimp you need to use to get the rounds to chamber, I would go back to the FCD. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bassochist Posted February 10, 2013 Share Posted February 10, 2013 i need to crimp it this much or it will drop freely from the chambers of my 9's. your rounds should drop freely out of your chamber, if you crimp this much there is a big chance a case will get stuck in your riflings, and when this happens you get excessive pressure in your case, and it will blow up your gun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mpeltier Posted February 11, 2013 Share Posted February 11, 2013 i need to crimp it this much or it will drop freely from the chambers of my 9's. your rounds should drop freely out of your chamber, if you crimp this much there is a big chance a case will get stuck in your riflings, and when this happens you get excessive pressure in your case, and it will blow up your gun. How's that gonna happen??? Just curious what you think is happening when a roll crimped cartridge is chambered. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lugnut Posted February 11, 2013 Share Posted February 11, 2013 (edited) i need to crimp it this much or it will drop freely from the chambers of my 9's. your rounds should drop freely out of your chamber, if you crimp this much there is a big chance a case will get stuck in your riflings, and when this happens you get excessive pressure in your case, and it will blow up your gun. How's that gonna happen??? Just curious what you think is happening when a roll crimped cartridge is chambered. 9mm are supposed to head space on the mouth of the brass. If you crimp it that much- there is possibility that the case could essentially go into the barrel. That isn't desirable for a lot of reason. Don't know if it would blow up but I wouldn't want to try. When you roll crimp a round it's usually for revolvers... which don't headspace on the case mouth! Edited February 11, 2013 by lugnut Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fltbed Posted February 11, 2013 Share Posted February 11, 2013 Excessively crimping a coated bullet (or plated) can tear the coating. Causing any number of issues from accuracy to bore fouling. The only thing the taper crimp die is supposed to do is remove the flair from the expanding step. If your reloads aren’t passing the plunk test with a normal crimp, something else is going on. It could be your resizing die is not set right. It could be your expander plug is slightly oversized. It could be your case walls are to thick. It could be your chamber is cut to tight. Using an excessive crimp (or a magic crimp die) is not the solution, it’s covering up another issue. Jeff Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bassochist Posted February 11, 2013 Share Posted February 11, 2013 i need to crimp it this much or it will drop freely from the chambers of my 9's. your rounds should drop freely out of your chamber, if you crimp this much there is a big chance a case will get stuck in your riflings, and when this happens you get excessive pressure in your case, and it will blow up your gun. How's that gonna happen??? Just curious what you think is happening when a roll crimped cartridge is chambered. Don't know if it would blow up but I wouldn't want to try. believe me it will, and hopefully it will only be the gun that is damaged How's that gonna happen??? Just curious what you think is happening when a roll crimped cartridge is chambered. comparing rolcrimped cartridges with taper crimped certridges, is like comparing apples to chestnuts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Service Desk Posted February 13, 2013 Share Posted February 13, 2013 FCD one looks good to my old eyes... I would back the RCBS one off a quarter turn. A lot of this is purely academic - unless you are shooting PPC at 50 yards. If they both chamber OK and hold the X-ring of a Bianchi target at 25 yards then you are good to go for just about any action shooting. I learnt long ago that if you can't hold the X-ring of a Bianchi target, then don't expect the ammo to. YMMV Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Poppa Bear Posted February 13, 2013 Share Posted February 13, 2013 Being as you now have both a Lee set and a RCBS set. Run a case through both sizing dies and measure the sized case. Are they close to the same? They should both be just below .380 at the mouth and around .390 at the base above the extractor groove. If the mouth dimension is BELOW .380 you should be OK, if not then you have a problem with your sizing die. Then run the case through the powder drop/ bell die. What is the mouth dimension now? It should be at or just above .380 which is just enough for the bullet to sit on top of the case and not strip off the outer layer as you seat the bullet. Then crimp the cartridge leaving the top of the case where the mouth is at at around .378. It should drop into your chamber freely. A quick test of the sizing and belling of a case is to try and force the bullet into the case by hand. IF you can slide the bullet into the case by hand then the cases are not being sized properly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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