Mike Dame Posted October 15, 2007 Share Posted October 15, 2007 A guy has a box stock G22, none of the usual production legal mods done to it. In order to keep playing the game they need to start shooting 9mm so they drop in a 9mm barrel in, factory or non-factory but identical specs, no other mods. Do you bump them to open? Would you let it slide at a monthly local match? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjbine Posted October 15, 2007 Share Posted October 15, 2007 If you drop a 9mm into a G22, you will be unable to shoot production I believe. Why not just go with .40 minor? Some say it is softer than 9mm. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Dame Posted October 15, 2007 Author Share Posted October 15, 2007 .40 minors a great option if you have a press, other wise 9mm from wallmart is close to $10 box a box cheaper then .40 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
foxtrotuniformlima Posted October 15, 2007 Share Posted October 15, 2007 A guy has a box stock G22, none of the usual production legal mods done to it. In order to keep playing the game they need to start shooting 9mm so they drop in a 9mm barrel in, factory or non-factory but identical specs, no other mods. Do you bump them to open? Would you let it slide at a monthly local match? Local match ? I would / could not care less. Shoot 9mm. Have fun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob Boudrie Posted October 15, 2007 Share Posted October 15, 2007 A guy has a box stock G22, none of the usual production legal mods done to it. In order to keep playing the game they need to start shooting 9mm so they drop in a 9mm barrel in, factory or non-factory but identical specs, no other mods. Do you bump them to open? Would you let it slide at a monthly local match? I would not expect reliable extraction due to the different extractor and breechface dimensions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vluc Posted October 15, 2007 Share Posted October 15, 2007 A guy has a box stock G22, none of the usual production legal mods done to it. In order to keep playing the game they need to start shooting 9mm so they drop in a 9mm barrel in, factory or non-factory but identical specs, no other mods. Do you bump them to open? Would you let it slide at a monthly local match? Forgetting the mechanical differences in extractor, etc. The question is this. Are the rules different for a local match versus a major? If the rules are the same...no it does not slide. Shoot for all the fun you want, but not for score. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flexmoney Posted October 15, 2007 Share Posted October 15, 2007 - Rules are the same for all level matches. - It's against the rules. - I'm far too busy during local matches to be doing equipment inspection. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loves2Shoot Posted October 15, 2007 Share Posted October 15, 2007 I would loan him a G17 for the match if he want to shoot for a score. I generally bring a few extra guns and ammo, just in case. Let him slide and it goes downhill from there. I think if someone who doesn't know better, comes to the range, it is a shame to turn them away. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gregory_k Posted October 16, 2007 Share Posted October 16, 2007 Let him shoot for score local, infor him gun is not legal. Give him the option to load to max cap and shoot ltd, or shoot ltd-10. Production shooters were bumped to LTD at the Nats when they should of been shooting for FUN. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adam B Posted October 16, 2007 Share Posted October 16, 2007 Mike, I will let them borrow one of my production guns if it is a match I will be attending Adam Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
foxtrotuniformlima Posted October 16, 2007 Share Posted October 16, 2007 The question is this. Are the rules different for a local match versus a major? If the rules are the same...no it does not slide. - Rules are the same for all level matches. Go put your head back in the sand and keep believing that. While we at it, I have a bridge in NY I'd like to sell. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jake Di Vita Posted October 16, 2007 Share Posted October 16, 2007 Maybe I should reiterate? Rules are the same for all level matches. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D.Hayden Posted October 16, 2007 Share Posted October 16, 2007 Rules are rules.. But in this case, how would you ever know? Does anyone check equipment this closely? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mscott Posted October 16, 2007 Share Posted October 16, 2007 Rules are rules. Limited minor or L10 minor. If found part way through the match, welcome to Open. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Micah Posted October 16, 2007 Share Posted October 16, 2007 Maybe I should reiterate?Rules are the same for all level matches. +1. It isn't fair to the other shooters that are following the rules to boot. Your friend has plenty of options...Shoot 40 in Lim, Prod, or Open...shoot 9mm in Lim, Open. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gary1911A1 Posted October 16, 2007 Share Posted October 16, 2007 We need new members to keep growing. At my club I suspect we would let someone shot with a caliber change in the hopes if they got serious to shoot more matches the would invest in a legal Production pistol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eerw Posted October 16, 2007 Share Posted October 16, 2007 it's fine balance to not be so hard-ass on new shooters that you turn them away..but you cannot let the slippery slope continue as to the newer shooter that is trying to follow the rules you get the appearance of a good ole boy club.. rules need to be applied with probably lots of explanation and help to the new shooter trying to help them understand and find a place in the divisions to play..a shooter that has been around and is trying to do something for convenience or to save money..knows the expectation and should expect to follow them..there are plenty of places to play and compete.. heck..when I started..we all shot heads up ( long long ago) and shooting minor 9 against open and limited type gun..I ended up in C class..and I really didn't care all the much..as I was having to much fun shooting anyway.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EricW Posted October 17, 2007 Share Posted October 17, 2007 Where are all these Level I matches giving away Cadillacs for 1st U Production...? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vluc Posted October 17, 2007 Share Posted October 17, 2007 The question is this. Are the rules different for a local match versus a major? If the rules are the same...no it does not slide. - Rules are the same for all level matches. Go put your head back in the sand and keep believing that. While we at it, I have a bridge in NY I'd like to sell. You are right. It is wrong of me to consider my fellow shooters and USPSA members to be ethical and honorable people who stand on principle and behave accordingly. But wait, that's all I've met in my 6+ years in the game. Your experience must be different at the clubs you shoot at. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nik Habicht Posted October 17, 2007 Share Posted October 17, 2007 Where are all these Level I matches giving away Cadillacs for 1st U Production...? I certainly wouldn't boot a new competitor to open for this --- I would explain the rules, and attempt to have a frank discussion about the expectation of future compliance. We tell new people regularly not to buy new guns until they're sure where they want to play. Usually these things work themselves out within the first couple of matches --- either the newbies decide the game is not for them, or they're so excited they're ordering guns, belts, reloading equipment, etc. Experienced or classified competitors are a different story though..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EricW Posted October 17, 2007 Share Posted October 17, 2007 Where are all these Level I matches giving away Cadillacs for 1st U Production...? I certainly wouldn't boot a new competitor to open for this --- I would explain the rules, and attempt to have a frank discussion about the expectation of future compliance. We tell new people regularly not to buy new guns until they're sure where they want to play. Usually these things work themselves out within the first couple of matches --- either the newbies decide the game is not for them, or they're so excited they're ordering guns, belts, reloading equipment, etc. Experienced or classified competitors are a different story though..... Exactly. Level I matches should accomplish the following: - Provide a safe venue - Be fun - Bring new shooters to the sport - Prepare shooters for bigger matches Bumping the new guy to open because of a barrel change takes away 2 out of the 4 for me. If he/she decides that 9mm is the way to go, they'll trade the G22 for a G17 or 34 soon enough. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eerw Posted October 17, 2007 Share Posted October 17, 2007 couple of different thoughts here.. bottom line..rules is the rules.. a new guy shows up with non compliant equipment..you explain the best you can, you give some allowance to get them there..and you help out as much as you can.. that is fine...make it fun, make it safe, welcome the new folks and get ready for the big matches..which have rules.... or you got the shooter that is trying to save money..good lord..we all are trying to make the $$ stretch with rising component costs and just the cost of living. but I can find a division to shoot in with any of my gear..even if its limited minor or open minor 10 etc.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ipscbob Posted October 17, 2007 Share Posted October 17, 2007 The question is this. Are the rules different for a local match versus a major? If the rules are the same...no it does not slide. - Rules are the same for all level matches. Go put your head back in the sand and keep believing that. While we at it, I have a bridge in NY I'd like to sell. You are right. It is wrong of me to consider my fellow shooters and USPSA members to be ethical and honorable people who stand on principle and behave accordingly. But wait, that's all I've met in my 6+ years in the game. Your experience must be different at the clubs you shoot at. Yup, must be different. I regularly see folks break the rules at our locals and then plead "just a local". Ticks me off completely but it happens so regularly that I have stopped protesting. Rules are rules regardless of the match level! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skywalker Posted October 17, 2007 Share Posted October 17, 2007 Can't really believe to what I have read in a few posts here. For me rules are rules, period. Like or not, either you play by the rules or you play a different game. If you want to be nice to a newcomer (and I WANT, because the sport needs new people), you can explain him the rules, you can help him complying to them, you can even offer to loan a gun which is rules compliant, you can ... show how nice and helping IPSC people are! What you can't do is to bend the rules to comply with everyone's desire. Ask yourself: "Am I doing really any good to him by bending the rules to allow him play the way he likes?". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjbine Posted October 17, 2007 Share Posted October 17, 2007 When we have a new shooter that comes to the club, we ask which type of gun he is using and the place him in the appropiate division. I don't see a problem with placing a person in the L10 or Ltd division when shooting a G22 with a 9mm conversion. We explain the rules and they would be ready to shoot and have fun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now