Dillon- Made in China?

[anachronism]

I just unboxed my new Dillon D-terminator scale. $150.00 out the door. I (almost) breathlessly assemble it, go to put the batteries in, and then I see IT. The sticker on the bottom that says "Made in China". It's now back in it's box, ready to go back for a refund. How long has Dillon been selling Chinese made products? Where is the rest of their stuff made? Disappointment is nowhere near strong enough term for the letdown I feel. Betrayal does come much closer.

[Patrick Sweeney]

Before you send it back, ask yourself two questions:

1) Can you find any electronic device not now made in China?

2) Will anyone else stand behind their product like Dillon?

[anachronism]

Before you send it back, ask yourself two questions:

1) Can you find any electronic device not now made in China?

2) Will anyone else stand behind their product like Dillon?

1- It appears that PACT is still made in America.

2- A one year warranty seems to be standard for this type of product. That's all Dillon offers too.

Edited October 7, 2007 by anachronism

[zhunter]

I will send you $100 for that Chinese POC

PM me your address

[whizz]

PACT is assembled in US but all components are prolly made in China?

[Mick]

PACT is assemebled in Grand Prairie TX about 6 miles from me but don't kid yourself about where those parts come from.

Let's see, the Chinese have both ends of the Panama Canal, an unlimited harbor in Long Beach CA, and the NAFTA highway to come up from the Panama Canal. Who is most likely to have control of the business who use cheap (slave) labor and make money for their goverenment????

Yep, you guessed it....

[ChrisStock]

Heartbreaking.... I feel your pain.

I actually challenged my brother recently with this: take a standard Saturday morning "items to be picked up for the honey-do list", and go wherever you normally would, and pick up the items you need. IF however, they have a made in C*&!a label, you must put them back on the shelf. I managed to turn his 1 hour errand into a 3 hour hightmare with many missing items at the end of the afternoon.

It sucks, but it's all too true these days. At least my practice bullets are made in Texas, and I can buy them guilt free.

[Jasonub]

Heartbreaking.... I feel your pain.

I actually challenged my brother recently with this: take a standard Saturday morning "items to be picked up for the honey-do list", and go wherever you normally would, and pick up the items you need. IF however, they have a made in C*&!a label, you must put them back on the shelf. I managed to turn his 1 hour errand into a 3 hour hightmare with many missing items at the end of the afternoon.

It sucks, but it's all too true these days. At least my practice bullets are made in Texas, and I can buy them guilt free.

not for long bwhahahhahha!!! insert twilight zone music here

[Merlin Orr]

I can remember this conversation with the word Japan instead of China....

[Matt P.]

There is nothing wrong with contracting your manufacturing in China. A large percentage of US companies do that. Iam sure dillion knows how to control the quality of the assembly line there. It's not that difficult.

Most of your electronic components are manufactured there (including the keyboard you are typing on).

Just because a few US toy companies had poor quality control does not mean that other companies do.

There is nothing wrong with products made in china if the US Manufacturer has the ability to control the quality.

[Cactustactical]

Dillon Electronics scales are / were made under contract by CED ( Competitive Electronics Dynamics), a US company. CED has its electronics made in factories in Guangzhou, China. Guangzhou abuts Hong Kong. This arrangement has been going on for years which is why Dillon used to have its liberal replacement policy. The items did not cost them a lot and it made sense to just replace them when they failed. After a while though, they failed often enough that they had to reduce the warranty down to its current 1 year term.

CED used to also sell Dillon their range bags made in China. Dillon switched to Royal Case out of Texas a few years back based on economic reasons. Royal has factories in the US, Mexico and China also.

*** My info on Dillon products is about a year old, so things could have changed since my last discussion with Dillon buyers concerning these issues.

I do agree with Matt P that almost everything is made in China nowadays. It is incumbent upon the buyer to spec out the design properly and maintain precise quality control. A lot of companies don't. I toured one of these sewing factories 3 years ago in Guangzhou when we were looking at some private label product lines. They sew fast and there are a lot of "issues", the buyer needs to maintain good QC as mistakes do leave the factories.

From the aspect of maintaining the manufacturing role in the US, I don't agree that it is ok to ship off work to China. But, I think we have already lost that battle.

Edited October 8, 2007 by Cactustactical

[ChuckS]

I can remember this conversation with the word Japan instead of China....

I worked for Xerox in the mid-80's and was on a couple of projects that were joint ventures with Fuji Xerox. The guys over there had one fear for their future business: China. It looks like they were right.

On a side note, our country seems to be pretty good at ignoring the long term for short term profits. The work we were doing at Xerox PARC was some of the first practical work in what we called Large Area Integration. This technology was the technological basis for modern large LCD displays. At the time, the big business was DRAM for PCs and such. We could not get the interest of ANY US semiconductor equipment manaufacturer. The Japanese were more than happy to help. Take a look around the house and car and see what we gave up 20 years ago.

Maybe this should be in a hate thread. Sorry for the thread drift.

Love my 650!

Later,

Chuck

[AlamoShooter]

try buying something ..Fool Proof, like a cast iron pipe fitting. for 1/2" and 3/4" plumbing pipes. And watch the fitting leak like it was made of wood.

Home Depot has most of its cast parts from China. With the steel we get from China it is worst for our safety than Lead in toys. Last year I had a one in ten failure on pipe fittings

[Matt P.]

again,

That sounds like poor quality control from the American company making the product in China.

[EricW]

The reality is this:

- Most of the electronic components used in ANY of the scales discussed here were made offshore.

- The printed circuit board was CERTAINLY made off shore.

- Wire and fasteners are a toss up as to their origin.

When it comes to electronics today, you simply cannot buy Made In America. You can buy Assembled in America. I'm not saying it's right or wrong, just the way it is. I love Made in America, but there's a different reality with electronics and its why that computers today don't cost the equivalent of $5000 to $10K like they did back in 1980.

[mscott]

I hate this topic as much as anyone, but I also have Glocks, Springfields, and Browning guns. Might look at most of your optics and cameras as well. I'd bet Dillon has as good of a handle on quality of this stuff as anyone.

[edwin garcia]

Do i need to check for lead content on my Dillon Electronic Scale then?

[Matt P.]

probably not seeing as all electronic components have changed to a mandatory non lead base construction about 3-5 years ago.

[chuckbradley]

Dillon Electronics scales are / were made under contract by CED ( Competitive Electronics Dynamics), a US company. CED has its electronics made in factories in Guangzhou, China. Guangzhou abuts Hong Kong. This arrangement has been going on for years which is why Dillon used to have its liberal replacement policy. The items did not cost them a lot and it made sense to just replace them when they failed. After a while though, they failed often enough that they had to reduce the warranty down to its current 1 year term.

CED used to also sell Dillon their range bags made in China. Dillon switched to Royal Case out of Texas a few years back based on economic reasons. Royal has factories in the US, Mexico and China also.

*** My info on Dillon products is about a year old, so things could have changed since my last discussion with Dillon buyers concerning these issues.

I do agree with Matt P that almost everything is made in China nowadays. It is incumbent upon the buyer to spec out the design properly and maintain precise quality control. A lot of companies don't. I toured one of these sewing factories 3 years ago in Guangzhou when we were looking at some private label product lines. They sew fast and there are a lot of "issues", the buyer needs to maintain good QC as mistakes do leave the factories.

From the aspect of maintaining the manufacturing role in the US, I don't agree that it is ok to ship off work to China. But, I think we have already lost that battle.

You should also qualify your opinion and let people know the issues in your relationship with CED. I have sold thousands of his products and yes there have been a few problems but he takes care of them.

Matt P is right in that you can control quality. Same goes for things made here, there will be problems with any product.

CED did do Dillons bags and they sold thousands. The quality was good. Dillon decided to go with Royal case who also tried to get me to use them to make my bag. The quality was poor. I was happy with the quality of my bag and didnt want to change. Royal ended up knocking it off anyway, and made it cheaper quality.

I also believe we have a problem as a society in that our manufacturing base is being eroded, in fact mostly gone now. I dont have the answer because we do enjoy lower prices on products we consume. Problem i the quality is gone and everything is disposable now. Maybe it will come full circle when we as a society get tired of the poor quality. I still worry what will happen if the time comes we need to manufacture again like we did during WWII. I do realize a war like that may never happen again due to our nuclear capabilities.

This whole thread reminds me of a truck I saw that said "BUY AMERICAN" on the back window. I asked the owner if they realized how many parts in that FORD truck were imported from other countries? They didnt have a clue. There is almost nothing to day that doesnt have some part of the product made outside this country. Even if its assembled here chances are the components or raw materials come from abroad. The way I look at it those products are still providing jobs and income for Americans, as well as more affordable products.

[Larry White]

In the 70s one of the staunchest supporters of " Made is the USA " was Sam Walton. Now you only have to walk 20 feet into Walmart to realize that Sam is dead.----------------Larry

[Matt P.]

Let's take this thread drift one step farther.

It is a good thing that we are able to buy products made somewhere else just as it is for us to sell our products to other countries. With our weak dollar right now, John Deere is selling more machines overseas than ever. That is an american country selling to other nations. in my opinion, we are creating jobs in the good old usa when we sell products to other countries.

Besides,the Japanese taught us how to make quality products (again in my opinion) when they exported their cars and audio here. We do have to thank them for the CD!!!!!! although my turntable doesn't like to play them!!!!!

[BrianH]

Kinda makes me happy I'm working for a company who's products have said "Proudly Made In Texas, USA" for 40-something years.

[Cactustactical]

You should also qualify your opinion and let people know the issues in your relationship with CED. I have sold thousands of his products and yes there have been a few problems but he takes care of them.

Chuck,

the question was asked about Dillon electronics: How long has Dillon been selling Chinese made products?

I answered based on numerous conversations I have had over the last 10 years with a former retail sales manager and one of the lead purchasing agents for Dillon. Being based in Phoenix, the people that work there are my friends and there really aren't any secrets amongst us about products. All being in the retail industry, we would swap experiences ( both good and bad), leads and tips about our various suppliers and who is doing what in the industry. It is no secret that most electronics come out of China and are made for very little money.

If you are ever in Phoenix, you might want to stop at Dillon and try to get a peek at the Return Storage area. It used to be stacked floor to ceiling with electronic components that got returned under the Dillon no hassle policy. It eventually cost them so much that they reduced it down to a 1 year warranty on electronics: scales, timers, muffs. etc. It wasn't just failures due to manufacture, they had a lot of returns due to customer error and misuse. And it wasn't just Ced stuff, it was across their product base.

Issues with Ced? We no longer have a business relationship with them and have not for going on several years. Aroound 3 years ago, we made several purchases to give their products a trial run with our customer base. They did not sell very well and we made the decision to not make any further purchases. We do this on a regular basis, try new stuff out, if it doesn't sell, we drop the products. No harm, no foul. No issues on our end.

On a positive note, Blackhawk Products Group got negative press a few years ago when it became public knowledge that they had a factory in Saigon, Vietnam. They recently opened their 4th factory here in the US and are relying less and less on foreign made items. Not sure why they are bringing items back on-shore, demand perhaps, but they are doing it.

[chuckbradley]

You should also qualify your opinion and let people know the issues in your relationship with CED. I have sold thousands of his products and yes there have been a few problems but he takes care of them.

Chuck,

the question was asked about Dillon electronics: How long has Dillon been selling Chinese made products?

I answered based on numerous conversations I have had over the last 10 years with a former retail sales manager and one of the lead purchasing agents for Dillon. Being based in Phoenix, the people that work there are my friends and there really aren't any secrets amongst us about products. All being in the retail industry, we would swap experiences ( both good and bad), leads and tips about our various suppliers and who is doing what in the industry. It is no secret that most electronics come out of China and are made for very little money.

If you are ever in Phoenix, you might want to stop at Dillon and try to get a peek at the Return Storage area. It used to be stacked floor to ceiling with electronic components that got returned under the Dillon no hassle policy. It eventually cost them so much that they reduced it down to a 1 year warranty on electronics: scales, timers, muffs. etc. It wasn't just failures due to manufacture, they had a lot of returns due to customer error and misuse. And it wasn't just Ced stuff, it was across their product base.

Issues with Ced? We no longer have a business relationship with them and have not for going on several years. Aroound 3 years ago, we made several purchases to give their products a trial run with our customer base. They did not sell very well and we made the decision to not make any further purchases. We do this on a regular basis, try new stuff out, if it doesn't sell, we drop the products. No harm, no foul. No issues on our end.

On a positive note, Blackhawk Products Group got negative press a few years ago when it became public knowledge that they had a factory in Saigon, Vietnam. They recently opened their 4th factory here in the US and are relying less and less on foreign made items. Not sure why they are bringing items back on-shore, demand perhaps, but they are doing it.

It isnt the first time you have portrayed CED in a negative way. I sell and have sold several electronic products and there are issues with all of them. Its just the nature of the beast. As long as the manufacturer takes care of the issues thats all we can ask for. I understand Dillon doing what they did as far as warranty. I do not understand why they dont warranty the 1050 press for people who do not use them for commercial purposes. I would have to guess most are for personal use. Seems there would be some way to identify commercial presses and noncommercial. But thats beside the point.

CED is just like any reputable business in that they try to offer the best product at the best price.

[mobocracy]

I can remember this conversation with the word Japan instead of China....

I worked for Xerox in the mid-80's and was on a couple of projects that were joint ventures with Fuji Xerox. The guys over there had one fear for their future business: China. It looks like they were right.

On a side note, our country seems to be pretty good at ignoring the long term for short term profits. The work we were doing at Xerox PARC was some of the first practical work in what we called Large Area Integration. This technology was the technological basis for modern large LCD displays. At the time, the big business was DRAM for PCs and such. We could not get the interest of ANY US semiconductor equipment manaufacturer. The Japanese were more than happy to help. Take a look around the house and car and see what we gave up 20 years ago.

Everything got stolen from PARC!

Apple nicked the mouse and the GUI, 3Com got the LAN (at least initially, although I think the founder was a PARC alumni) and Adobe made something out of PostScript..