Limited Optics

[Bdh821]

Just now, touji said:

That's correct. This is the issue I have with the lack of differentiation between the divisions. The only thing that will "really" be different between the guns will be a magwell.

well that and allow 2011/SAO guns to be allowed in.  which if I had to choose, I'd rather have a 2011 than any striker fire gun.  I'm sure most would agree with me?  could be wrong tho

[mikeg1005]

1 minute ago, ksy1 said:

 

I'm fine with this too.

 

Limited is only as active as it is because of new shooters who can bring what guns they have already. I see less and less new shooters doing that every month at my match now, since almost all new shooters I have coming have optics on their handguns.

 

That may be true but its not a reason to intentionally kill a division.  You will see a large number of guys converting their 40 cals over to LO guns because the 2-3 extra rounds that you get in 9mm in a 142mm mag won't be the end of the world until they get new guns all together.  

[Zachjet]

I’ll stick to CO.
  Magwell big whoop.  

[shred]

6 minutes ago, ksy1 said:

Limited is only as active as it is because of new shooters who can bring what guns they have already. I see less and less new shooters doing that every month at my match now, since almost all new shooters I have coming have optics on their handguns.

This is why a mandatory-dot in LO is dumb.  Otherwise it would be a perfect place to put nearly all new shooters-- unless they have a comp or brought an open gun, what they brung would fit.

 

 

[touji]

2 minutes ago, Bdh821 said:

well that and allow 2011/SAO guns to be allowed in.  which if I had to choose, I'd rather have a 2011 than any striker fire gun.  I'm sure most would agree with me?  could be wrong tho

You’ll be competing against other 2011s, so is the competitive advantage still there? I’d rather shoot a striker fired gun in the currently existing CO division, or a DA/SA gun instead if a 2011 in LO

[ksy1]

1 minute ago, shred said:

This is why a mandatory-dot in LO is dumb.  Otherwise it would be a perfect place to put new shooters unless they have a comp.

 

 

So why not just roll it into Limited? Allow major scoring in Limited division with irons only, or allow a slide ride optic in Limited with minor scoring only.

[Bdh821]

I'm still trying to figure out how to get bumped into open from PCC.  I still think major PF PCC should be a thing... but I can already hear everyone crying 

 

[touji]

Just now, Bdh821 said:

I'm still trying to figure out how to get bumped into open from PCC.  I still think major PF PCC should be a thing... but I can already hear everyone crying 

 

There will only be crying if they make a new division called PCC Major

[Bdh821]

3 minutes ago, touji said:

There will only be crying if they make a new division called PCC Major

its off topic so ill stop answering to this, after this post.  but, imagine how many people will have PCC problems if major was a thing!! HILARIOUS!

 

back to LO...  I think it should be a thing.  I'm excited for a new division!  the Oracle 2311 is very appealing for people like me, a Left handed moron

Edited December 28, 2022 by Bdh821

[Boomstick303]

12 minutes ago, shred said:

Anyone that thinks Major needs to "go away" doesn't shoot a lot of Major and doesn't know what it enables.

 

This may be the case, but honestly no one cares.  I have yet to see any new shooters come with what they own and then buy equipment to participate in Limited or Open.  They all go to CO.  

 

Unfortunately I can see a case where Major participation numbers rival production numbers in the next 3-5 years.  I have no desire to ever shoot Major, I do understand that it is a major part of the initial makeup of USPSA, but due to cost mostly, I cannot see many people switching to divisions with Major PF anytime soon.  

[Boomstick303]

12 minutes ago, shred said:

This is why a mandatory-dot in LO is dumb.

 

I never understood this rule.  How does not running a dot give any shooter an advantage?

[Boomstick303]

5 minutes ago, Bdh821 said:

Oracle 2311 is very appealing for people like me, a Left handed moron

 

This is an interesting Platform.  

 

How many Sig P226 X5s are going to be sold?  I think Max Michel pimping that gun was all too telling. Lmao

Edited December 28, 2022 by Boomstick303

[mikeg1005]

Why are so many of you concerned about "a place" to put new shooters?

New shooters show up with what they have, they get put in limited or open if they can't go into production or CO.  They shoot their first match(es) and they figure out wtf they want to do and adjust their equipment accordingly.  Its what EVERYONE has done.  Why do you guys want to make a 'competitive' division for newbies?  Why do you guys want to make a division for people who can't be bother to buy a gun to be competitive in an existing division?  

 

You're going to screw over current members in open, limited, and probably CO... in efforts to allow the random timmies or people who bought a SAO slide ride gun to have a safe space to play in. 

[Bdh821]

Just now, Boomstick303 said:

 

This is an interesting Platform.  

 

How many Sig P226 X5s are going to be sold?

After playing with it at Sig Store, my guess is not a lot.  In my opinion, it is very over priced.  The slide to frame fit was very loose.  The trigger wasnt anything to brag about.  I'm told all the trigger internals are MIM'ed so that means all new guts.  The grip angle from the factory panels makes it feel strange.  This is all my opinion so take it with a grain of salt.  I was very excited about the gun until I held it.  For the price point, I'd rather put another $1000 down and buy a 2011.  There goes my sig sponsorship haha

[mikeg1005]

4 minutes ago, Boomstick303 said:

Unfortunately I can see a case where Major participation numbers rival production numbers in the next 3-5 years.

 

If LO becomes a thing, major will die.   

 

You will kill limited the same CO killed production.  

You will slowly erode open as you'll have 'almost' open with LO and people will slowly opt out of loading 9 major/building open guns and instead build 2011s with dots on the slide. 

[Boomstick303]

Just now, Bdh821 said:

The grip angle from the factory panels makes it feel strange.  This is all my opinion so take it with a grain of salt.  I was very excited about the gun until I held it.  For the price point, I'd rather put another $1000 down and buy a 2011.  There goes my sig sponsorship haha

 

Never mind then, Lmao.

[mikeg1005]

Lets also not forget the fact that STI turned Staccato and turned their back on the competition world.  SV is basically trying to create a sport/matches to compete with USPSA...and you guys want to make a division that will hand them money for the foreseeable future.  

[Boomstick303]

1 minute ago, mikeg1005 said:

If LO becomes a thing, major will die. 

 

 

Most likely.  Even without LO, how many new shooters do you see going into Limited or Open?  Next to none in our region.  Its all CO.   

 

[Bdh821]

1 minute ago, Boomstick303 said:

 

Never mind then, Lmao.

also, the P226 X5 has a reversible mag button, but not slide stop.  The Oracle 2311 is 100% ambi.  Granted a slide stop isnt a deal breaker but I do prefer having one.  Hence why I had a P320 X5 with AXG grip/LOK brass panels.  It makes it feel like a real gun.  Now I can slap on a magwell and maybe figure out how to reload!

 

 

I do think it would have been cool if they did LO Major.  Nils proved major PF isnt needed to win Limited, but the vast majority of us arent going to shoot like Nils.  it could also rekindle the 40 which isnt a terrible thing IMO

[RJH]

3 minutes ago, mikeg1005 said:

 

If LO becomes a thing, major will die.   

 

You will kill limited the same CO killed production.  

You will slowly erode open as you'll have 'almost' open with LO and people will slowly opt out of loading 9 major/building open guns and instead build 2011s with dots on the slide. 

 

So you are saying that LO will be  the division that most people actually want to shoot, with the guns that most people actually want to shoot. So is that a bad thing? I don't think so

[shred]

3 minutes ago, Boomstick303 said:

 

 

Most likely.  Even without LO, how many new shooters do you see going into Limited or Open?  Next to none in our region.  Its all CO.   

 

New shooters don't go there unless they have a .40 or .45.  We're seeing some CO shooters stepping up to Major Open after a year or two of CO.  That HOA is still tempting...

 

[Boomstick303]

Who freaking cares what guns or where they buy guns from to shoot in USPSA.  I will never understand this argument.  It does not matter what shooter B is shooting in regards to you abilities or where you place.  That is entirely up to you and the work you put in.  Not what someone else buys and shoots.  

[Bdh821]

2 minutes ago, mikeg1005 said:

Lets also not forget the fact that STI turned Staccato and turned their back on the competition world.  SV is basically trying to create a sport/matches to compete with USPSA...and you guys want to make a division that will hand them money for the foreseeable future.  

Staccato had to rebrand itself after the huge loss of money from the DVC Open.  I, along with many many others had continuous problems with those guns.   I could get them to run, but the cracked comp was a ticking time bomb of those trubor barrels.  I had 10 replacements due to cracked comps!  TEN!

[Bdh821]

1 minute ago, shred said:

New shooters don't go there unless they have a .40 or .45.  We're seeing some CO shooters stepping up to Major Open after a year or two of CO.  That HOA is still tempting...

 

PCC FTW HOA! 

[touji]

1 minute ago, Bdh821 said:

Staccato had to rebrand itself after the huge loss of money from the DVC Open.  I, along with many many others had continuous problems with those guns.   I could get them to run, but the cracked comp was a ticking time bomb of those trubor barrels.  I had 10 replacements due to cracked comps!  TEN!

I'm surprised they even gave you 10 replacements. I've heard stories of people who couldn't get any support on their cracked DVC guns.