Laser cartridges for dry fire practice

[speederlander]

So I picked up a single laser cartridge with the idea that if it worked well, I could get more and use them for dry fire practice. It's always hitting low though, compared to live fire. It is inches low even at close range (about 2.5 to 3 inches below POA at only 10 feet), getting obviously worse as the distance increases, meaning I have to really change my sight picture compared to live fire to hit targets/detectors. I assume this is because the sights take into account some amount of muzzle rise on the bullet and the final point of impact. Has anyone else played with laser cartridges and had the same experience? Is there some solution to make it work or are lasers a no-go with revolvers?

Edited April 29, 2019 by speederlander

[Paulie]

You’re over thinking this. Use the thing(s) on top of your gun! 

[RevolverJockey]

All of mine are adjustable for POI. Would it be possible to clock them then adjust and bind them into your practice moonclips?

[Flatland Shooter]

7 minutes ago, RevolverJockey said:

All of mine are adjustable for POI.

 

What brand do you have and how do you adjust the laser's POI?   I have one that is a good 4" off at 5 yards/

[speederlander]

1 minute ago, RevolverJockey said:

All of mine are adjustable for POI. Would it be possible to clock them then adjust and bind them into your practice moonclips?

I may be misunderstanding, you have adjustable laser cartridges? I haven't put the laser in a moonclip yet. That's probably a pretty good idea. I'll bet it might have some wiggle otherwise... I will try it tonight when I get home.

[speederlander]

2 minutes ago, Flatland Shooter said:

 

I have one that is a good 4" off at 5 yards/

Yeah, that's pretty much my situation.

[speederlander]

27 minutes ago, Paulie said:

You’re over thinking this. Use the thing(s) on top of your gun! 

No, running around like buck rogers shooting small targets spread all around my yard is fun while being useful. And I save money and don't scare anyone within earshot.

 

To me, laser cartridges and laser detectors are uniquely sweet with revolvers because you can keep shooting in double action. You don't have to rack the slide like you would on a semi. You can practice speed and the whole bit. Plus, like I said, it is good fun.

Edited April 29, 2019 by speederlander

[Hi-Power Jack]

1 hour ago, speederlander said:

 

laser cartridges are uniquely sweet with revolvers because you can keep shooting in double action. 

 

Yes, I don't see an application with my 2011.   But, DA guns would be great.     

[alecmc]

I don't see something like this building good habits, you're training yourself to be looking at your target (seeing if laser hitting a spot ) versus concentrating what you should be looking at, your front sight. 

[Hawk21]

34 minutes ago, alecmc said:

I don't see something like this building good habits, you're training yourself to be looking at your target (seeing if laser hitting a spot ) versus concentrating what you should be looking at, your front sight. 

When used in conjunction with an app you have the ability to keep focus where it should be and view your hits after a dry fire string.  Just ordered the sure strike cartridge and plan to use it with the free G-Sight app, but as jack pointed out with a 2011 I’ll have to cock the hammer each time.  I’ll report back later this week with how the system works out. 

[RevolverJockey]

I use iTarget and it lets you set your center of bullseye off center in the screen so if you have to adjust the scoring rings to line up you can. My lasers aren’t marked for whoever asked earlier. 

Edited April 30, 2019 by RevolverJockey

[Mcfoto]

49 minutes ago, alecmc said:

I don't see something like this building good habits, you're training yourself to be looking at your target (seeing if laser hitting a spot ) versus concentrating what you should be looking at, your front sight. 

 

^^^ this x 1000. Particularly with revolver where one of the goals of dry fire is to maintain sight picture through a double action pull.

[speederlander]

55 minutes ago, alecmc said:

I don't see something like this building good habits, you're training yourself to be looking at your target (seeing if laser hitting a spot ) versus concentrating what you should be looking at, your front sight. 

 

No, the laser only fires when you pull the trigger. You use the sights to shoot just like normal.

 

The hammer drops, the laser flashes briefly. If you are using a detector target, it will light up if you hit it.

Edited April 30, 2019 by speederlander

[RevolverJockey]

1 minute ago, speederlander said:

 

No, the laser only fires when you pull the trigger. You use the sights to shoot just like normal.

 

Agreed. Just so we are sure we are all talking about the same thing - these aren’t like laser boresighters, they are momentary push button activated for a fraction of a second by the firing pin. 

[Hawk21]

https://www.laser-ammo.com/laser-training

 

This link may help some folks get a better idea of what I think the op was discussing.

 

Several similar systems out there, most of the apps are not brand specific and can work with any laser cartridge.

 

G-Sight is the only app I have found that’s free 

[MikeyScuba]

Alec nailed it.  You are training yourself to (I love this term) "look at your work" instead of looking at your next target

 

Surprisingly I haven't developed a severe case of tendonitis dryfireing my 929.  I just started hardcore 2 weeks back, no more C class!

 

It does loosen the screw out on the bottom plate, I should locktite it but it doesn't fall out.  It does on my wife's though.

[speederlander]

18 minutes ago, MikeyScuba said:

Alec nailed it.  You are training yourself to (I love this term) "look at your work" instead of looking at your next target

This is dry fire, and therefore is always going to be different than actual live fire. If you hit a laser detector, you will know it (or not until you look at the total results later) depending on the system you use and/or whether you are paying attention with your peripheral vision. I believe some targets will give you a positive sound. Either way, to me it is just another tool that provides additional feedback on accuracy if that is valuable to you. This is a technology that can be taken advantage of. As with all training aids, it is important not to turn them into a crutch or a producer of bad habits.

 

In any event, I am hoping to figure out if there is a way to fix the original difficulty.

Edited April 30, 2019 by speederlander

[Mcfoto]

Spend your money where you want and you know your training goals. For me, I call my shots in dryfire. Where the sights are pointed when the hammer falls is where my "hit" is. As soon as I get the "click," my eyes are moving to the next target.

[MikeyScuba]

I've been reading and following Steve Anderson's books/podcasts,

seeing your sights & calling your shots is where it's at. I'm not there yet....

 

MWP has jedi like powers in this regard. 

[swordfish]

I only use a laser for draw practice. Set a video camera up facing a wall where my target is, and set the camera to slow mo. Then practice draws and look for any sort of extra movement in the dot, or lack of movement, or whatever. Found out I had a slight pause in my draw stroke because of watching the laser move on the wall. Never really had a use for it besides that.

[elguapo]

On ‎4‎/‎30‎/‎2019 at 11:40 AM, Mcfoto said:

Spend your money where you want and you know your training goals. For me, I call my shots in dryfire. Where the sights are pointed when the hammer falls is where my "hit" is. As soon as I get the "click," my eyes are moving to the next target.

 

+1

 

This is the only way to dry fire correctly.  But there is always someone convinced that the latest gimmick is the way.

 

Rock on dude, I say

[PatJones]

 
+1
 
This is the only way to dry fire correctly.  But there is always someone convinced that the latest gimmick is the way.
 
Rock on dude, I say

+2

Practicing your draw in dryfire you should be trying to beat the par time to a sight picture only, not a trigger pull. Racing to a trigger pull usually encourages bad habits.

[speederlander]

On 5/9/2019 at 10:11 AM, swordfish said:

I only use a laser for draw practice. Set a video camera up facing a wall where my target is, and set the camera to slow mo. Then practice draws and look for any sort of extra movement in the dot, or lack of movement, or whatever. Found out I had a slight pause in my draw stroke because of watching the laser move on the wall. Never really had a use for it besides that.

But again, just to be clear, this isn't that kind of laser. There is no beam on a wall to check for motion. It fires a single instantaneous pulse with a small (size varies) photodetector target. You can still practice establishing your sight picture on the target when you draw but you can also pull the trigger, which strikes the laser cartridge and flashes the laser and get immediate feedback on whether your trigger pull pushed your aim, especially at longer distances.

[swordfish]

5 minutes ago, speederlander said:

But again, just to be clear, this isn't that kind of laser. There is no beam on a wall to check for motion. It fires a single instantaneous pulse with a small (size varies) photodetector target. You can still practice establishing your sight picture on the target when you draw but you can also pull the trigger, which strikes the laser cartridge and flashes the laser and get immediate feedback on whether your trigger pull pushed your aim, especially at longer distances.

ahhhh ok. never used those before. Might be good as long as you don't have to look for the laser and can keep your eyes on the sights. Then go back later and look at your hits and see if your shot-calling is on point.

[RevolverJockey]

I find mine useful with the timer for first shot draws. We also occasionally set them up in the house for “intruder” kinda stuff with our nightstand gun. I don’t think I would have a use for the constant in laser ones but with mine I can’t even see the laser flash.