Nationals Location

[XRe]

Some place in north Michigan 70 or so degrees that time of year, if I'm remembering correctly.... heh heh...

6th or 7th pit of hell, though?? Come on, it's a *DRY* heat.... :lol: Now, if they were, say, on the Gulf Coast somewhere... <shudder> ugh... humidity makes it that much worse...

[BigLucky]

Some place in north Michigan 70 or so degrees that time of year, if I'm remembering correctly.... heh heh...

6th or 7th pit of hell, though?? Come on, it's a *DRY* heat.... :lol: Now, if they were, say, on the Gulf Coast somewhere... <shudder> ugh... humidity makes it that much worse...

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Ever tested the humidity in the oven. It is pretty dry in there but does a good job cooking. I played high school football in El Paso, TX (another "dry heat" city) and running in Dry heat is no better than running in "wet heat".

[XRe]

Ever tested the humidity in the oven.  It is pretty dry in there but does a good job cooking.  I played high school football in El Paso, TX (another "dry heat" city) and running in Dry heat is no better than running in "wet heat".

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I was kind of poking fun at the notion that 110 degrees if fine, because it's *DRY* No, I'll take someplace in the 70s or 80s, if I can get it Too bad we can't go to San Diego or something....

The *only* benefit to dry heat that I've found is that, if you can find some shade, your sweat actually does it's job. Either way, having to chase dehydration all day makes me miserable....

[BDH]

Personally, I don't think that any range can hold up against the whole PASA package. Centrally located... lots of bays... great concessions... and let's face it, Quincy WANTS us there! That said, I am not crazy about the unbelievable heat, or the ticks, and look forward to Nationals moving around. I've been to most of the ranges listed, and would have no problem with Frostproof, East Huntingdon, Reno, or certainly Bend. Also, the USSA facility sounds awesome and needs to be considered once it comes online.

Personally, I am looking forward to the Vegas range for the 3 Gun this Fall since I have not been there before. But am a little concerned about how much longer it will be around based on the comments about housing closing in. Let's face it, Vegas is one of those places that no matter where you are located, you can get there relatively inexpensively (assuming you are flying).

The bottom line is that I agree with Jake, and I will be there no matter where it is located...

[Sam]

There comes a time when we have to ask ourselves if we stand pat with an arrangement that works pretty well, like Barry, or "roll the dice" and go with someplace like Vegas.

Before we decide to move away from something that works, we need to carefully consider what it is that we want our Nationals to become. If it's just a bunch of incredibly talented shooters getting together to compete in an obsure sport in an even more obscure venue, Barry works fine. However, if we want to attract a broader fan base and attempt to move ourselves into the mainstream of extreme sports, then we need to hold our "Super Bowl of Practical Shooting" somewhere that is alot more visible.

Several of the other locations, Frost Proof, Vegas, and Reno are major tourist destinations. If we want to gain more visibility, and I'm not saying that we should, just IF we decide that's the best thing for the longevity of the sport, then it only makes sense to hold the blessed event somewhere that has a few hundred thousand extra tourists from all over the world milling around looking for something new to discover and then advertise and market the match locally as a tourist attraction.

If we don't want to become more visible and risk all the changes that rapid growth might bring, then the old adage, "if it ain't broke don't fix it" certainly applies.

[wgnoyes]

Nothing wrong with Quincy as a town; its certainly not a, um, "gar hole". An hour to the range?! How are you going? We can make it from the Holiday Inn area in 40 minutes with a McD stop for Cindy's egg mcmuffin. (Main drag to 172 south, exit at and follow 72, get off at the Hull/Payson exit and follow that road to the range entrance. Even going the other way through Marblehead doesn't add any appreciable time.

[sfinney]

Sure theres nothing specifically wrong per se with Quincy..... its a town, like most.

But for the average joe who earned a slot, or got one on the waiting list (or decided to just drive in and register late - whats up with THAT? ), the expenses involved with a trip to the Nationals, and the vacation time required just prohibit them from being able to make the trip to somewhere that is not also a tourist type destination. Especially if it s more than a day's drive from home.

Quincy may work great for the dedicated shooters that will go to Nats no matter where its at, and the shooters that happen to live within a decent drive, but for the rest of us either rotate the Nats so everyone has a chance to have one in their backyard at some point, or put it somewhere I can take the family where they can have fun to.

I vote for Frostproof. (and I live in TX, but won't make the drive to Quincy). Failing that put it at the upcoming huge new range in Tulsa, OK so I can make the drive.

[spd522]

Nothing wrong with Quincy as a town; its certainly not a, um, "gar hole".

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Maybe not an agreeable term to use but it fits my opinion of marginally sized towns on major rivers with no notable entertainment value and the aroma of dead fish and sewage in the air. I grew up in such a "gar hole" on the Missouri river- Sioux City, IA.

Tulsa would work should the new range be capable of such an event. Not because it's a 3 hour drive for me but because I always have a great time when I go to Tulsa.

That said, I also go along with Frostproof, Reno, Vegas, Phoenix, or other such capable ranges that are in entertaining areas. I want to take the family and make a vacation of it. Barry is little more than sleep, eat, drive, and shoot. (Repeat)

[Jim Norman]

982 miles driveway to Barry for me. Left Baryy at 5:30 am CDT (0630 EDT) and was home 14-1/2 hours later. Not a bad drive. I am game up to 24 hours of required drive time, which equates to about 1400 miles from NJ, after than we fly.

I agree it would be nicer to have a tourist destination if possible, although that applies to my wife and daughter, since I will be at the range. Frost proof may work if it is during a period where kids are not in school and the temps are acceptable. Otherwise, what use is a tourist destination?

If we can't take advantage because of school or temps, what good is going to a TD? Keep it in Barry, most of the country is within driving distance.

Jim

[Chriss Grube]

Barry is fine as long as it is not in July. I heard all the BS arguements as to why. Kids in school, teachers blah blah. Guess what for the 15 or so Juniors i'm sure they would like a week off of school. The teachers can take a week of vacation just like the rest of us do that work a job that requires more than 180 days of work out of the year. The only reasonable excuse to fry everybody was the warm up for the WS. Go back to mid to late Sept.

[Jake Di Vita]

Guys cmon....this is not a fair weather sport....We aren't always going to shoot in optimum conditions...you all knew it when getting into the sport, and you know it now.

Deal with it.

[GeorgeInNePa]

Guys cmon....this is not a fair weather sport....We aren't always going to shoot in optimum conditions...you all knew it when getting into the sport, and you know it now.

Deal with it.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Yes and no.

What do you say we have the Nationals in East Huntington, Pa in Jan or Feb? 5 to 10 degrees F and some nice snow. It won't happen, and Barry in July shouldn't happen again either.

[sfinney]

Guys cmon....this is not a fair weather sport....We aren't always going to shoot in optimum conditions...you all knew it when getting into the sport, and you know it now.

Deal with it.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I shoot in rain, heat and freezing weather on a semi-regular basis.... I've never not shot a match because of weather. I "deal with it" just fine.

That doesn't mean that you have to PLAN a match in what will be known harsh conditions. Why punish everyone in the heat? Lets have a Nationals in the Fall, at the end of the shooting season.... just like when every other major sport I know of has their championship, at the end of their season.

[zhunter]

Lets have a Nationals in the Fall, at the end of the shooting season.... just like when every other major sport I know of has their championship, at the end of their season.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Some good arguments there

[Flexmoney]

It's a no-win situation. Each and every year...no matter how/when it is done, people always think the grass is greener on the other side.

Having it in the fall...that knocks out the juniors and the school teachers.

[Chriss Grube]

How does that knock out the Juniors and the teachers? Kids take time off to go to disney and everywhere else. School teachers get vaction too not just the extra 3 months the rest of us work! Sorry but that arguement doesn't work. You can't control the weather and sometimes you just have to grin and bear it but 6 days in Barry in July? What next Jan. in Fairbanks? I know of at least 2 people that dropped out due to heat. I'm sure there were more on the verge. Just so we have a Junior count there were 23 that shoot in Barry. I didn't check to see how many shoot both matches so the number could be lower. There where 16 that shot last year when it was in the fall.

[Jim Norman]

OK, Here is a plan, not necessarly a good one, but a plan none the less.

Area1, January

Area2, February

Area3, March

Area4, April

Area5, May

Area6, June

Area7, July

Area8, August

Nationals, September! or even October, Put the three gun USPSA Nats anywhere as it does not have the build up and is still currently a step-child.

By scheduling as above, there are no Area Match conflicts, If we look a bit deeper, we can probably schedule the Section Matches a quarter away form the Area Match in the same area or an adjacent area. THis way there is always a big match and probably a could leser level matches as well as the normal run of club mathces.

Jim Norman

[Bret Heidkamp]

Bret, are you going to forward the poll results to Voigt?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I can only hope that at the end of this thread's life, one or more of the USPSA staffers would print the entire thing out and hand it to each and every board member. It would be a good read for everyone involved in the decision making process. There are lots of good comments - and look how many times this thread has been viewed! That alone should be proof positive that any decisions on nats locations should not be taken lightly by the USPSA board.

[sfinney]

It's a no-win situation.  Each and every year...no match how/when it is done, people always think the grass is greener on the other side.

Having it in the fall...that knocks out the juniors and the school teachers.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Hey, from what I hear it was a heck of a match.... this isn't criticism of the past match so much as suggestions for future ones.

And its not necesarily a "grass is greener" type thing.... we don't need to have it in the spring or fall, summer is just fine. All I'm saying is if you are going to plan it for one of the 2 hottest months of the year, try to have it somewhere cooler.

And you're right, its a thankless world sometimes ; some people will complain about a match location/time/prize structure/size/RO staff/rulings every time, no matter how much everyone else liked it. Been there, done that.

[brother bad]

hot, cold, whatever, where ever.

so it was exceptionally hot this year, even for barry.

such is the nature of the game we play; it's done outdoors in all weathers.

cowboy up.

[wgnoyes]

Barry is fine as long as it is not in July. I heard all the BS arguements as to why. Kids in school, teachers blah blah. Guess what for the 15 or so Juniors i'm sure they would like a week off of school. The teachers can take a week of vacation just like the rest of us do that work a job that requires more than 180 days of work out of the year. <snip>

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

No we can't, either! Sept is right when school is either starting or has already started and teachers can NOT get off during that early part of the school year. Same for afterschool program people, and its NOT a "BS argument". I had to kiss off last year's September nationals precisely for that reason. But do I therefore want it in July? Hell (appropriate term) no, not anywhere! Seems like there might be a lot to be said for very eary October at that range.

[wgnoyes]

Nothing wrong with Quincy as a town; its certainly not a, um, "gar hole".

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Maybe not an agreeable term to use but it fits my opinion of marginally sized towns on major rivers with no notable entertainment value and the aroma of dead fish and sewage in the air. I grew up in such a "gar hole" on the Missouri river- Sioux City, IA.

Been going to PASA and Quincy since 1990. We've never noticed that at any time we've ever been, and that includes the 1993 Flood Nationals.

[sfinney]

Also, sometimes a change of pace is nice just for the heck of it.

The Nats have been at Quincy (central part of the US) many, many times, and recently Bend, OR (West Coast)..... maybe its time we had an East Coast Nats again....

[Alan Meek]

This is not a slam against the Juniors and I do agree that we should be cultivating their participation but the last time I checked it was the United States Pratical Shooting Association, and not the United Stated JUNIOR Practical Shooting Association.

So if we can accomodate the Juniors that participate in the sport we should but we shoud never make a decision based solely on their schedule.

Alan

[ammo_burner21]

I like what they did for the juniors in the 2004 nationals. The shoot through pass with a paying adult. I was able to shoot it in 2 days insted of a week. If it wasn't for that i would of never been able to take a week off of school to go. 2 days sure, but not a week. i do agree with Alan about not baseing the nationals on the juniors schedule. Its nice but were not the ones they make money on.