Perfect Trigger Tune!

[S2cazzo]

First of all I would like to thank all of you here that have posted "TriggerTuning Tips". I have had some amazing results and i would like to share.

I have a brand new, and so called, " Factory Hand Tuned", Small Frame Xtreme Stock 2 that had a brutal 9.5lb DA and a 4.5lb SA. Yuck!

A major polish and off I go to PD and Henning for some parts.

Thank you Joe & Henning for all your help!

• Bolo Interuptor (Drop In-Didn't touch a thing)
• Optimized Reduced Power :
  • Sear Spring, Trigger Return Spring, Firing Pin Spring, & 12lb Hammer Spring
• Xtreme Sear (Touched up by Mr Joe himself)
• 10lb Recoil Spring
• Henning 19lb Trigger Plunger Spring

Check this out...........4lb 5.6oz smooth travel DA and a crisp, clean breaking, 1lb 8.2oz SA with a short reset, and vitually no SA creep. SWEET!

Needless to say, I am extremely happy with the outcome. With a little room on the DA/SA and wanting to bank a harder primer hit,  I replaced the 12lb Hammer Spring with the 14lb spring. DA incresased to a respectable 5lb 3.5oz.and the SA to 1lb 14.2oz.

Thanks again!

 

[ryridesmotox]

I thought I was going to open this and there would be another guy that didnt use the search feature... You have restored my faith in humanity. Thank you sir. Rofl

Have you experimented with what primers it will ignite? Some of these pistols can be mighty tempermental when it comes to setup

Edited December 24, 2016 by ryridesmotox

[B_RAD]

I'm loving all this info about getting these triggers right!

 

The one thing I didn't order was a plunger doing.  

[MemphisMechanic]

You don't want to change the plunger spring, B_RAD.

Upside: Barely noticeable drop in trigger pull.

Downside: Likely reduces upward pressure on the trigger bar enough to cause the hammer to fall too early in DA.

Probably not worth the risk.

Edited December 24, 2016 by MemphisMechanic

[billthemarine2862]

17 minutes ago, MemphisMechanic said:

You don't want to change the plunger spring, B_RAD.

Upside: Barely noticeable drop in trigger pull.

Downside: Likely reduces upward pressure on the trigger bar enough to cause the hammer to fall too early in DA.

Probably not worth the risk.

I had a Henning plunger spring in my S3 from before I installed the BOLO. I went back to the factory spring on the advice of the people in this forum.  The difference is truly remarkable. The benefit provided by the stiffer spring far outweighs any added pull weight you may get.  I went back in and re-polished the entire plunger assembly when swapping out the spring.  (I recommend you use the polishing stone attachment that Ary and MemphisMechanic both reference in these forums to polish inside the plunger head) I have zero zipper feel in my plunger assembly and I have virtually no pre-travel in SA now as well.  I had some pre-travel when using the Henning spring.

[ngodwetrust21]

Tag....

[MemphisMechanic]

39 minutes ago, ARy said:

We recommend you do not change the factory plunger spring. I'm not quite sure where OP got that info - it's been well discussed on here not to swap out.

Guys are chasing better trigger pulls, and lighter springs are always better, right?

I'd have bought one six months ago, before the "PD Optimized" recipe was so widely known and successful.

[MemphisMechanic]

<double tapped>

Edited December 24, 2016 by MemphisMechanic

[B_RAD]

Thanks for the info!

[S2cazzo]

I have not tried igniting any primers , but hopefully CCI and Federal soon.

The plunger spring was an option, that seemed to make sense but your caution makes sense. Memphis, is there any way to determine if the hammer falls to early?

[MemphisMechanic]

8 minutes ago, S2cazzo said:

I have not tried igniting any primers , but hopefully CCI and Federal soon.

The plunger spring was an option, that seemed to make sense but your caution makes sense. Memphis, is there any way to determine if the hammer falls to early?

Ask ARy or Johnbu.

Honestly I'd just go ahead and replace it with the factory one right now.

Weigh your trigger before and after, just for peace of mind that it didn't change much. 

With a 14# hammer spring my S3 will fire anything in DA except for the 1 in 100 CCI's that my Dillon 650 sometimes leaves a couple of thousandths high. In SA it even ignites those.

"High" in this case means they're still below flush, but not buried. Primer depth is now a crucial factor in your gun's reliability, so keep that in mind as the #1 cause of any rounds failing to fire. At least on guns with barrels that have been sent to visit Bevin.  

Edited December 24, 2016 by MemphisMechanic

[johnbu]

The  DA falling too soon can be seen in the pencil launch test. #2 pencil (full length unsharpened) in the barrel eraser first. Hold the gun vertical, fire in da 10x. I stand and look to where the pencil will reach and Mark that on a strip of tape . You may see the launch variability with occasional ones short. Or ALL may be 4-6" shorter than using factory plunger.  They will get shorter with wear / rounding of the interface over time. (Moving parts do wear.)

[PatriotDefense]

9 hours ago, S2cazzo said:

First of all I would like to thank all of you here that have posted "TriggerTuning Tips". I have had some amazing results and i would like to share.

I have a brand new, and so called, " Factory Hand Tuned", Small Frame Xtreme Stock 2 that had a brutal 9.5lb DA and a 4.5lb SA. Yuck!

A major polish and off I go to PD and Henning for some parts.

Thank you Joe & Henning for all your help!

• Bolo Interuptor (Drop In-Didn't touch a thing)
• Optimized Reduced Power :
  • Sear Spring, Trigger Return Spring, Firing Pin Spring, & 12lb Hammer Spring
• Xtreme Sear (Touched up by Mr Joe himself)
• 10lb Recoil Spring
• Henning 19lb Trigger Plunger Spring

Check this out...........4lb 5.6oz smooth travel DA and a crisp, clean breaking, 1lb 8.2oz SA with a short reset, and vitually no SA creep. SWEET!

Needless to say, I am extremely happy with the outcome. With a little room on the DA/SA and wanting to bank a harder primer hit,  I replaced the 12lb Hammer Spring with the 14lb spring. DA incresased to a respectable 5lb 3.5oz.and the SA to 1lb 14.2oz.

Thanks again!

 

Nice numbers Tony! Glad everything worked out for you. These guys are right about the lighter plunger sprinters most gun will let the DA short stroke. Also it gives a much more possitive reset with the factory Spring in place. Glad to see these BOLOs dropping in the SF guns. 

[MemphisMechanic]

36 minutes ago, ARy said:

Memphis Mechanic is trying to give you a more political answer - listen to him.

Everyone gives more 'political' answers than you, Tony.

Abrasive bastard.  

Edited December 24, 2016 by MemphisMechanic

[MissionaryMike]

21 minutes ago, MemphisMechanic said:

Everyone gives more 'political' answers than you, Tony.

Abrasive bastard.  

I'm nodding in agreement as I sit here behind my desk.  BUT... NO ONE has been more helpful, personally, in helping me figure this platform out.  This guys called me at almost 9pm the other night just to follow up on a conversation we had the day before.  I don't know - I kind of appreciated that.  Tony might be some kind of sarcastic on the forums, but he's a pretty chill guy on the phone.

And just to keep this post on topic, OP, I'm pleased to read the trigger weights you achieved using the 12# hammer spring.  Those are the numbers I'd like to see on my piece as well.  I'm basically 1.5# heavier in both my DA and SA than you.  Tony said the sear spring I have on order will help, but I'm not sure it'll shave that much off my trigger weights, especially in DA.  Every one of these guns has its own personality, so we'll see I guess. 

I suppose we can add your gun to the growing list of successfully operating, awesomely triggering Tanfos that are being worked over on the table benches at home.

 

Edited December 24, 2016 by MissionaryMike

[S2cazzo]

Ok, curiosity has me.

Johnbu, I will do a pencil test with current setup, then replace plunger spring back to stock and repeat. Then post what I find.

ARy, not quite sure where I read about the plunger spring replacement, but I thought it was a worthy test. I guess I thought wrong.

Yes, plunger has been polished, and cleaned up of any sharp edges.

Memphis, Dillon is setting the primer just above flush, or slightly high. I will seat them a little deeper.

Thoughts anyone about maybe putting the 13lb PD hammer spring in?

 

Thanks!

 

[MemphisMechanic]

Which Dillon are you running? I modified my 650 to drive primers a little deeper by shimming the primer ram's stop up higher like this:

...and my gun is running a 14 pounder, and flush primers don't hit consistently in double action. The gun sets off anything in SA.

I'd certainly shoot yours with a 14 before considering a lighter spring. If it runs 100% at 14 then you run into issues with a 14, you'll know what your problem is. Won't be wondering.

[johnbu]

Yep, that may show it...may not. It's a fresh gun full of rough areas with fresh bolo and springs, etc.  But, after running a few thousand it's nearly certain to show it. Imagine how frustrating that would be! The "pre-bolo hotness was a weaker plunger spring. It was common to run inkpen springs, trim coils or run the custom springs Henning created.  it's STILL a good mod if you live under a rock...er... haven't installed a BOLO.

42 minutes ago, S2cazzo said:

Ok, curiosity has me.

Johnbu, I will do a pencil test with current setup, then replace plunger spring back to stock and repeat. Then post what I find.

ARy, not quite sure where I read about the plunger spring replacement, but I thought it was a worthy test. I guess I thought wrong.

Yes, plunger has been polished, and cleaned up of any sharp edges.

Memphis, Dillon is setting the primer just above flush, or slightly high. I will seat them a little deeper.

Thoughts anyone about maybe putting the 13lb PD hammer spring in?

 

Thanks!

 

 

[ryridesmotox]

I don't run the Henning. But I do t run the original tanfo spring. I run a cgw firing pin spring for the plunger. I still have excellent reset. 

[S2cazzo]

Merry Christmas everybody!

Joe, I am proud to note that this SF is now an exclusive PD resurected pistol.

Un "Flippin" believable! Going back to a stock plunger spring made a HUGE difference. Just raised the bar utilizing the Bolo.This Tanfo now breaks like my 1911! The little pre travel has been reduced even more, and when the trigger resets, it stops right there. Delivering nothing but a smile on your face on the next SA pull. This alone trumps the minimal pull weight increase in DA.

As expected, and not an issue what so ever, DA did jump up ever so slightly from 5lb 3.5oz to 5lb 4.9oz., but unexpectedly, SA dropped from 1lb 14.2oz to 1lb 11.1oz.

Pencil test showed that with the reduced plunger spring, the pencil flew 14 3/4", and when I put the stock plunger spring back in, it dropped to 12 1/2'. Anyone wish to comment on this? Again, with the 14lb Hammer Spring installed.

ARy  as to your comment " You didn't read anything here, because it's been widely discussed not to use anything other than the stock plunger spring with the bolo"

I know I read it somewhere where you stated that one could use a CGW reduced firing pin spring on the plunger. I just don't have the time to look for it, and honestly, it doesn't matter. I was just experimenting.

Memphis, i have a 550B. It allows seating a primer up to .009" below flush. Not sure if that is deep enough, but time will tell.

[johnbu]

I seat 7.5-ish below flush.

[S2cazzo]

You know when you think you are all done, then think back and say, "What if....?"

I had some down time today, and the "What if..." led me to toatally strip the pistol down and polish the plunger and hammer spring to a nice gloss. I polished up the inner walls of the spring wells. Put everything back together and.......

Get this, an average of 10 pulls, I got 4lb 12.6oz DA and 1lb 5oz SA.

Now to work on case length.

[johnbu]

Which  hammer spring?

[S2cazzo]

PD's Optimized 14lb. Took all the yellow off.

[ryridesmotox]

On ‎12‎/‎25‎/‎2016 at 9:56 AM, S2cazzo said:

Merry Christmas everybody!

 expected, and not an issue what so ever, DA did jump up ever so slightly from 5lb 3.5oz to 5lb 4.9oz., but unexpectedly, SA dropped from 1lb 14.2oz to 1lb 11.1oz.

Pencil test showed that with the reduced plunger spring, the pencil flew 14 3/4", and when I put the stock plunger spring back in, it dropped to 12 1/2'. Anyone wish to comment on this? Again, with the 14lb Hammer Spring installed.

ARy  as to your comment " You didn't read anything here, because it's been widely discussed not to use anything other than the stock plunger spring with the bolo"

I know I read it somewhere where you stated that one could use a CGW reduced firing pin spring on the plunger. I just don't have the time to look for it, and honestly, it doesn't matter. I was just experimenting.

How many times did you pencil test? Take the average of like 5 - 10 at least, just like trigger pull weights

The CGW FP spring and the henning plunger are different.  The firing pin spring from CGW is in my gun. It runs well for me. The henning was a bit light for me. My ham fists couldn't distinguish the reset, so I ended up being slap happy with the trigger. I prefer the CGW FP spring to the OEM spring in the tanfos.