What ammo for .308 Heavy Metal?

[MickB]

So I am playing around with a .308 DPMS G2 for possible entry into the Heavy Metal Division.

With the current modifications, I have the rifle shooting dead flat.

Rifle in question began life as a DPMS G2 Recon, to which was added an SLR SA-7 adjustable gas block, Midwest Industries SS2 KM rifle length handguard, Dynamic Resistance muzzle brake, Hiperfire 3G trigger, and Magpul STR stock on a mil-spec carbine buffer tube.

Right now I am shooting military surplus 147gr FMJ at ~2,850 fps.

As I mentioned earlier, the rifle is shooting dead flat, but there is a definite rearward recoil impulse that makes getting the followup shot on a target not as fast as with a .223 AR pattern rifle.

My question to the Heavy Metal gurus is am I using the right ammo?

Should I be using heavier bullet weight at lower velocity to reduce the rearward recoil impulse?

Am I just fighting the basic laws of physics expecting the .308 to feel like a .223?

Do I just need to hold the rifle like a real man and suck it up?

I am trying to get a point of reference between the .308 and .223 rifles used in our game.

Mick

[michael1778]

I'm not trying to be a pain, just helpful. There have been some threads on similar ammo questions in the past few years. Try searching for a few terms related and see what you find. Int eh past I've found some people talking about lighter bullets for hoser stages and the like.

I think it will depend on if you reload more than anything else.

[gunther5]

I've had good luck with 150gr fmj going 2450fps. About the cheapest 30cal bullets u can get, but they can still reach out 400-500yds recoil is not that bad.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[RiggerJJ]

ever shot a 45 that felt like a 9mm?

same with 308 vs 223. you can make mouse loads, but the difference between them and 223 is 3x the weight in bullets, and about 2x the powder. you just are not going to get 223 performance from a 308. but really, your splits are the least of your worries...

I reload, and use a cheaper 150fmj at a 370pf for close stuff, and the Sierra 155SMK at about 400pf for longer targets. the long range stuff is hot, but that is the best accuracy I get.

jj

Edited May 12, 2014 by RiggerJJ

[bigbrowndog]

I shoot 150/155's at 2700 for everything, better bullets for long range and cheaper bullets for inside 100yds.

I've played with 125/130's, but they require more powder and powder is getting harder to find these days.

Trapr

[co-exprs]

Different loads for different types of matches. At Superstition, I ran 125gr Speer TNT at 2950. At HeMan and Rocky Mountain I run Sierra 155gr at 2675. In general lighter bullets going fast feel softer than heavy bullets. The brake you have is excellent and its designed to work particularly well with 150's. A great deal of the felt recoil in 308 comes from the BCG slamming back and having that gas adjusted just right, really helps. As important as it is to have a 308 set up properly for the best recoil manors, the platform requires a lot from the shooter as well. There is some technique to running 308's fast.

[mic2377]

I have not found a noticeable difference with small changes in bullet weight, however with a big change (110's vs. 175's) I would have to say the lighter bullets are bit softer. Depending on the load, some of the heavier ones can really thump with the high-velocity modern powders available (a 175 gr with a max load of AA 2000-MR comes to mind).

The biggest aid I have felt is getting the gas adjusted correctly, it was a very noticeable decrease in rearward recoil impulse. The comp also helped a lot. They are never going to be nearly as soft/flat as a 223 though, particularly a light run n'gun 308 carbine.

[RiggerJJ]

Oh yea, one more thing, be careful when buying cheap bullets, both loaded and unloaded. Much of the cheap stuff will probably be pulled from military rounds and can be anything from FMJ to AP to tracer. Check em closely before using, espcially at a match!

jj

Edited May 12, 2014 by RiggerJJ

[co-exprs]

+1 What JJ said.

In the end, taming a 308 is more about aligning all of the little details in a system. The right brake, the gas adjusted just right, low mass internals, powder and bullet selection, ergos (I like a short LOP on my 308) are all mechanical changes. The other half of the system is you. How you stand, how you align your mass and muscle behind the rifle are just as important as the gun itself

It's all pretty interesting really. I took what I learned about taming my 308 and applied it to my 12ga pump. Now I can run my shotgun faster and get better scores. My 14yr daughter runs my super nova like a rock star.

Edited May 12, 2014 by co-exprs

[Stlhead]

So you are telling us that running a heavier gun with more recoil, less capacity, and more reciprocating mass is more of a challenge than a lighter gun, with far less recoil, far more capacity, and less reciprocating mass? But I want to buy a new 1-12 daylight illuminated scope that will allow me to hit the targets easily.

Heavy metal is harder than limited,limited is harder than scope Tac, and scope Tac is harder than open. If you seek the maximum challenge shoot HM.

I am a simple guy, I only have 1 load. 155 nosler cc over enough h4895 to squirt em out at 2800 fps, lake city brass, wolf primers. Same load does 100 fps less in my JP, but I can't shoot it nearly as well as I can my LRB. The m-14 is the queen of the heavy rifles, the JP's are nasty little sluts that shoot like a house on fire, but the M-14 is a lady on street, and a freak on the stage!

[rboyes]

I just used the Sierra 125gr match king running about 2950 from an 18" barrel at the He-man nationals and had no issue hitting out to 660 yards (first round hit). They have a flat base, but vld like ogive profile. I have a 1000 155 Amaxs sitting unused in my reloading room because the 125s velocity increase makes up for the 155 bc advantage at common 3 gun distances (I've got better accuracy with them too).

[co-exprs]

So you are telling us that running a heavier gun with more recoil, less capacity, and more reciprocating mass is more of a challenge than a lighter gun, with far less recoil, far more capacity, and less reciprocating mass? But I want to buy a new 1-12 daylight illuminated scope that will allow me to hit the targets easily.

Heavy metal is harder than limited,limited is harder than scope Tac, and scope Tac is harder than open. If you seek the maximum challenge shoot HM.

I am a simple guy, I only have 1 load. 155 nosler cc over enough h4895 to squirt em out at 2800 fps, lake city brass, wolf primers. Same load does 100 fps less in my JP, but I can't shoot it nearly as well as I can my LRB. The m-14 is the queen of the heavy rifles, the JP's are nasty little sluts that shoot like a house on fire, but the M-14 is a lady on street, and a freak on the stage!

LOL. I like your style! Your analogy made me smile.

I wasn't attempting to overstate the obvious. The OP was specifically asking about taming recoil in the 308. Just trying to point out that there are lots of little details to consider and half of them are the shooter.

[Langenator]

but the M-14 is a lady on street, and a freak on the stage!

So what would that make an M1 Garand? Betty Page?

[caz41]

So you are telling us that running a heavier gun with more recoil, less capacity, and more reciprocating mass is more of a challenge than a lighter gun, with far less recoil, far more capacity, and less reciprocating mass? But I want to buy a new 1-12 daylight illuminated scope that will allow me to hit the targets easily.

Heavy metal is harder than limited,limited is harder than scope Tac, and scope Tac is harder than open. If you seek the maximum challenge shoot HM.

I am a simple guy, I only have 1 load. 155 nosler cc over enough h4895 to squirt em out at 2800 fps, lake city brass, wolf primers. Same load does 100 fps less in my JP, but I can't shoot it nearly as well as I can my LRB. The m-14 is the queen of the heavy rifles, the JP's are nasty little sluts that shoot like a house on fire, but the M-14 is a lady on street, and a freak on the stage!

That is fantastic!!! I bet John has never heard of his rifles being referred to as that before. Maybe a new ad slogan?

[HRider]

I run full power 147 ball (whatever non magnetic flavor that I can find) for anything less than 100yds. Over 100, my AR10 likes Freedoms 155Amax load. It averages 2723fps out of my 20" barrel and is very accurate.

Hurley

[StealthyBlagga]

Bear in mind that IMA-SMM3G rules stipulate a minimum HM power factor of 360, so you have limited wriggle room when downloading.

[Stlhead]

But what match actualy chronos to verify compliance?

[JBOT5000]

I would run hornady steel match 155's for the hoser stages and hornady 178 bthp for the long range stages. You probably don't need the 178's for the ranges we shoot in 3 gun but hey shoot the best when you're gunning for a 500 yard target.

[1chota]

Sierra 135 gr. match kings BTHP, flies great past 600 yards.

[Dustbuster1]

!

I bet John has never heard of his rifles being referred to as that before. Maybe a new ad slogan?

"Always a happy ending with JP Rifles, hot n tight built to please!"

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk 2 of course it ate my spelling.

[LSnSC]

Hornady Steel Match for everything near or far.

[ken hebert]

110 vmax on 49g of 748, does 3180 out of my 20" dpms barrel, hits em near n far. 9" less drop at 500yds, pitifully little recoil, and cheap.

[Dan Sierpina]

110 vmax on 49g of 748, does 3180 out of my 20" dpms barrel, hits em near n far. 9" less drop at 500yds, pitifully little recoil, and cheap.

The issue is, 110 V Max bullets are still suspended production.

[mic2377]

Another bullet to try is the Speer 125 TNT's. They are around the same cost as the 110 V-Maxes and can be pushed pretty fast. I have shot a bunch of them in both 300 BLK and 308 and they are accurate enough to get the job done...

[EaZeNuTZ33]

I'm within driving distance of Sierra Bullets.....and their outlet store. i opted to run one load since my bullets were a smidget cheaper than usual. 155gr Sierra Palms HPBT pills chrono'd around 2800fps out of my 18" barrel. They are SCREAMING and accurate, but luckily haven't shown pressure signs.