Rugster Posted January 31, 2012 Share Posted January 31, 2012 So I have a few friends who shoot...and they know that I reload. They understand that reloading saves money and they want me to pass on the savings to them. I enjoy reloading, I find it relaxing so I have no problem at all doing the actual work for it. I don't do it for the money, although I admit that I make a few bucks here and there. The main reason I do it is so they can afford to shoot as much as I do. What I have realized is that I'm not sure the benefits outweigh the risks. I have full confidence in my reloading capabilities and my attention to detail, however even the best of us have/will load a squib sooner or later. My friends are purely recreational shooters and I'm not positive the would even understand what a squib load is, let alone how to deal with or recognize one. So my question is do you load for your friends? Why or why not? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarkCO Posted January 31, 2012 Share Posted January 31, 2012 NO, not worth the risk. I will let friends use my equipment though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amerflyer48 Posted January 31, 2012 Share Posted January 31, 2012 Get them hooked on a new aspect of their hobby,invite them over for social gathering and show them how easy it is.. You don't want to live with knowing you almost cost a friend his gun and possible use of hands because you made a mistake, Ask me how I know...BTW Detonics make tough little guns Also making money by reloading (manufacturing) ammo is a problem with the Feds. there's licenses etc. needed to do that for me it doesn't pass the risk/reward test. but I will teach any of my friends how free of charge John Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmerritt Posted January 31, 2012 Share Posted January 31, 2012 As much as i would like to, i "just say no", now, if a friend wants to come over and use my machine, and brings everything he needs, i will let him, as long as he doesnt wear out his welcome. i have a 650, so once he gets used to it, i let him have at it. to me, loading for someone else, is a bad idea. squibs, maybe he doesnt make PF at a match, who works up his loads?,what if OAL is not right and it doesnt run? so if anything goes wrong its YOUR fault. on the other hand, i would gladly help them get started, but they can load there own. just my 2cents worth, Ray Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alpha-charlie Posted January 31, 2012 Share Posted January 31, 2012 No way. Liability from a squib or double charge is way too high. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlueOvalBandit Posted January 31, 2012 Share Posted January 31, 2012 (edited) Now here's a question related to reloading for a friend. I have a friend that wants to shoot, he has a 1911, but it one of the 3 in barrel compacts. I offered to let him shoot my 5in full sized and he can use my reloads at my cost to produce (I actually rounded down so I'm actually loosing money but it's ok to shoot with a friend). Yay or nay? Edited January 31, 2012 by BlueOvalBandit Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flexmoney Posted January 31, 2012 Share Posted January 31, 2012 Illegal, right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alpha-charlie Posted January 31, 2012 Share Posted January 31, 2012 Not 100% sure, but I think the wording used in that statute has something to do with manufacturing ammunition with the intent to make a profit from it's sale. Still not a good idea. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlueOvalBandit Posted January 31, 2012 Share Posted January 31, 2012 (edited) Took a little while to dig through the atf site but Q: Is a person who reloads ammunition required to be licensed as a manufacturer? Yes, if the person engages in the business of selling or distributing reloads for the purpose of livelihood and profit. No, if the person reloads only for personal use. [18 U.S.C. 922(a) (i) and 923(a), 27 CFR 478.41] Now then comes whats the legal definition of livelihood and profit. Sounds like more trouble than its worth even if they are my own guns, it just sucks that they have to pay twice as much for ammo instead of the price of raw components. Edited January 31, 2012 by BlueOvalBandit Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chills1994 Posted January 31, 2012 Share Posted January 31, 2012 Oh, yeah, all the dang time! And when I make too much ammo for my friends, I just go out to the street corner...ya, know those guys at the ball stadium. COLD BEER HERE! Yeah, it's like that, but I say .45 AMMO HERE! GET YOUR FRESH OFF THE PRESS .45 AMMO HERE! the only bad thing about making ammo in those kind of quantities is the press gets kinda clog with all that excess powder. I just scoop it into each case with a tablespoon and then use a butter knife to level off the powder. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdphotoguy Posted January 31, 2012 Share Posted January 31, 2012 (edited) It's one thing if I blow up my own gun and/or get hurt with one of my reloads (believe me, that is something I'm very diligently trying to avoid), but I'm not going to risk doing that to a friend. Edited January 31, 2012 by jdphotoguy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flack jacket Posted January 31, 2012 Share Posted January 31, 2012 I got a friend into practical shooting last March. Taught him how to load and now he loads on my press for himself. Buys his components and our schedules work out so he can load when I'm available and he saves hundres of dollars not having to buy new gear. More budget for more components. He's a engineer specializing in robotics, so he like to keep the(my) machine in clean working order. Thanks JD ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rugster Posted January 31, 2012 Author Share Posted January 31, 2012 Took a little while to dig through the atf site but Q: Is a person who reloads ammunition required to be licensed as a manufacturer? Yes, if the person engages in the business of selling or distributing reloads for the purpose of livelihood and profit. No, if the person reloads only for personal use. [18 U.S.C. 922(a) (i) and 923(a), 27 CFR 478.41] Now then comes whats the legal definition of livelihood and profit. Sounds like more trouble than its worth even if they are my own guns, it just sucks that they have to pay twice as much for ammo instead of the price of raw components. Exactly. Now I don't actually make any profit in the form of cash. Generally I break even and they owe me a few Chipotle burritos, or maybe they buy their components and I get to snag 100 bullets from their box of 1000. That's neither here nor there, as I'm not worried about law related issues. As I said, I just want my friends to be able to shoot as much as I do. I love the sport and the hobby. In regard to showing them how to reload, I have suggested this to one of them and he was uninterested. That's his own fault. He is not local so he cannot use my machine. However, MY 650 is actually at a friends house along with my entire reloading setup. I lived with him out of college and when I moved into a condo, I didn't have anywhere to setup the equipment. So he is welcome to use any of the tools whenever he would like. He loads 38 Super and I load mostly 9mm so it's a terribly simple changeover. And in return I can go over whenever I want to load (still have my key to his house). Basically I just want as many of my friends to experience the sport as possible. The problem is that most of my friends are in their 20's, paying student loans and trying to catch up. They all love guns, but hate buying ammo. Looks like it's time that I have a loading party and put on a clinic to show them how easy it really is and maybe get them interested in that aspect Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drysideshooter Posted January 31, 2012 Share Posted January 31, 2012 With regard to the friend that isn't even interested in learning how to reload, but just in having you reload for him, I certainly wouldn't load any more for him. I will work up loads for friends guns for them. I take their gun, work up and shoot some loads to zero in on a good load for them. I enjoy doing it and have all of the tools for measuring distance to the lands and such for rifles. I will give them the recipe for the load that worked well in their gun, along with the targets that were shot, but it's up to them to duplicate the load if they want to. I would never actually reload ammo for someone though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canuck223 Posted January 31, 2012 Share Posted January 31, 2012 I used to reload for friends. I still do at times but only with thier hands on involvement. I tend to process brass in bulk, and have a few pails of sized and primed brass sitting around. If a friend needs ammo, I'll bring the chronograph to the range and let them check my standard load in thier gun. From there we can adjust the powder to suit thier gun and needs. They are involved and make the final decisions, and are behind the controls while the powder goes in and the bullets are seated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
motosapiens Posted January 31, 2012 Share Posted January 31, 2012 complicated question. If I thought there was *any* significant chance I would blow up someone's gun due to my mistake, that would mean I might blow up my own, so I better either stop reloading, or pay more attention. OTOH, if you teach a man to fish, instead of just giving him a handout, you are helping to create independence. You know the saying, light a man a fire and he'll be warm for an hour, light a man on fire and he'll be warm for the rest of his life. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PKT1106 Posted January 31, 2012 Share Posted January 31, 2012 I reload plinking/practice rounds for my FIL and BIL for 9mm and .223 and hunting rounds for 30-30 and .270. They buy the components (or I use what I have on hand) and I load them up and try the first few rounds. I don't load anywhere near max loads, mostly low to medium power (with medium being for hunting). I won't load anything for anyone for competitions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hkguy Posted February 2, 2012 Share Posted February 2, 2012 i will let friends use my reloads if i am at the range with them, however i will not reload for them. If they want to get the components around and run the machine, i will show them the ropes and let them roll their own. Too much liability involved should something bad happen. I dont care how good of a friend they are you never know if they will sue your pants off for using YOUR ammo and getting hurt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blueeyedme Posted February 2, 2012 Share Posted February 2, 2012 Timely topic! At my club's fun match on Tuesday night one shooter had a KB (no injury thank goodness). When asked about his ammo, he said he was buying it from 'a friend'. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chaosshooter00 Posted February 2, 2012 Share Posted February 2, 2012 I welcome our new guys to use my guns and reloads to help get a feel for it. I have never reloaded for a friend as my local ATF buddy strongly cautioned against it, but I have gotten the four guys who reload on my machine to purchase their own heads, dies,etc., so there is no confusion or finger pointing about where loads came from. We call it the "True Shooter Starter Kit" and when they are able, I expect each to get their own machine. It really weeds out the serious guys from those that just want to take advantage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill M Posted February 2, 2012 Share Posted February 2, 2012 I reload varmit rounds for my dad, I normally buy the components and reload, but I like to get him out shooting so it worth it. I will let some friends reload on my machines, and many times help them get everything setup. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pops1982 Posted February 2, 2012 Share Posted February 2, 2012 Get them hooked on a new aspect of their hobby,invite them over for social gathering and show them how easy it is.. You don't want to live with knowing you almost cost a friend his gun and possible use of hands because you made a mistake, Ask me how I know...BTW Detonics make tough little guns Also making money by reloading (manufacturing) ammo is a problem with the Feds. there's licenses etc. needed to do that for me it doesn't pass the risk/reward test. but I will teach any of my friends how free of charge John Ok, how do you know? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
59Bassman Posted February 2, 2012 Share Posted February 2, 2012 I have reloaded for family, and will occasionally let a friend shoot a match with my gun. If they don't want to buy factory, and understand that they're shooting reloads, I don't mind providing the ammo. But I won't sell it, or sure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kevin c Posted February 8, 2012 Share Posted February 8, 2012 (edited) No. I would, if asked, show folks how to load on my equipment, but then it is up to them to actually roll their own. Remember, it's not just your friend who might suffer, but his family. An injured friend might cut you slack, but you might, in the worst case scenario, be dealing with a bereaved family who likely won't have any qualms assigning you blame and financial liability, especially if they have anything close to dire financial straights as a result of the loss. Not even with heavy duty liability coverage would I want the risk. I have my own family to consider. Edited February 8, 2012 by kevin c Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ultimo-Hombre Posted February 18, 2012 Share Posted February 18, 2012 Isint the uber emphasis on liability just a bit much? The friends I let shoot my reloads are big boys. Besides Ive seen/had KB's over the years and besides some missig meat and simple fractures havnt seen "shattered lives and grieving widows" Time to utterly flame the new guy? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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