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As others have said, use whatever reliable data to can find for the powders you have and start at the lower end of the range of charge weights. If your data is for jacketed bullets, you will need to back off a little. 5 grains of bullet weight has little meaning at the lower end of the pressure range. All that said, I run 185's with Solo for major and minor. Start around 3 grns for minor and about 4 for major @ 1.15 in my M&P Pro. You should still have some pressure cushion and you can adjust charges as needed for varying OAL. The longer your OAL, the more powder you are going to need to make a higher PF.

I would second a number of things that others have mentioned. Solo has become a fairly popular powder for major .40 with heavier bullets. I personally use the Precision 185's, but as Dustin mentioned, the Bayou's and others would probably work just as well. Definitely load a little longer than "spec", out around 1.15-1.16 seems to be the happy place. I've been doing it for a year now and haven't had any pressure issues at all.

Here is someone elses 2 cents...I started shooting limited with an m&p. its been an awesome pistol for me. magwell from sss and trigger job by Dan Burwell. you can get a used one for under $500. That said, I also just got into my first 2011. Its used and awesome-er.

cb, You shouldn't ever do a "chamber check" with a magazine inserted. Slide will never ease forward with an empty mag inserted unless you disable the slide lock function. When empty mag is in gun and slide moves to the rear, the follower in the mag pushes the slide lock up into the notch in the slide and licks it open. You can over-power it with your thumb. No chamber checks with mags inserted. Slick looking pistol.

To the couple of folk who mentioned trouble with the slide locking back on empty with certain types of magazines, I bought a couple of different slide stops and found that changing to an Ed Brown slide stop fixed the issue without any other changes.

I am also curious about being able to lighten the slide after the sight tracker groove is cut. I talked to SV about a 6" sight tracker and was discouraged from considering that option as it would end up with a "muzzle heavy" pistol. It seems that some material could be removed from the barrel's rib too.

I may have missed it if anyone else has mentioned it, but I didn't see anyone mention the fact that you are probably going to want to upgrade from a single-stage to a progressive press in the very near future. Keep in mind that this project is going to set you back a few bucks as well. Other than that, I think that you have read most all of the thoughts that I have had while going through the same process as you. I started shooting IDPA(CDP) and USPSA (SS & L-10) with a 1911. I spent 2 seasons getting ragged about needing more ammo per magazine. I got a ton of reloading practice during that time. I had to make the move to limited on a budget, so I went with the M&P. It's been awesome and has almost always gone bang if I did my part with the ammo. I just happened upon a great deal on a 6" 2011, ad I snatched it up as quick as I could. I have no notion that the new gun is going to immediately elevate my ability, but I am happy to have the opportunity to try it. I have found out that it makes hitting small targets at longer distances much easier. Like others have said, go with what you think is going to work best for you. DEFINITELY try (patiently) to find a used version of what you think you want to start with. I can almost guarantee that there will be something that you want to change after shooting the gun for a little while. After you get some time behind the platform that you like, then you will be better prepared to pick the features that you want in a new "custom" built pistol if you still feel the need to go that route.

Well, not sure what kind of luck the rest of you guys are having, but I haven't seen or heard anything from this company that has been holding my $$ for a month or so now... Anyone else received their back-ordered product?

You can go either route you would prefer. The problems that you see are not inherent issues with the model of pistol; they have to do with who built it, what crazy "shadetree" mods have been done to it and what kind of low-power out of spec reloads are being run through it. Determine which style of pistol you want to play with and then find the right maker/'smith to get you a reliable version. Once you have found all that, remember that any changes that you make to the gun, the magazines, or the ammo could cause issues with reliability. And, there are other "steel" pistols out that that you can consider as well, CZ's, Beretta's, etc...

what Biker said. that ain't no hill for a climber...

are you bragging or offering these for sale?

I'm curious about what all you folk with a TON of experience suggest as far as tubes, basepads, and guts for 1-3 new .40 mags. I would like to squeeze max capacity out of at least one (use it when the extra round or 2 helps) and then have 2 more for reloads/backups to the mags that I got with my pistol. This is for an STI-gripped frame. I got started in SS about 2.5 yrs ago and then went to L-10 with the same pistol. I've now been shooting limited with an M&P Pro for about a year, and I just got a great deal on a well-used 6" .40 STI with 3 very well-used mags. Thanks in advance. This mag stuff is pretty confusing to someone who has never had to deal with different stuff like this before; all the other stuff I've shot has either been limited by division or the fact that there are not many options with the M&P. ***I've now been directed to the 1911/2011 forum with mag discussions instead of this one about "accessories" ie - mags. Please forgive.

Talk to Jeff at C-rums. Hes on this forum and is something of a carrier guru. He welds up lots of different company's lifter to save thumbs. He will know what you need to do, and he can get your scattergun loading just right.

+1 for the SJC Titan. It is harsh, but very effective. Side note, it kinda looks like the Miller Hammerhead resembles what a 2-port Titan might look like...

+1 for the Speer TNT's. I understand that we all wish that we could find a load with the perfect trajectory and low recoil and high velocity and low wind drift, etc, etc. The fact remains that for any one of those things to be the "best", you have to give a little on the others. I did a good bit of work with this myself, and there are VERY few 3-gun matches that require better than 3 MOA accuracy. I've been through a couple thousand of the TNT 125's and I can reliably ring 8-12 in gongs at 300-400 yds with open sights on my 16 in M1A. The great thing about this load is that it is easy on recoil and combined with my Titan comp, it makes for an HM combo that can blast through a run&gun stage with the best of them and still be counted on to hit most reasonable long-range targets. If you are expecting stages beyond 300-400, have specific ammo for that.

I'm no Chuck, but I promise you that everyone competitive has a comp on their HM rifle. Some of them look pretty funny, but def get a comp. It makes a TON of difference in calling hits and transitioning. I've used the JP and the Titan. I stuck with the Titan. I have the Stainless JP that I would let go for about $75 shipped.

To address your original question, it depends on the match. As mentioned earlier, some matches specify rounds in mag, others specify mag capacity. You can makes blocks for the mags that work, and you will find that most matches are getting a bit more lenient and allowing 10 rds in the pistol mags and 20 in the rifle mags at the start. To be safe, you will need to check the wording of the HM rules at the matches you intend to shoot. 25's make for much easier topping off to start 20 + 1 at the beginning of stages where you need them all, and I think that the slightly longer 25 rd mags are a little easier to seat, maybe due to a little extra leverage. Also, should you happen to get bumped for ammo not making PF, you can then load up your 25 rd mags.

John, I want to see that thing when you get it!

You may find that covering those ports is not a very easily accomplished task. I'm fairly certain that tin foil will be blown to bits the first time you pull the trigger. You would probably end up needing some kind of clamp-on device that can stand up to a fair amount of pressure. Those ports work to reduce muzzle-rise by venting some of the combustion gases upward. Those gases are under a fair amount of pressure to propel the shot column down the barrel...

Just 2 cents from a guy who has mostly been running a pump gun...Saigas are tough to keep running through an entire match. All the bells and whistles that make it so potentially awesome for 3-gun also add to the complexity of the system. One of the guys that I shoot with a few times a year has one that looks awesome, but he has yet to make it through an entire match with it running. He's $3-4K into the gun, but that doesn't mean anything when it doesn't cycle reliably. No amount of awesome on paper is going to matter unless it actually runs. Reliability is the biggest issue I see at this point.

Oh, and I picked mine up "used" from a shop in my area for $750. The box was missing, but other than that you couldn't tell that it had seen a shell. It is the composite model with black stock and gray-stuff-coated metal.

I've had my SX3 for about 6 months now. I've not had a single hiccup out of it running any loads from 1oz Wal-mart stuff to HV Winchester 1oz slugs. I've also put some Heavy Field loads (1.25 oz) of 4's and 6's through it on stages with longer steel. My first upgrade was an extension tube and bolt handle; I chose both from Briley. I was able to screw the extension on and run through a few boxes of shells without any cycling trouble from the gun. The trouble came from my loading thumb. That lifter tried to eat it. So, I sent it off to Jeff (C-rums) and he had it back in short order. All has been great with it since then too. The gun is now in TX at the Briley shop being fitted with their enlarged bolt release and having the barrel trimmed to 24". The gun is one of if not the most lightweight options out there. My guess is that it is only going to get better after Briley has finished with it.

One other thought is clipping the pouches over both the inner and outer belt. It may depend on when you bought your pouches, but the ones that I got from Chris have just the right clearance inside the clip to be nice and snug when clipped over both belts. They stay in place and ensure that the belts don't try to separate. The down side is that you have to remove them to get in and out of your belt(s)...

Here's one other thought if you shoot 3-gun... Most of the 3-gun matches do not require a minimum power factor; you just have to have enough energy in your rounds to knock down whatever steel targets are included. So, many Tactical class 3-gunners (basically using Limited USPSA pistols) are going to 9mm for the increased capacity. If you are speaking strictly of USPSA Pistol competition, its all about the extra points when shooting major. Most all the top shooters shoot major; there's a reason for that. If you're shooting fast enough to be competitive, you are going to shoot some C's. With major scoring you can afford to cut some corners and shoot for C's in some situations to save a little movement which equals time.

Its very interesting that this thread is the first one that came up since I experienced this same issue at the AL match last weekend. I've run 3500-4000 rounds through the pistol without a hitch, and of course the first time I experience this phenomenon is at a major match. On three different stages I experienced a random round being chambered and hit with the firing pin, but not igniting the primer. I believe that I will reach out to my S&W contact about a new striker and see what happens after installing a new one.