TravisNC Posted April 3, 2017 Share Posted April 3, 2017 (edited) At a match recently a shooter was unable to unload and show clear due to a round being stuck in the chamber. After several attempts to eject the round, the shooter fired the round into the back berm to clear the malfunction. It was determined that this shot wasn't part of his stage run and therefore didn't count against his time. Is that correct? Edited April 3, 2017 by TravisNC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve RA Posted April 3, 2017 Share Posted April 3, 2017 If he was directed to do so by the RO then I'd say it is correct. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TravisNC Posted April 3, 2017 Author Share Posted April 3, 2017 Just now, Steve RA said: If he was directed to do so by the RO then I'd say it is correct. Got it, thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kraj Posted April 3, 2017 Share Posted April 3, 2017 Your allowed to shoot until the "if clear, hammer down, holster" command. If they was unable to show clear the command shouldn't have been given so no issues Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TravisNC Posted April 3, 2017 Author Share Posted April 3, 2017 6 minutes ago, Kraj said: Your allowed to shoot until the "if clear, hammer down, holster" command. If they was unable to show clear the command shouldn't have been given so no issues My only confusion was whether or not the last shot should have been on the clock, thus adding ~30 seconds to the stage time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RJH Posted April 3, 2017 Share Posted April 3, 2017 It was probably not added. As an RO I have more than once had this happen to a shooter I was running. I simply made sure we had the correct time wrote down and the had the shooter fire the gun into the berm, then ULSC as usual. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blueeyedme Posted April 3, 2017 Share Posted April 3, 2017 I would call that a malfunction during the COF. 5.7.6 allows the RO to terminate the COF due to the malfunction in which case it is scored as shot. Then the malfunction can be cleared off the clock. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thermobollocks Posted April 3, 2017 Share Posted April 3, 2017 50 minutes ago, blueeyedme said: I would call that a malfunction during the COF. 5.7.6 allows the RO to terminate the COF due to the malfunction in which case it is scored as shot. Then the malfunction can be cleared off the clock. That's surprisingly reasonable. I've always wondered how the rulebook interprets such a situation... I see it more in Steel Challenge with rimfire shooters not wanting to retain the last round after it's been fed in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CHLChris Posted April 3, 2017 Share Posted April 3, 2017 (edited) But the RO must have been the one directing that shooting into the berm be the course of action. If a shooter is trying to "If finished, ULSC" but chooses on his own to shoot into the berm and THEN unload and show clear, then the shot should be on the clock. @TravisNC wasn't clear with that detail of his query. Edited April 3, 2017 by CHLChris Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TravisNC Posted April 3, 2017 Author Share Posted April 3, 2017 12 minutes ago, CHLChris said: But the RO must have been the one directing that shooting into the berm be the course of action. If a shooter is trying to "If finished, ULSC" but chooses on his own to shoot into the berm and THEN unload and show clear, then the shot should be on the clock. @TravisNC wasn't clear with that detail of his query. Technically, the CRO/shooter was telling the person running the timer his intention. Sorry for leaving that off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim Watson Posted April 4, 2017 Share Posted April 4, 2017 I call it "Ask permission to unload through the muzzle." Kind of like the baseball batter does not call time out, he requests the umpire to call time out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BeerBaron Posted April 7, 2017 Share Posted April 7, 2017 I think it's fair enough if the dude couldn't eject the round (weakling) he can tell the RO and ask permission to fire it into the berm. at that point RO needs to check the time on the timer and relay it to the scorer, ensure no one has encroached the range, then allow the shooter to fire the round (or even better the RO should have taken over control of the gun and just cleared the MALF or then fired it if he had to). to clarify, if he stops shooting and RO asks "IFUASC" and he can't ULASC then that is a malfunction during the COF as the attempt at the COF ends @ "RIC" ie., when shooters hand comes off a holstered pistol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gary Stevens Posted April 12, 2017 Share Posted April 12, 2017 The COF ends when range is clear is announced. Simple process, the RO records the time, then directs the shooter to shoot into the berm. Clear gun, announce range is clear, and proceed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
prestonj12 Posted April 12, 2017 Share Posted April 12, 2017 But the RO must have been the one directing that shooting into the berm be the course of action. If a shooter is trying to "If finished, ULSC" but chooses on his own to shoot into the berm and THEN unload and show clear, then the shot should be on the clock. [mention=63013]TravisNC[/mention] wasn't clear with that detail of his query.True that. If the shooter chose to unload and show clear by firing the last round it's on the clock. If the RO directed the shooter to clear the malfunction by firing into the berm. Off the clock. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bret Posted May 1, 2017 Share Posted May 1, 2017 On 4/12/2017 at 9:08 AM, Gary Stevens said: The COF ends when range is clear is announced. Simple process, the RO records the time, then directs the shooter to shoot into the berm. Clear gun, announce range is clear, and proceed. How can the R.O. call range is clear when the shooter still has a loaded gun? Time stops on last shot fired. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blueeyedme Posted May 1, 2017 Share Posted May 1, 2017 5 minutes ago, bret said: How can the R.O. call range is clear when the shooter still has a loaded gun? Time stops on last shot fired. 5.7.6 allows the RO to terminate the COF due to the malfunction in which case it is scored as shot. Then the malfunction can be cleared off the clock. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bret Posted May 1, 2017 Share Posted May 1, 2017 1 minute ago, blueeyedme said: 5.7.6 allows the RO to terminate the COF due to the malfunction in which case it is scored as shot. Then the malfunction can be cleared off the clock. Thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gary Stevens Posted May 1, 2017 Share Posted May 1, 2017 4 hours ago, bret said: How can the R.O. call range is clear when the shooter still has a loaded gun? Time stops on last shot fired. If he shoots it into the berm, and the RO clears the gun, etc., the gun is no longer loaded so Range Clear can be called. What am I missing? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bishop414 Posted May 1, 2017 Share Posted May 1, 2017 With PCC joining the mix, we had at least 2 or 3 cases on our stage during Area 2. Competitor could not get the charging handle to move, or eject the live round. Recorded time, shot the berm, cleared gun, next shooter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Youngeyes Posted May 2, 2017 Share Posted May 2, 2017 3 hours ago, Gary Stevens said: If he shoots it into the berm, and the RO clears the gun, etc., the gun is no longer loaded so Range Clear can be called. What am I missing? I believe that bret thought you meant that the range is clear was announced first. THEN the RO records the time and directs the shooter to shoot the berm "The COF ends when range is clear is announced. Simple process, the RO records the time, then directs the shooter to shoot into the berm." Maybe not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SW4me Posted May 9, 2017 Share Posted May 9, 2017 On 5/1/2017 at 5:46 PM, bishop414 said: With PCC joining the mix, we had at least 2 or 3 cases on our stage during Area 2. Competitor could not get the charging handle to move, or eject the live round. Recorded time, shot the berm, cleared gun, next shooter. We have been doing this a lot with the Palmetto State 9mm carbines. Seems like everyone bought their guns around the same time and the chambers are tight as hell Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flatland Shooter Posted May 9, 2017 Share Posted May 9, 2017 33 minutes ago, SW4me said: We have been doing this a lot with the Palmetto State 9mm carbines. Seems like everyone bought their guns around the same time and the chambers are tight as hell Sounds like they are loading their rounds too long. I have two PSA 9mm PCC and both require I load short. Otherwise I have the same problem. But it does raise the concern about pressure problems in their guns. Bill Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SW4me Posted May 9, 2017 Share Posted May 9, 2017 Sounds like they are loading their rounds too long. I have two PSA 9mm PCC and both require I load short. Otherwise I have the same problem. But it does raise the concern about pressure problems in their guns. BillI thought that too but two shooters at my local club had this issue with factory ammo. Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flatland Shooter Posted May 9, 2017 Share Posted May 9, 2017 Just now, SW4me said: I thought that too but two shooters at my local club had this issue with factory ammo. I've had the same problem on my PSA carbines with some 147 gr factory ammo. It was just loaded too long for this barrel. I rarely shoot factory ammo but have not had problems with 115 gr factory stuff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DesertTortoise Posted July 3, 2017 Share Posted July 3, 2017 I've had the same problem on my PSA carbines with some 147 gr factory ammo. It was just loaded too long for this barrel. I rarely shoot factory ammo but have not had problems with 115 gr factory stuff.I shot with a PSA rep who said they'll replace the 9mm barrels after a bad lot with short / tight chambers. Maybe give them a callSent from my XT1635-01 using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now