Open Nats

[B.J. Norris]

David Christen is a member of the Army Marksmanship Unit, so I'm not sure I'd count him as a true "Junior" shooter, as he is now a full-time paid shooter. Junior? I think not.

[Flexmoney]

Eric G.

Completely crushing stats.

ERIC GRAUFFEL F38440

Pistol_match

2003 USPSA Open National Championship

9/21/2003 USPSA

Open, 262 competitors.

Stage Percent Place

Match -- 100.00 -- 1

1 -- 92.16 -- 10

2 -- 88.75 -- 4

3 -- 89.46 -- 7

4 -- 97.59 -- 2

5 -- 89.91 -- 6

6 -- 90.35 -- 7

7 -- 96.79 -- 3

8 -- 95.55 -- 5

9 -- 92.67 -- 8

10 -- 100.00 -- 1

11 -- 100.00 -- 1

12 -- 100.00 -- 1

13 -- 91.57 -- 6

14 -- 88.44 -- 6

15 -- 100.0 -- 1

16 -- 99.01 -- 2

[Steve Anderson]

Here's a weird question...does anyone know what the squad atmosphere is like with Eric G and the US top dogs? Is it friendly, do they joke around...or is it dead serious and all business? I saw the american super squad at the fgns, I'm just wondering how they get on with Eric G. and he with them.

SA

[Detlef]

I shot with Eric at the 2001 European Champs, and he's a hell of a nice guy, talks some (not a prolific talker like TGO), but is very concentrated all along. Plus he and his dad do and analyse all this together, planning strategies etc.

--Detlef

[TheOtherErik]

Hopefully tomorrow the really good storys will get posted when most of our members will get home.

[TDean]

59 LINDA BLOWERS U 1193.9828 70.32%

60 KAY CLARK MICULEK M 1192.3386 70.23%

62 ATHENA LEE A 1189.7061 70.07%

65 JULIE GOLOSKI A 1183.7231 69.72%

107 DONI JOHNSTON A 1105.1599 65.09%

109 LISA MUNSON M 1103.3450 64.98%

Wow, good job Linda!

Where'd she come from? Talk about under the radar....

That was one hell of a ladies match!!

Eric proved it....again. He's #1

[Jon Merricks]

David the top master was top 16 last year. He hasnt been out of boot camp real long so I'm guessing for next year he will be one to look out for.

[Blake Miguez]

I got DQed on my last day, first stage. I shot the first array and attempted to make a load on the run to my next position. My trigger finger which was resting on the frame slipped into the trigger guard during my load and BAM. I had a ADed down range in a safe direction. I know it sucks but oh well. I'll get them next year.

[RAZZ]

Good attitude Blake...There are only two kinds of shooters---those who have, and those who will (DQ, that is)

[mcoliver]

Blake, sorry to hear about that. Jeez, shitty things really do happen even to the best of us, huh?

BTW, anybody care to post the final results?

Thanks.

[Vince Pinto]

B.J.,

A person qualifies as a Junior by age - vocation, employment or remuneration are irrelevant.

TDean,

I guess you missed my earlier post, but Linda Blowers is a top Australian IPSC shooter.

Blake,

I'm also very sorry to hear about your DQ, but it gives me a warm 'n' fuzzy feeling to see you accept it like a good sportsman. Well done!

[ErikW]

I didn't get to see much super squad or big dog action, as I had the same schedule, but I did get to catch a little.

Grauffel didn't blow them away with blinding speed, as far as I could tell. Just deliberate, accurate shooting, with fast, efficient movement. The target arrays didn't allow machine-gun splits and transitions.

He did a few blindingly fast runs to win the shoot-offs.

[diehli]

1 ERIC GRAUFFEL F38440 GM 1697.8527 100.00%

2 TODD JARRETT L2458 GM 1621.7748 95.52%

3 MAX MICHEL JR TY26022 GM 1570.4857 92.50%

4 JOJO VIDANES L1993 GM 1554.6547 91.57%

5 ROBERT LEATHAM L684 GM 1553.9722 91.53%

6 HENNING WALLGREN TY25335 GM 1544.8106 90.99%

7 CHRIS TILLEY TY38861 GM Junior 1518.3027 89.42%

8 ERROL THOMAS F23255 U 1512.7951 89.10%

9 JJ RACAZA TY40802 GM 1510.0865 88.94%

10 TRAVIS TOMASIE L1973 GM 1507.8067 88.81%

11 MICHAEL VOIGT RD4 GM 1506.8626 88.75%

12 SAUL KIRSCH F44236 GM 1500.4645 88.37%

13 EMANUEL BRAGG L2476 GM 1484.2786 87.42%

14 MATTHEW BURKETT L2135 GM 1476.1141 86.94%

15 DOUG KOENIG TY5804 GM 1463.7133 86.21%

16 ADAM POPPLEWELL TY38584 GM 1451.2971 85.48%

17 JAMIE CRAIG TY15086 GM 1433.4976 84.43%

18 DAVID JERNIGAN CHRISTEN TY43272 M Junior 1415.8677 83.39%

19 GREG NAUMAN A32856 M 1382.4744 81.42%

20 JAMES ONG TY36874 M 1373.2393 80.88%

[B.J. Norris]

Vince, I understand this. However, its kind of a crock that David is now a pull-time paid shooter on the Army Team, shoots 500 rounds and could still win a Junior award. Whereas little ol' me, has to work to shoot, shoots 500 rounds a month and tries to dry-fire everyday. Now, for all I know, he could have been told to mark Junior on his entry form. But I just think that its a crock that I have to compete against a shooter that is paid to do nothing but shoot for a Junior award. Even Chris Tilley still does training and isn't paid to do nothing but shoot.

Maybe something in the next update of the rulebook about "The competitor may not register in Junior category if they are a member of a full-time armed forces pistol team."

End thread drift............

[BamBam]

... Or raise the age to enlist!!!

[TDean]

I saw your earlier post Vince. I asked where she came from in the sense of.... "where did that punch come from?"

[Vince Pinto]

B.J.,

I hear you, but your suggestion to eliminate servicemen from Junior category is tantamount to "employment discrimination".

Since Julie Goloski is also in the Army, should we prohibit her from registering as a Lady competitor? What about Jay Christie and Merle Edington? Or how about Phil Strader and other LEOs? Presumably each of these competitors have "benefits" which are not available to civilians, such as employer sponsored ammunition or range time.

And what about the "professional" shooters? Surely those who make their living from shooting full time and/or who are sponsored by gun makers and the like have an edge over the rest of us?

Then there are competitors who come from very wealthy families, who have no limits on how much they can spend on their equipment, range time, training, match fees and travelling expenses. Surely they have an edge over the average working stiff trying to raise a family, pay a mortgage, put away money for their kid's college fund and so on.

If you can find a away to deal with all the above issues, I'm listening.

[PhilTerry]

Vince

Thanks for the e-mail on the other thread

Suggestions on Junior and related category

Same comments I have made previously

Junior category should be for those aged 17 or under and ceases on the shooters 18th birthday.

Law and Military category should only apply if the competitor uses a duty rig and firearm.

Drop Super Senior and move start of Senior Category to 60.

[benos]

B.J.,

I hear you, but your suggestion to eliminate servicemen from Junior category is tantamount to "employment discrimination".

Since Julie Goloski is also in the Army, should we prohibit her from registering as a Lady competitor? What about Jay Christie and Merle Edington? Or how about Phil Strader and other LEOs? Presumably each of these competitors have "benefits" which are not available to civilians, such as employer sponsored ammunition or range time.

And what about the "professional" shooters? Surely those who make their living from shooting full time and/or who are sponsored by gun makers and the like have an edge over the rest of us?

Then there are competitors who come from very wealthy families, who have no limits on how much they can spend on their equipment, range time, training, match fees and travelling expenses. Surely they have an edge over the average working stiff trying to raise a family, pay a mortgage, put away money for their kid's college fund and so on.

If you can find a away to deal with all the above issues, I'm listening.

JSYN, Julie G no longer is employed by the Army - she GTFO.

I hear you - I've wondered about "issuses" in your post since, first, when I was offered a full time sponsorship from S&W, and second, when the AMU announced they were going to select a few guys from the team and train them exclusively for the Bianchi Cup, 24/7. This never actually happened, but if it did, eventually a Miliary class would have to have been created, just like it was for High Power Rifle.

Even the (couple remaining) pro-level sponsored shooters aren't anywhere near the same level of training and support as a Military shooter would be. I know both Robbie and Todd run their asses off (matches, sponsor's demos, etc.) during the year, trying to survive as a "pro shooter." It certainly isn't what it may appear to be.

Lately, I don't feel there is a solution because there isn't a problem, because, most do not have the drive and determination the Todd's, Robbie's, and Eric's have, even if they were sitting on a house full of ammo and had no family to support.

be

[Vince Pinto]

Hi Phil,

Juniors: The recent rules committee discussed the issue of the Juniors age limit, and there were two proposals - one to lower it to 18 and another to add a new "Youth" category - but, after considerable discussion, both ideas were rejected for the time being.

However the issue is not dead, and it's on the agenda for discussion at the next IPSC President's Council meeting to be held in conjunction with SHOT Show in Las Vegas in February. As Mike Voigt is a member of the Council, the USPSA will be well represented.

Seniors: Let me tell you about my "handicap" (as in odds, not infirmity) plan. We kill off "Super Senior" and keep the "Senior" starting age at 50, however for each year you're over 50, we give you a 1% handicap on your final match points in Senior category (but not the Division).

For example, if you're 55 years old, you'd get a 5% "handicap" in Senior category, and if you're 70 years old you'd get a 20% "handicap" in Senior Category, however your "handicap" would not affect your overall ranking in the division.

Consider the recently concluded USPSA Open Nationals, where the top four Seniors recorded the following placings:

Name ....................... Overall .......... Senior ......... Match Points

DON BEDNORZ ............25...................1.................1349.8433

DAVE BRIDGMAN .........36...................2.................1279.4158

JAKE KEMPTON............39....................3.................1258.5150

OTIS AUSTIN................41...................4..................1257.2445

If, for argument's sake, Don Bednorz is 50 years old and Dave Bridgman is 60 years old, Dave would have a 10% handicap added to his match points (i.e. +127.9416 points), which means Dave (now with 1407.3573 points) would be the winner of Open Senior category, but his overall Division standings would not change.

Apart from a rule change, the only thing we'd need to do to implement this system is to have a "year of birth" box pop-up when you enter a competitor as a Senior. Once the information is entered, all the calculations are performed by the scoring program.

So, do you like the plan or do you think I'm nucking futs?

[Flexmoney]

grrrrrr

[kimel]

The Senior Handicapping idea is interesting but I don't think it is fair and equitable. Infirmity and age do not have a strict correlation across the population. This plan assumes that every year a 1% age handicap would be equal across the board.

Is a 70 year old shooter really 20% "less" than a 50 year old shooter? For some it is yes, some no and for a few they are probably closer to 25% less.

When TGO hits Senior status is he going to need a handicap? Given how he shot last week I kinda doubt it. Hell, he will probably be out there in a walker kicking all our butts 30 years from now.

Remember: Old age and trechery shall overcome youth and enthusiasm.

Leave them as they are. Someday there may need to be a Super Duper Senior class. I have seen some near 70 guys shoot and they really are Super Duper.

[Vince Pinto]

Hi guys,

Just wait until you hear about my other plan - a new "Fat Bastards" category.

You get 1% handicap for every pound you're overweight for your height, and another 1% handicap for every inch your waist size exceeds 34". By my calculations, I'll get a 200% handicap.

By hook or by crook, I'm gonna be World Champion one of these days ........... bwa-ha-ha

[B.J. Norris]

I've started another thread to address the Junior category issue.

[kimel]

"Fat Bastards"! I love it! Pass the ice cream!