Harbor freight mini mill and c more Mount

[duffdawg]

You guys think the harbor freight mini mill would work for drilling the 5 holes for the optic mount in a 2011 I planned on ordering a frame with the holes pre drilled. But decided now id like to go with a frame without them 

[outerlimits]

that mill is garbage.  save yer $.  any gunsmith would do that for a fraction of the cost.  also, a drill press would work just fine if you know what you are doing and square everything.

[duffdawg]

I’ve got a pretty nice drill press. My buddy just had one he said I could use. Wasn’t sure if it’d be better than the drill press. I’ve been looking for an older Bridgeport or something of the sorts but haven’t found one in good shape lately 

Edited December 18, 2023 by duffdawg

[yigal]

4 hours ago, outerlimits said:

that mill is garbage.  save yer $.  any gunsmith would do that for a fraction of the cost.  also, a drill press would work just fine if you know what you are doing and square everything.

One of the companies I worked for had one like this but a bigger model. Even with all the axes  locked it was not able to mill  a straight slot in aluminum. only in plastic. u can't call its garbage . it was super g.  

For it to work well, you probably need to invest in it and make some changes.

Hopefully, the new models will be better

Edited December 18, 2023 by yigal

[tomjerry1]

I think you'd be better off to spend money and have it done. To get a decent mill, your looking at least a couple of grand or more, new or used, then the real costs start, tooling. You can have a lot of machining done for that without all the headaches. Don't get me wrong, if you have the need for a mill, it's a great tool, but no plug and play.  

[duffdawg]

2 hours ago, tomjerry1 said:

I think you'd be better off to spend money and have it done. To get a decent mill, your looking at least a couple of grand or more, new or used, then the real costs start, tooling. You can have a lot of machining done for that without all the headaches. Don't get me wrong, if you have the need for a mill, it's a great tool, but no plug and play.  

I’ve thought about sending it out. But I wanted to see if I could do everything on this build. I plan to build a back up gun just like it. Originally I planned to use a xwf frame that’s pre drilled but thats gonna be awhile before he has them back in stock.  I’ve quit my other hobby so I need something to tinker with that isn’t as expensive

Edited December 18, 2023 by duffdawg

[tomjerry1]

Measure twice, cut once, practice on aluminum before steel, and be patient. Have fun. 

[Barcode1337]

I drilled my RIA 1911 for the Cheely SRO mount, 5 hole pattern using my Harbor Freight mini mill. I have DROs rigged up, so it was super easy. As long as you have your mill, vice, and whatnot set up right, it is just fine for it from what I can tell.

But then again, I'm a total hack, so take my experience for what it's worth.

[duffdawg]

14 hours ago, tomjerry1 said:

Measure twice, cut once, practice on aluminum before steel, and be patient. Have fun. 

I was thinking of trying to cut something in the rough shape of a frame to get my holding down good as well. or picking up a frame jig for milling. hopefully I can find a used Bridgeport or something of the sorts before my fame comes in. I'd also like to try fitting a slide to frame with a mill probably going to try that on a 1911 first. I've also been interested in building an open 1911 for steel Challange. so that might be a good place to start trying to drill that frame first I have a slide and frame I could use for that build if I wanted to try that first. I need to do some more reading on the 1911 steel guns before if I make that decision if it's worth it over another 2011. I know overall cost is much less to build a 1911. 

[duffdawg]

1 hour ago, Barcode1337 said:

I drilled my RIA 1911 for the Cheely SRO mount, 5 hole pattern using my Harbor Freight mini mill. I have DROs rigged up, so it was super easy. As long as you have your mill, vice, and whatnot set up right, it is just fine for it from what I can tell.

But then again, I'm a total hack, so take my experience for what it's worth.

his doesn't have dro sadly. which probably will make it much harder. and I'm with you I'm a total hack myself. i just wanted to try building a few of my own guns after I quit racing latemodels 

[tomjerry1]

Fixturing is very important, chattering from a moving part will drive you crazy. Learn as much as you can about purchasing a used mill, where to look for wear, how to measure to determine the wear, and when it is time to walk away from trouble. I would keep an eye open for tools being sold out of a college, usually have been used lightly. Look for a 220 single phase tool, unless you have 3 phase 220, or a phase on converter. Once again, the mill will be the cheap part, the tooling will add up. Keep us up-dated, success in your venture. 

[shred]

Before you start drilling on 1911s you need to know where the 1-degree (0.9') angle is going-- on the mount or on the frame.  You don't want it both places and you don't want it in neither. 

 

With a DRO either are straightforward, but without, putting the angle on the frame is going to be trickier.  

 

After that it's locate the first hole, spot, drill tapping size, tap, dial to next hole, repeat.  For practice, put your hole pattern and threads into a piece of 1/8" thick mild steel flat bar.  This will come in handy later when it's time to shorten your screws to length as you can screw the mount to that and cut/file/grind/sand the protruding screw parts (assuming your frame is 1/8" thick.  Adjust or shim as needed)

 

 

[duffdawg]

4 hours ago, shred said:

Before you start drilling on 1911s you need to know where the 1-degree (0.9') angle is going-- on the mount or on the frame.  You don't want it both places and you don't want it in neither. 

 

With a DRO either are straightforward, but without, putting the angle on the frame is going to be trickier.  

 

After that it's locate the first hole, spot, drill tapping size, tap, dial to next hole, repeat.  For practice, put your hole pattern and threads into a piece of 1/8" thick mild steel flat bar.  This will come in handy later when it's time to shorten your screws to length as you can screw the mount to that and cut/file/grind/sand the protruding screw parts (assuming your frame is 1/8" thick.  Adjust or shim as needed)

 

 

That’s one thing I’ve been trying to figure out. I took some time off from shooting competitively and back when I stopped the c-more was still the main sight and all those mounts I found now days don’t have the 1 degree angle. But all the micro mounts seem to have it. I’d like the option do switch do a micro one day. I still have two c mores so more then likely that’ll be the first sight that goes on the gun. I’ve read some things that those sights have enough adjustment even without the 1 degree angle

[NoSteel]

If your going the bench top mill route you will want something of Precision Mathew’s quality or better.  I did some of my work using a Little Machine Shop Hi Torque bench model which while much better than the Harbour Freight stuff still had to do some work to dissipate chatter.  

Edited December 20, 2023 by NoSteel

[tomjerry1]

To figure out your 1 degree, use an angle block, place under the scope mount and on top of the slide works great. Verify the scope mount with the manufacture, mount may already have the 1 degree built in. You can use the same block to cut the face of the slide while mounting the comp. The C-More Serendipity mount pattern is the same as other mounts, I would do all the holes before finishing, they'll be there if you need, and won't hurt a thing if not used.

+1 on the Precision Mathews

[barry]

On a .375 hole spacing mount I belive a  .0065" drop per hole gets you 1 degree.

If you do get a full size mill and have someplace to put it and the ability to put it there(2000 lbs+) you will find its one of the most useful things a man can have access to.

[duffdawg]

 

10 hours ago, barry said:

On a .375 hole spacing mount I belive a  .0065" drop per hole gets you 1 degree.

If you do get a full size mill and have someplace to put it and the ability to put it there(2000 lbs+) you will find its one of the most useful things a man can have access to.

That’s what I’ve been thinking about getting I have a  pretty big shop. From racing that’s empty now gonna put all my reloading stuff out there. 

[tomjerry1]

If you invest in a knee mill, before you place it, put a solid base like 3"x3" square steel and leveling feet under it. This will bring the mill up to a more comfortable height and allow a pallet jack to go under the mill for moving if needed.

[duffdawg]

8 hours ago, tomjerry1 said:

If you invest in a knee mill, before you place it, put a solid base like 3"x3" square steel and leveling feet under it. This will bring the mill up to a more comfortable height and allow a pallet jack to go under the mill for moving if needed.

What do y’all think about this mill. It’s fairly priced looks decent and some tooling comes with it collets some new end mills. I’ve been doing some research on the converters or maybe getting a single phase motor 

Edited December 24, 2023 by duffdawg

[tomjerry1]

I have a rotary three phase converter, there are many ways to get three phase. Before that, have you seen it run? Do you know how to run the mill? don't want to insult you. If you know someone, maybe you can take them along. You'll want to go through all the controls, check forward, reverse, high and low range, vary the speeds, check the quill movement manual and auto down feed. Take some kind of cleaner, move the axis and clean as you go, move to the extremes of the axis. Check end play on the axis controls as you move the axis, it is common for the end play to be tight at extremes, and loose in the middle of the axis. Then look at the ways to see condition. It looks like a fab shop, and debris from cutting metals can reek havoc on the surfaces. 

I have seen these for 1500.00 to 4000.00, the tighter it is, the more you can expect to pay.

[Farmer]

Looks like a few more in the background that you could compare with also. Looks like this one has been sitting for a while. Wonder why if the others don’t. I looked at one at an auction once that appeared very nice until someone fired it up. Sounded like a blender full of ice. I’m no expert but it sounded like a lot of work and $$$. 

[tomjerry1]

True statement, have one at work, it's noisy, but works great. Leap of faith if you don't get to run before you purchase.

[duffdawg]

7 hours ago, tomjerry1 said:

I have a rotary three phase converter, there are many ways to get three phase. Before that, have you seen it run? Do you know how to run the mill? don't want to insult you. If you know someone, maybe you can take them along. You'll want to go through all the controls, check forward, reverse, high and low range, vary the speeds, check the quill movement manual and auto down feed. Take some kind of cleaner, move the axis and clean as you go, move to the extremes of the axis. Check end play on the axis controls as you move the axis, it is common for the end play to be tight at extremes, and loose in the middle of the axis. Then look at the ways to see condition. It looks like a fab shop, and debris from cutting metals can reek havoc on the surfaces. 

I have seen these for 1500.00 to 4000.00, the tighter it is, the more you can expect to pay.

They said we could run before we loaded. This one’s 2k I also wonder on the aspect of why it wasn’t getting used he said they’re down sizing. Who knows if that’s true or not. I know the basics of manual mill. Only run table top stuff and programs I’ve made on a cnc

[tomjerry1]

Great, take a magnetic base and dial indicator. 2k isn't bad

[Toolguy]

Lots of good advice here. Don't be in too much of a hurry to buy something. Whatever you get, you will likely be stuck with it for a long time. Precision Matthews is a good import brand. You would be far ahead to get a new one of those than a beat up Bridgeport. Look at the ways. If the scallops are worn down and/or there is a lot of slop in the leadscrews, hard pass. See if the X and Y axis handles turn more than .015 or so without moving anything. That tells leadscrew and nut wear.

 

The best new knee mill on the market right now for the money is an Acer 3VKHH. It's Brideport sized for around $9500. You may be able to find a used one on eBay or Amazon for less. They are better than BP. A new BP is around $14000 bare bones. I don't know what your budget is like.

 

Whatever you get, you want a Digital Readout on X and Y at least. DRO on Z axis is optional. If you get a 220v 3 phase machine and you only have single phase 220 service, you can use a Variable Frequency Drive (VFD) to run it with. The advantage to that is that then you can have variable spindle speeds that you can dial up or down electronically. The Acer comes with that built in.