.357 Sized 9MM Bullets Currently Available

[iflyskyhigh]

Was having trouble with accuracy in a couple of my 9MM handguns with the 125's from BBI. In other guns they were some of the best groups those guns have ever shot. I rescind my opinion that JHP's are the most accurate bullet design.

 

Wanted to try some .357's to see if they tighten up the groups in the suspect guns.

 

Don't want to order in bulk in case they aren't any better in said guns.

 

Have already ordered .356 bullets in bulk from BBI (on hand and testing), DG (on hand haven't tested), Blue Bullets (backordered), and Precision (backordered). 

 

Like I said the .356's are lasers in several guns and okay in others. The .356's work good enough in the okay guns that I'll be happy to burn through them, but want to test some .357's before I ordered any more in bulk.

 

As far as I can tell DG is the only one custom sizing right now with product available. Ordered some .357's from DG and just got a shipping notification.

 

Chandler at BBI responded they are unable to stop and custom size right now (which is understandable). If I'm not mistaken Blue Bullets doesn't custom size any longer, and only runs 9MM at .355 (I haven't contacted them, just what I read on here. I haven't contacted Dave at Precision. Are they still custom sizing?

 

I know Eggleston has lots of custom sizing and testers, but they are a little on the expensive side and are OOS on everything at the minute.

 

Any other suggestions or corrections to my assumptions?

[jubi351]

Summers has .357

 

[PhotoRecon]

Last time I checked Summers isn't taking orders until May 1st...

[jubi351]

Yeah, should of checked before I referred you.

[Kenstone]

Like you, I have a few 9mm guns that shoot better with 0.357" bullets, some with 0.358" bullets.

 

Because I also load/shoot 38s and 357s I buy ALL bullets that are 0.358" and push them thru a Lee sizing die for the smaller sizes I need.

Most suppliers stock/sell them (0.358" bullets) and there's not need to order anything custom sized.

Doing that, there's no need to buy/inventory a bunch of different diameter bullets, I just re-size them to what I need.  

I buy/stock bullets like these:

125 Gr Round Nose – The Blue Bullets

Coated/no lube groove work the best in my Hornady bullet feeders.

0.357" push thru Lee sizing die:

.357 LEE BULLET LUBRICATING & SIZING KIT (titanreloading.com)

works for me,

 

 

Edited April 3, 2021 by Kenstone

[36873687]

Bayou 

[Squirrel45]

Bear Creek, Steve makes a number of .357 great guy. 209-874-4322

[iflyskyhigh]

Thank you. 
 

I don’t have a sizer and at this point am not interested in another reloading stop. 
 

I also wanted to stick with coated bullets. Looks like Bear Creek is just straight lead. And I believe Bayou is taking quite awhile to ship. 
 

I was mainly looking for manufacturers with in stock ready to ship, which i know is tough right now. 
 

I was able to get some 357’s from DG and have them in hand. Will load up for testing today. 

[twodownzero]

Bear Creek are coated bullets.  They've been doing it longer than all of the coated bullet places you've heard of (longer than BBI, Blue Bullets, SNS).

[Kenstone]

1 hour ago, iflyskyhigh said:

Thank you. 
 

I don’t have a sizer and at this point am not interested in another reloading stop. 
 

I also wanted to stick with coated bullets. Looks like Bear Creek is just straight lead. And I believe Bayou is taking quite awhile to ship. 
 

I was mainly looking for manufacturers with in stock ready to ship, which i know is tough right now. 
 

I was able to get some 357’s from DG and have them in hand. Will load up for testing today. 

OK then

Thanks for reading my post.

Good luck on your search for bullets the diameters you want.

.

 

[iflyskyhigh]

5 hours ago, Kenstone said:

OK then

Thanks for reading my post.

Good luck on your search for bullets the diameters you want.

.

 

For sure. I appreciate the input and suggestions. I meant to say step. I just can’t add another step.

 

I’m loading up the DG .357’s right now. Gunna try and run to the club here in a few and see what happens. 

[Dwbsig]

6 hours ago, iflyskyhigh said:

Thank you. 
 

I don’t have a sizer and at this point am not interested in another reloading stop. 
 

I also wanted to stick with coated bullets. Looks like Bear Creek is just straight lead. And I believe Bayou is taking quite awhile to ship. 
 

I was mainly looking for manufacturers with in stock ready to ship, which i know is tough right now. 
 

I was able to get some 357’s from DG and have them in hand. Will load up for testing today. 

Take a look at summers bullets as always shipped pretty fast for me .

[Dr. Phil]

Bayou.

Fast shipping if they are in stock.

Also can get a 100 pack to test.

Great company!

[Darrell]

I'm also going to recommend Bayou sample pack and Dennis may be able to ship them quicker since they have ramped up production. I use .358 in my 929 revolver, that's what it took to get the accuracy from 4" down to 1.5". I tied lots of coated bullets DG, Brazos, Acme, and Bayou's and since Bayou is local to me I run them. The only other thing I'll recommend for coated bullet accuracy is to make sure you bell the mouth of the case more. Me personally I bell to .390 and crimp .378-.379. If you look at my spreadsheet and see groups over 4 inches and see same loads at 1-2 inches that is because I didn't bell the mouth enough. 

[iflyskyhigh]

3 hours ago, Darrell said:I'm also going to recommend Bayou sample pack and Dennis may be able to ship them quicker since they have ramped up production. I use .358 in my 929 revolver, that's what it took to get the accuracy from 4" down to 1.5". I tied lots of coated bullets DG, Brazos, Acme, and Bayou's and since Bayou is local to me I run them. The only other thing I'll recommend for coated bullet accuracy is to make sure you bell the mouth of the case more. Me personally I bell to .390 and crimp .378-.379. If you look at my spreadsheet and see groups over 4 inches and see same loads at 1-2 inches that is because I didn't bell the mouth enough. 

Hey Darrel. I read that awhile back and revisited it yesterday.

 

I was belling to about .380-.383 (mixed brass)

 

Opened it up to .388-.391 (mixed brass). Looks WAY too big. Like throwing a hotdog into the Grand Canyon. I use the Mr. Bullet Feeder powder die. It’s a god send when using mixed brass, and when using big bell as you suggest. 

 

I think I may have had the crimp a little too tight. I was crimping to about .377-.378ish (mixed brass). 

 

I was using a LFCD. I pulled some bullets and verified that the .356 bullets were in fact still .356, and they were.

 

I switched backed to my Dillon crimp die and am now crimping .379-.381 (mixed brass).
 

Even on the high side of the crimp they all still gauged but one, and even that one chambered. Some were just a touch tight in the case gauge, but all still went in flush.
 

I think some times a burr in the case rim is mistaken for some other issue, but often I find it’s the burr that keeps it from going flush. Anyway, even the ones without a burr that were just a touch tight still gauged with a little pressure and chambered.

I may go back and experiment with the LFCD and the .379 bell just for s#!ts and giggles. But I’ll stick with the Dillon crimp die for now.

 

Even at .377 crimp, the case mounts had not cut into the coating. Sometimes there was a slight indentation that I could feel with with my nail, but it never pieced the coating. Obviously too much crimp though. 

 

Tested .356 115s and 125s yesterday with your suggested bell and crimp. Worked like a charm. Troublesome guns groups tightened up substantially and the guns that were great before were still great. Issues solved. I really like the DG 115s. They are a little snappier obviously, but crazy accurate in all my guns. Which is something I’ve also found with 115 FMJs and JHPs. They tend to be the most accurate weight bullets in all my 9MM pistols, expect maybe my Sig M17 which prefers 124/125. 
 

I thought I was getting some leading, but I don’t think it’s leading. I don’t know, maybe it is? After several strings of fire with above loads and some FMJ loads tossed in accuracy was still on point. Do you get leading even with proper bell and crimp?

 

Since I changed 3 different things not sure which one fixed the issue. Probably a combo of all 3.
 

I also tested the .357s yesterday with your belling and crimping, and the good news is they were just a touch less accurate than the .356s. I say good news cause I have thousands of the .356s. Now I know I can just stick with the .356s

 

Very happy with both BBI and the DG bullets so far. Quality product. Good price. Fast shipping. Still gonna try the Blues and the Precision's...because this is fun and why not. 
 

Thanks for the help.

 

 

[Darrell]

I had great results with DG bullets, currently working through Brazos 115 coated super accurate. Like I said I bell all my 9mm to .390 now and my crimp is set at .378. I've crimped down to .375 with now issues, the issue I believe was scraping of coating and in some cases lead which threw the accuracy way off. Same thing happened with .45 coated bullets. The other reason I don't think a tighter crimp hurts coated bullets is because I load .38 148gr wadcutters below the case and roll crimp over it and it doesn't hurt although if I taper crimp the wadcutters I'll get slightly better accuracy. Never use the LFC die with coated bullets, it definitely swages the bullet down and that's where you get leading, key holing, and accuracy issues. Good luck to you. BTW what kind of guns are you shooting? My CZ's love 124's, my Sig P320 X5 loves 115's. Glock shot 147 good too.  

[iflyskyhigh]

3 hours ago, Darrell said:

I had great results with DG bullets, currently working through Brazos 115 coated super accurate. Like I said I bell all my 9mm to .390 now and my crimp is set at .378. I've crimped down to .375 with now issues, the issue I believe was scraping of coating and in some cases lead which threw the accuracy way off. Same thing happened with .45 coated bullets. The other reason I don't think a tighter crimp hurts coated bullets is because I load .38 148gr wadcutters below the case and roll crimp over it and it doesn't hurt although if I taper crimp the wadcutters I'll get slightly better accuracy. Never use the LFC die with coated bullets, it definitely swages the bullet down and that's where you get leading, key holing, and accuracy issues. Good luck to you. BTW what kind of guns are you shooting? My CZ's love 124's, my Sig P320 X5 loves 115's. Glock shot 147 good too.  

I respect your work, and you are most certainly knowledgeable, but never and always statements are always false and never true. I understand why people say that ref the LFCD, and it for sure makes sense. But for some reason it isn’t always true. I pulled bullets run through the FCD and they were still .356. So it hadn’t swage them. Maybe it had some other effect I didn’t notice or couldn’t detect. It for sure has the potential to cause issues. I’m open too it. Depends on lots of factors. I’m guessing if I had run the .357s through it might have had some effect.
 

Several of the guns shot the rounds that had been run through the FCD like laser beams. So, if I had only had those guns I wouldn’t ever have know I had an issue. So in that case technically the LFCD worked just fine. I for sure had zero leading on the rounds run through the FCD. The barrels were squeaky clean. It wasn’t till I switched to the Dillon crimp that I noticed what  I thought was leading. But what I thought was leading I don’t think really was. I may have had a little leading with the Dillon die crimping to tight, but now I think it’s fine. 

 

Always be open to things you are sure you know the answer too.

 

I changed 3 different things at once so who’s to say what’s the one that fixed the issue. Or, like I said, maybe it was a combo of all three. I’ll do some more experimenting with the LFCD if for nothing more than to satisfy my curiosity. I’ll run some .357s through and see what happens. I’m guessing it WILL swage down the 357’s some. If I’m wrong I’m wrong.
 

But that’s a debate for another day, and one that has been beaten to death.

 

I’m gonna stick with the super light crimp. May go down a thou and see what happens.  With the mixed brass you have to find a middle of the road, hence the .379–.381. I even had a couple of the notoriously troublesome head stamps (we all know what they are) measure .382”, but even those still gauged and chambered without issue.

 

Everything is working great now with the .356s so I’m gonna roll with that.

 

As far as pistols, like I said they all shoots snappy 115s (no matter the material) pushed to around 1175 FPS +/- exceedingly well.

 

Gen 5 G17 MOS shot everything lights out no matter material or weight. I got one of the good ones I guess. Loved the .356s from the first round. The Gen 5 barrels appear to be much tighter and more accurate than previous generations.

 

Sig M17 is really accurate with 124+ gr bullets, but it’s not as though it’s inaccurate with other bullets. Had trouble with the first few runs of 125 gr coated, all sorted and lights out now. Have the Apex kit in there along with Wilson grip module and couple other goodies. I don’t think I own a stock pistol except my CZ TSO 40. 

 

Gen 3 Gucci G34, agency arms barrel. Loves 115s. REALLY had trouble with the first few runs of 125 gr coated, all sorted and lights out now

 

Poly 80 G19 build with agency arms barrel really likes 147 JHP’s pushed hard (it’s one of my EDC gunS). But again shoots everything well.

 

G19X same as Gen 5 G17, just got a Parker Mountain Machine barrel and comp. Haven’t had a chance to shoot it.

 

SW Shield. With the Apex carry kit it is amazingly accurate for such a small pistol. Also shot all the coated bullets well no matter what. 

 

I don’t have anything that shoots 147 practice stuff all that great beside my AR-9 suppressed sub gun. But truth be told I haven’t put a ton of time into load development on that front. 

 

 

 

 

[Kenstone]

OK, just returned here and see the discussion is continuing.

earlier

I responded about loading larger bullets in 9mm and how I resize bigger bullets to get the various diameters I want, but I didn't post anything about the other changes I made to the loading process to NOT further swage those oversized bullets.

 

Most here poo-poo Lee stuff was the reason I didn't mention using a bigger diameter expanding plug previously.

By expanding the case bigger the chance of bullet swaging by the case is/can be eliminated/reduced.

 

Most people loading 9mm with Lee dies know the the expander plug for 38 S&W is a direct replace for the 9mm expander plug and expands the case +.002"/+.003" (as I recall but have not measured it recently).

Pm Expan Plg 38 S&w - Lee Precision

LEE SE1699 PM EXP PLUG 38 S&W (titanreloading.com)

Out of stock most places because people use them for 9mm.

You could also make a custom stepped expander, to any diameter(s) you want for the die you are using now.

So there's something else to try.

 

The case wall thickness variation is another factor to consider when looking for sources of further bullet swaging during the loading process that shows up on pulled bullets.

If you are loading cases that are known to be from the same mfg. then never mind.

I sort brass though.

jmo

.

 

 

Edited April 9, 2021 by Kenstone

[DougCarden]

John at Two Alpha Bullets can hook you up.   I have been using his 122tc Bullets sized .357 for Bianchi 50yard loads for years. 2-3 inches @ 50 yards and same Poa/Poi as my match jhp load except 2 clicks windage at 50.  
I have the smaller Bullets sized .357 and get better accuracy.  

[ysrracer]

I shoot these .357 bullets in my 9mm, but unfortunately they're out of stock right now.

 

https://www.xtremebullets.com/38-125-FP-p/xc38-125fpcan-b0500.htm

[iflyskyhigh]

3 hours ago, DougCarden said:

John at Two Alpha Bullets can hook you up.   I have been using his 122tc Bullets sized .357 for Bianchi 50yard loads for years. 2-3 inches @ 50 yards and same Poa/Poi as my match jhp load except 2 clicks windage at 50.  
I have the smaller Bullets sized .357 and get better accuracy.  

Thank you. Actually solved my issue. The .356s ended up working great after a couple tweaks.

1 hour ago, ysrracer said:

I shoot these .357 bullets in my 9mm, but unfortunately they're out of stock right now.

 

https://www.xtremebullets.com/38-125-FP-p/xc38-125fpcan-b0500.htm

Don’t think I’d ever go back to copper bullets. For me personally I always found the accuracy subpar and these days they are about the same cost as as FMJ’s which defeats the purpose of switching to coated lead. The only thing I use plated for are 147 gr subsonic loads for a suppressed 9MM AR. In that case they are plenty accurate. 
 

Appreciate the input. 

[iflyskyhigh]

On 4/8/2021 at 6:17 PM, Kenstone said:

OK, just returned here and see the discussion is continuing.

earlier

I responded about loading larger bullets in 9mm and how I resize bigger bullets to get the various diameters I want, but I didn't post anything about the other changes I made to the loading process to NOT further swage those oversized bullets.

 

Most here poo-poo Lee stuff was the reason I didn't mention using a bigger diameter expanding plug previously.

By expanding the case bigger the chance of bullet swaging by the case is/can be eliminated/reduced.

 

Most people loading 9mm with Lee dies know the the expander plug for 38 S&W is a direct replace for the 9mm expander plug and expands the case +.002"/+.003" (as I recall but have not measured it recently).

Pm Expan Plg 38 S&w - Lee Precision

LEE SE1699 PM EXP PLUG 38 S&W (titanreloading.com)

Out of stock most places because people use them for 9mm.

You could also make a custom stepped expander, to any diameter(s) you want for the die you are using now.

So there's something else to try.

 

The case wall thickness variation is another factor to consider when looking for sources of further bullet swaging during the loading process that shows up on pulled bullets.

If you are loading cases that are known to be from the same mfg. then never mind.

I sort brass though.

jmo

.

 

 

I use a Mr. Bullet Feeder Powder Die. I like Lee stuff. A lot of my reloading dies are Lee. I use the Lee U dies for all pistol rounds.