JP "warning" about re-manufactured ammo?

[RickT]

I don't have a JP PCC (CMMG Guard), but looking at the JP website they caution against using re-mans based on potential for catastrophic failure if the ammo is over-crimped.  Has anyone seen this on factory re-mans?  I reload so it's not an issue and I've used the same crimp for $150K rounds, mostly 1911.  Seems like an ammunition manufacturer would have excellent control over tolerance.  The original notice goes back to 2016 so I assume the company (or companies) have long since gone out of business, but the JP explanation of the potential failure was worth reading.

 

[Sarge]

All gun makers pretty much say not to shoot reloads in their guns. I’m sure it’s a liability issue.

[trickg]

1 hour ago, Sarge said:

All gun makers pretty much say not to shoot reloads in their guns. I’m sure it’s a liability issue.

 

That makes sense - if there's a failure of a firearm with factory loads, then it's on the manufacturer of either the ammunition or the firearm.  Otherwise, the gun owner is liable and they can absolve themselves of any responsibility.

 

It's kind of funny though - I grew up with a dad who was a firearms enthusiast, and he reloaded almost everything he shot.  Almost anything I ever shot with a handgun, rifle or shotgun was a reload, and handguns almost always had a hand-cast bullet.  I shot very very little factory ammo.  About the only time he ever bought ammo was if he needed to replenish his supply of reloadable brass, or if he picked up a new gun in a caliber/cartridge he previously didn't have.  I remember when he got a 44-40 replica SAA, so he bought a whole bunch of ammo from Black Hills Ammo, and he got a set of dies for it at roughly the same time.

Edited October 15, 2019 by trickg

[M1A4ME]

4 hours ago, trickg said:

 

That makes sense - if there's a failure of a firearm with factory loads, then it's on the manufacturer of either the ammunition or the firearm.  Otherwise, the gun owner is liable and they can absolve themselves of any responsibility.

 

It's kind of funny though - I grew up with a dad who was a firearms enthusiast, and he reloaded almost everything he shot.  Almost anything I ever shot with a handgun, rifle or shotgun was a reload, and handguns almost always had a hand-cast bullet.  I shot very very little factory ammo.  About the only time he ever bought ammo was if he needed to replenish his supply of reloadable brass, or if he picked up a new gun in a caliber/cartridge he previously didn't have.  I remember when he got a 44-40 replica SAA, so he bought a whole bunch of ammo from Black Hills Ammo, and he got a set of dies for it at roughly the same time.

Yup.  But it's up to the guy/girl reloading the ammo to make sure it's done right.  From all the videos on the internet it's easy to see not everyone should be reloading.

 

I've been shooting reloaded shot gun shells since I was in Jr. High school back in the early 70's.  I have some pistols and a butt load of rifles that have never had a factory round fired through them.  

 

My nephew built up a nice heavy barreled AR15 a few years ago.  He bought Winchester, Federal and Remington ammo to try in it.  We sighted it in at 25 yds. and then walked over to the 100 yd. line to shoot groups and get the BDC reticle adjusted for a 100 yd. zero.  He shot his factory ammo and I fiddled with my GII and the SA surplus I'd been shooting with it.  I handed him some of my .223 reloads (55 grain Hornady FMJ and IMR4198 powder) and let him shoot those while he was shooting 100 yd. groups and finding which ammo he'd bought gave him the best groups.  When he was done and retrieved his targets to make a decision about his future ammo purchases I asked him which ammo shot the best groups.  He looked at me and said, "That stuff you gave me."

 

There's a reason I shoot my reloads 95% of the time. 

 

Someone can hold a rifle/pistol maker and ammo maker liable for issues.   It's hard to figure out who "Joe at the gun show" is if his ammo blows up your weapon.  Harder still to make him pay for it.

[m700]

It is definitely a liability boilerplate comment from their end. If they could get away with saying dont shoot ANY ammunition out of it and shield themselves completely they would. As long as the loader is careful and deliberate in their loading go for it. But I would shy away from other peoples loaded ammo if I haven't seen them load.

Buying factory remanufactured depending on who its from can be safe too. They are often loaded on camdex or equivalent that pressure test the brass. Stay away from "Joe at the gun show"

[gnoyesiv]

I would also think that they test fire with factory ammo, and that is what they use for the marketing of what the gun is capable of, and if someone reloading doesn't get the consistency or accuracy jp advertises then it must be the firearm companies fault.

[BlackBuzzard]

Maybe THIS is what JP was talking about?

Very low power factor rounds one after another, not even realizing the rounds never leave barrel?

JP Enterprises out of Hugo, Minnesota, posted a picture of a 9×19 mm barrel cut in half.

[Old3GNR]

My JP GMR-13 has never had a factory round shot through it.  9000 rounds with my reloads and no problem.  

[Shootymacshootface]

3 hours ago, BlackBuzzard said:

Maybe THIS is what JP was talking about?

Very low power factor rounds one after another, not even realizing the rounds never leave barrel?

JP Enterprises out of Hugo, Minnesota, posted a picture of a 9×19 mm barrel cut in half.

It looks like there is room for 1 or 2 more.

[Chillywig]

12 hours ago, Shootymacshootface said:

It looks like there is room for 1 or 2 more.

Must have ran the mag empty...

[pjb45]

There is a local ReMan. store in the PHX area that has good prices.  Three out of 500 rounds failed, the neck separated in the chamber and the second/third rounds were squibs in my JPs. Now this is .223 ammo.  Their quality control is next to worthless.

 

I have shot their 9mm in my SVs without a squib.  I do not buy from them anymore-not worth it.

 

However, prices at Walmart for 9mm are below 18 cents a round.  It is all I will shoot in my JP PCC.

 

I started reloading with my dad in the late 50s/early 60s.  No issues.

 

I reload on a 1050 9mm, 40S&W, 45ACP and .223 with no issues.