Designing stages/club director. Help or hurt your game

[B_RAD]

Looks like the folks that currently run our club matches will be stepping down at the end of the year. I can only imagine its taxing. 

 

 

So, got two questions. 

 

1. If my goal is to improve my skill level to legit GM level, would volunteering to be the club director be a problem? I can't help but think it would. 

 

2. Does designing stages help your game?  

Edited October 4, 2017 by B_RAD

[JAFO]

Your last inquiry was whether RO'ing during a match helped or hurt.  Have you been helping consistently?  If not, then don't volunteer to be the MD.

[MemphisMechanic]

I typically put together a couple of stages for my locals. By the time I’m don’t staking everything down, the consumer-only types have already spent 10 minutes per stage doping out exactly how to shoot them all. I haven’t even looked at my own, let alone airgunned all of the others.

 

If you only arrive to pull triggers and run off after it’s done, it’ll be easier to focus on your single selfish task. How much that matters, I don’t know.

Edited October 4, 2017 by MemphisMechanic

[B_RAD]

46 minutes ago, JAFO said:

Your last inquiry was whether RO'ing during a match helped or hurt.  Have you been helping consistently?  If not, then don't volunteer to be the MD.

I did not start that thread. I just commented on it. 

 

I end up being an RO or one of the RO's at every match.  Which is usually 3-5 per month between locals and other clubs within driving distance. I'm actually the only certified RO for our local club.   I don't want to but, I can't be selfish and say no.  I also help set up, break down.  I'm starting to design stages too.  I'd rather show up and shoot, I'd shoot better!  However, I can't be that guy! 

 

If someone doesn't step up to be the club director for next year we will not have any matches. I'm just trying to decide if I want to volunteer.  Every club has some people that we don't want to have running matches (don't think others think that's me?)  but they seem most likely to be the ones that volunteer.  So, I have to either be ok with not shooting matches 20 min from the house, or deal with those matches that are run by someone else, or do it myself.  Just trying to get informed before I do or do not volunteer. 

Edited October 4, 2017 by B_RAD

[motosapiens]

I think the key is to spread the work around. My wife and I design (and build) a stage for our local twice-monthly matches. It's only 1 stage, and we show up early, so we have plenty of time to put it together and proof it, and still spend 10-15 mins looking at the other stages that other people have volunteered to set up.

 

I personally find that the more involved I am, the better I shoot, and I can build stages that are more like what people will see at major matches

[B_RAD]

2 minutes ago, motosapiens said:

I think the key is to spread the work around. My wife and I design (and build) a stage for our local twice-monthly matches. It's only 1 stage, and we show up early, so we have plenty of time to put it together and proof it, and still spend 10-15 mins looking at the other stages that other people have volunteered to set up.

 

I personally find that the more involved I am, the better I shoot, and I can build stages that are more like what people will see at major matches

I shoot at one club that has each stage designed by a diferent group of people.  They put on a great match!  Stages are fun but difficult at the same time. 

 

And you hit on another reason to be the MD. I want to make stages like major matches. 

[nate89]

I have directed a weekly Wednesday evening unaffiliated match for about 3 years at the indoor range I work at.  I also design and set up the stages.  I find that it does have an impact on your match performance.  Any dispute or question that isn't resolved will make its way to you, and that is effort you are spending on running the match instead of focusing on your own shooting performance.

 

As a match director I believe you get a bit of satisfaction helping things run smoothly.  Also, if you set up stages, depending on when you are able to set up, you can finish in enough time that you can do the walk-through with everyone else.  At our club the bays for USPSA are almost always available the week beforehand for set-up, so many people will set a stage up during the week.

[MikeBurgess]

I'm the match director for my local club, and I don't believe it has affected my shooting ability overall, but I didn't put much work into that prior to being a match director. I can say is being the the guy in charge of a match affects my performance at that match, I tend to spend a fair bit of my attention checking on how the rest of the match is running rather than working with my squad and planning for my runs. 

The only issue between making your goal of being a GM and working as a MD is if you run out of time to do one or the other well. you may find that training for GM will help inspire your stage designs and building cool stages may motivate you to train harder.

[motosapiens]

also, when you go to a major match and are not working it, you will feel like a spoiled little princess that has all the time and attention-span in the world to do everything perfectly.

[rowdyb]

This is your chance to set the tone of your own club. And to shoot stages you like and have elements that you need to improve your performance.

 

Don't do it all, delegate. Don't  expect "awesome" or a cultural change right off the bat. Do expect to be tired and to know much more about what goes into running a match.

 

I say go for it.

[CHA-LEE]

Being an MD of a match can be as easy or as painful as you make it. You need a GROUP of dedicated volunteers to make club matches happen successfully without burning people out including yourself. Delegating tasks to others is a required skill if you don't want to run around with your head cutoff excessively on match day.

 

As an MD and GM myself I can give you my thoughts on the subject. I feel that I do a good job of delegating tasks properly on match day and don't overload myself with trying to do "everything". Could I do everything or get forced into doing everything some times? Absolutely. But I do my best to work with my team so the workload can be spread around. When I am serving as the MD, my match participation is intentionally put on the back burner. My top priority is to ensure that the match happens properly and that things run smoothly. Since shooting the match isn't the top priority, my performance does suffer, but my shooting performance in the match doesn't matter when my job is to run the match effectively. There are 8 - 10 other local club matches each month that I can attend as a "Consumer" and fully focus on my shooting performance. Sacrificing my shooting performance for one match a month to help run a match is worth it to me so I can give back to the sport I enjoy.

 

Up to this point, all of this may sound like losing proposition. But on the other side of the coin, being the MD for a match grants me access to all of the clubs props for practice. Having full access to the club props is HUGE as it enabled me to setup whatever I want in practice to test and hone whatever practical shooting skills I needed to perfect. Having access to the club props was absolutely a significant factor in achieving and maintaining GM skills, which I still leverage today.  

[teros135]

56 minutes ago, motosapiens said:

also, when you go to a major match and are not working it, you will feel like a spoiled little princess that has all the time and attention-span in the world to do everything perfectly.

 

Nice troll, Moto! 

[motosapiens]

19 hours ago, teros135 said:

 

Nice troll, Moto! 

not a troll at all, although I can see how it might sound like one. working some (but not all) matches has really increased my enjoyment of the ones I don't work, and it has certainly increased my appreciation of the staff at those matches.

[CrashDodson]

My experience.  

 

I started a USPSA club in Midland TX in December.  We already had a 3 gun club that I helped with on a regular basis.  I no longer shoot 3 gun but have made a lot of friends through that sport and still help them with their match as much as I can.  I got involved with the 3 gun group based on my IT knowledge and willingness to help them get going with Practiscore.  Fast forward a year and I start a USPSA club, I am also married with now 3 kids.  Im dry firing every night, trying to live fire at least once a week, run a match and balance home life.  It is very hard.  

 

I am very introverted, nothing makes me more uncomfortable than speaking in front of people, talking to people is a requirement to running a match i have found lol.  I find running the match as a good way to get me out of my shell a little bit.  We have gone from nothing to 6 stage matches with 50+ shooters, I have guys driving several hours to shoot our match and its because I work hard at designing and producing level 2+ stages at every match.  I post scores before most guys leave the parking lot.  Our range is a members only range, but they allow non members to shoot our match.  We are not allowed to setup for matches until 5PM the day before.  Unlike Cha-Lee we are not allowed to use props or steel outside of matches.  The problem we have is no matter how much I beg and try to guilt people into helping, we usually end up with 3-6 people coming out to help setup stages.  I already offer free match fees to anyone that helps but $20 is not enough to get people to come spend hours of their time.  We get enough help tearing down the match but myself and one or two others are left building stages by headlights the night before the match.  Its usually me and a bunch of older guys setting up the match.  I am quickly burning out.   

 

Being MD is stressful.  I will never be able to shoot my match the same as I can go and shoot a match somewhere else.  I have considered, and still consider not even shooting my own match.  By the time the match starts my mind is anywhere but in shooting mode. I also RO a squad and by the time its my turn to shoot I usually have to go find gear and load mags and feel very rushed.  If there is any benefit it is that I find myself super relaxed at other matches now.  To run the match I have to design stages, build a stage packet that I email out and post to our facebook before the match (I like to see stages before I get to a match so I know others do as well).  This takes several hours of my time in the weeks leading up to the match.  I then have to keep up with supplies: Pasters, Targets, Tape, Paint, Sticks, Staples, Stakes, Hammers, Drills, Saws etc.  I then have to keep up with the finances, take cash to the bank (some refuse to pay online), document all expenses.  You then have to repair walls and other props that get shot up or damaged in some way.  I also have to deal with the board of directors for the range and all the politics that go along with that.  If I was not shooting USPSA I would not have a membership at this range, or any other range for that matter, so dealing with the range and their politics is not fun.   

 

Like @CHA-LEE stated you need a good group of help that you can depend on.  Be prepared for that group to change over time as people get burnt out and you have to find new blood to swing hammers for a while.  

 

So........Is it worth it?  I dont know.  If I was single or no kids it wouldnt be as hard.  Does it get in the way of my own shooting goals?  Yes I think it does.  There is a quite a bit of time I have to spend on the match that I could have spent on my own practice.  Does designing stages help your game?  I have not found that it does, building them makes your arms and back stronger though

[B_RAD]

Thanks everyone for the input.  

 

I'm not gonna lie, part of me is ok with not having this match to shoot. I mean, spending 3 + hours driving to other clubs and not doing any "work" is almost more apealing. 

 

However, I'll probably end up volunteering. Its cha-lee said. It's only one match. If it suffers its not that big of a deal. I can treat it like its more of specific practice. For instsnce, set up a hard swinger and just make sure I prepare/and shoot that one aspect like its a match.  

 

 

[JAFO]

On ‎10‎/‎4‎/‎2017 at 1:10 PM, B_RAD said:

I did not start that thread. I just commented on it. 

 

I end up being an RO or one of the RO's at every match.  Which is usually 3-5 per month between locals and other clubs within driving distance. I'm actually the only certified RO for our local club.   I don't want to but, I can't be selfish and say no.  I also help set up, break down.  I'm starting to design stages too.  I'd rather show up and shoot, I'd shoot better!  However, I can't be that guy! 

 

If someone doesn't step up to be the club director for next year we will not have any matches. I'm just trying to decide if I want to volunteer.  Every club has some people that we don't want to have running matches (don't think others think that's me?)  but they seem most likely to be the ones that volunteer.  So, I have to either be ok with not shooting matches 20 min from the house, or deal with those matches that are run by someone else, or do it myself.  Just trying to get informed before I do or do not volunteer. 

 

My apologies.  I'm glad you've been volunteering to RO.  I honestly think that RO'ing improves my stage planning more than stage designing or being the Match Director.  When I'm RO'ing, I see the plans others make that I would never have thought of.  I also see the holes they find in the stages, which does help in stage designing.

 

If you design the entire match and have others setup your stages, be prepared for a lot of questions like, "did you mean for this target to be available from point A, B, or both?"  People usually want to set it up like you intended, but sometimes that's not always clear from the diagram.  If you have some people who have been shooting a while and have seen/designed a lot of stages, let them know that you trust them to fix a design issue (e.g., your design won't fit in the bay with safe distances to steel).  That can save you some time and frustration during setup.  You just need to note any significant changes during your walkthrough so you can update your WSB's, if needed.

 

Some other comments have mentioned other responsibilities like tracking finances, supplies, uploading scores, etc.  Our club is fortunate to have an executive committee, which includes President, VP, Treasurer, Secretary, and Range Master.  We rotate MD duties among all members, but for the most part the Treasurer handles financials, Secretary handles registration/scores, and Range Master handles supplies and organizes work days to fix props, etc.  Organizing like that can really help ease the burden on the Match Director.  Be sure to delegate where you can.  If things are running smoothly, I don't really notice much difference between our club matches where I'm just an RO vs being MD and an RO.

[B_RAD]

13 minutes ago, JAFO said:

 

My apologies.  I'm glad you've been volunteering to RO.  I honestly think that RO'ing improves my stage planning more than stage designing or being the Match Director.  When I'm RO'ing, I see the plans others make that I would never have thought of.  I also see the holes they find in the stages, which does help in stage designing.

 

If you design the entire match and have others setup your stages, be prepared for a lot of questions like, "did you mean for this target to be available from point A, B, or both?"  People usually want to set it up like you intended, but sometimes that's not always clear from the diagram.  If you have some people who have been shooting a while and have seen/designed a lot of stages, let them know that you trust them to fix a design issue (e.g., your design won't fit in the bay with safe distances to steel).  That can save you some time and frustration during setup.  You just need to note any significant changes during your walkthrough so you can update your WSB's, if needed.

 

Some other comments have mentioned other responsibilities like tracking finances, supplies, uploading scores, etc.  Our club is fortunate to have an executive committee, which includes President, VP, Treasurer, Secretary, and Range Master.  We rotate MD duties among all members, but for the most part the Treasurer handles financials, Secretary handles registration/scores, and Range Master handles supplies and organizes work days to fix props, etc.  Organizing like that can really help ease the burden on the Match Director.  Be sure to delegate where you can.  If things are running smoothly, I don't really notice much difference between our club matches where I'm just an RO vs being MD and an RO.

No problem. 

 

More good info. Thanks. 

[motosapiens]

3 hours ago, CrashDodson said:

  We are not allowed to setup for matches until 5PM the day before.  Unlike Cha-Lee we are not allowed to use props or steel outside of matches.  The problem we have is no matter how much I beg and try to guilt people into helping, we usually end up with 3-6 people coming out to help setup stages.  I already offer free match fees to anyone that helps but $20 is not enough to get people to come spend hours of their time.  We get enough help tearing down the match but myself and one or two others are left building stages by headlights the night before the match.  Its usually me and a bunch of older guys setting up the match.  I am quickly burning out.   

 

 

I would burn out pretty fast if I had to make an extra trip to the range for every match. We do 4 field stages and 2 classifiers for our matches, and we set them up the morning of the match. It literally takes 2-4 people an hour to set up a field stage. As long as you have 4 different people that can take charge, things run pretty smooth and quick. We advertise setup starts at 7:30, but i would recommend taking a different approach. I would say the match starts at 7:30 (or 8:30) in winter, and shooting starts as soon as the stages are set up.

It is imho really important to delegate, and also really important to not make people make extra trips out to the range unless they really have to. It's only 12-14 mins for me each way, but most of our folks live 2-3 times as far.

[Maximis228]

I made master in open in early 2016. I was already helping out with stage design a little and then I took over MD of our club around May 2016. I make all the stage for our club now (33 total matches a year) all in sketch up. I finally made GM in April of this year. It doesnt really help out as Im taking away a lot of time to make our 135 unique stages in sketch up (About :45 per stage to be fully exported into a WSB). I also was retarded and decided to take on another local clubs stage deisng as they sucked and people stopped going because of it. So that's another 60 unique stages I'm making.

 

I have a really good group of guys at both clubs to help with set up so that is a non issue but the time at the computer making good unique stages is taxing.

[CrashDodson]

That is a valid option.  I live 40 minutes from the range.  I just know how long it takes for us to set them up the day before.  Getting 20 people to help the morning of could be a challenge.  

 

I have thought about trying this method, but I feel like I would be even more stressed out then I am already.  I get to the range on the day of the match and all that needs to be done usually is hanging targets and setting activators and a few misc things. Then make sure sign up gets done and tablets taken care of.  That alone is enough to stress me out lol.  

[CrashDodson]

1 minute ago, Maximis228 said:

I made master in open in early 2016. I was already helping out with stage design a little and then I took over MD of our club around May 2016. I make all the stage for our club now (33 total matches a year) all in sketch up. I finally made GM in April of this year. It doesnt really help out as Im taking away a lot of time to make our 135 unique stages in sketch up (About :45 per stage to be fully exported into a WSB). I also was retarded and decided to take on another local clubs stage deisng as they sucked and people stopped going because of it. So that's another 60 unique stages I'm making.

 

I have a really good group of guys at both clubs to help with set up so that is a non issue but the time at the computer making good unique stages is taxing.

Building the stages in sketchup does take a while.  Even when copying and pasting stuff from previous stages. 

[Maximis228]

Just now, CrashDodson said:

Building the stages in sketchup does take a while.  Even when copying and pasting stuff from previous stages. 

 

146 hours just making stages per year. Thats a lot of dry fire time im missing out on.

[CrashDodson]

At our range we have these massive sun shade things in the bays.  They are held up by large steel posts.  I build the stage then on the ground have to figure out how to avoid shooting these dang posts and keeping steel out from under the canopy.

[motosapiens]

i only do 1 stage at a time. I sketch it out on a napkin while drinking a beer (general concept). Then we just build it. 

[CHA-LEE]

I found that morning of match stage setup goes best when you have one dedicated stage designer per stage setting up their own stage. Doing it this way optimizes the setup time because they already know what the intent of their stage is and how it should look. That way they can simply get it done without second guessing anything.

 

If you are designing all of the stages then trying to let others setup your stage on their own, it can lead to some pretty inconsistent results, setup delays and also cause a lot of stress the morning of the match.

 

This is where delegating work comes into play. Delegate stage design to your match staff and vet their proposed stages the week before the match. Doing it that way there are no surprises on match day and the whole setup process runs a lot smoother.

 

My club sets up the stages in the morning of the match starting at 7AM and we are usually done with setup by 8 - 8:30AM. After the stages are setup I walk all of the stages from a safety / legal perspective and tweak them as needed. Usually only small tweaks are needed here or there to get them right for the match. Then we can all walk the stages from a competitor perspective before the match starts at 10AM.

 

Could I go out there the day before and setup 5 - 6 of my own stages all by my self? Sure. But why make it that painful when I can delegate the setup effort effectively to the rest of the match staff while allowing them to setup their own stage designs. As I said early on in this thread, you can make the MD job as easy or painful as you want.