Resizing bulged cases

[diehli]

Recently I traded my .45 brass (since I no longer own the .45) for some deprimed and polished .40 brass that I can use when I get into reloading in the not-to-distant future.

A percentage of the cases are slightly bulged, but otherwise in good condition. Can they be resized so that they'll fit my chamber (not that I've tried to get them in there yet) and be safe?

TIA from a reloading greeny.

[3quartertime]

Yea they can be resized and used.  Most buldging happens from an unsupported barrel like a glock.  I've reloaded lots of glock range brass and had a very low chamber fail rate.  When you start reloading explore some of the posts about full length resizing dies like the Lee U,  or Lee Factory Crimp Die.  Should whip the brass back into shape.

Safe?  Resizing a buldge is cold working the brass at a very pressure critical place.  The chances of failure rise considerably.  I've shot alot of it though with the only failures being splitting at the case mouth area.  I think if you just load to make major and use a fully supported barrel the risk is acceptable.  Just my .02 thou.

Patrick Sweeney was doing some research about .40 case head seperations a while back I think.  Might do a search and try and find some of his info on it.  

Good Luck    

[warpspeed]

300lbgorilla,

My solution to the "bulge" is to roll size. I think that it is the ideal way to return the brass back to spec.  3/4 time is corrrect that the bulge is usually caused by firing in an unsuported barell like a Glock.

I roll size my 40 brass regardless of source and have had zero problems in feeding or extraction.

IMHO, you should use a chamber checker for all loaded rounds that are in brass that may have come form an "unknown" source. This will catch the cases that the press doesn't completely resize. In using rollsized brass, I get a 100% pass rate. It is a simple question of money.

If you compare cost, once fired to new, you are looking at $ 10 for once fired and $ 90 for new. Thats a big spread. So for about $ 20/ M + shipping, brass that has been cleaned and roll sized is more expensive  than unprocessed but less than new. And in my opinion, just as good. Especially for brass at a match where you may not pick up the brass but want that extra measure of assurance that the brass will not cause a malfunction.

[shameless plug mode on]

If you find the need/desire to try some.....

http://www.competitionbrass.com

[kimel]

Soooo....how does one Roll Size brass?

Heard this term used for years but never really bothered to figure out the methodology.

Does one just roll the brass between two metal plates until it is of uniform diameter?  Sounds too darn simple.

Cheers!

Kevin

[diehli]

Hrm... interesting. Thanks for the replies, 3/4time and warpspeed. That site lists $18.50 to roll size and reship 1000 cases (currently I have about 500). It might be worth it. The price for brass is pretty cheap, too. I think I'll invest in ammo to start with, though, then gather that brass and start reloading on the press that I have available (before I buy my own). Probably have things roll-sized somewhere along the line.

I've got the same question as kimel. What exactly is roll-sizing?

My next question is in regards to what I'm shooting. Currently I have a Glock 35 set up for limited. The spent cases appear to be fine, but I'm not sure whether or not the chamber is fully supported. I'm planning on getting a barrel to shoot lead from (better safe than sorry), but should I move that purchase up on the list solely because of the fact that my stock barrel may or may not be fully supported? Serial number is EEXXXXUS if this helps a Glock-o-phile identify whether or not the chamber is fully supported.

TIA!

[benos]

A roll sizer is a designed to resize the entire case body (all the way down to the extractor groove) by squeezing the case through a two nearly parallel bars of flat stock. The bars are slightly wider where the case enters, and by the time the case exits the resizer the bars are the width of the saami spec for that case.

If you search through the Reloading and Glock forums you should find quite a few threads on Glocks/supported barrel/40 cal/powder/bullet weight. It's a complex relationship that basically comes down to - don't push anything that influences pressure in a 40 Glock. Always stay on the safe side of life. (Sung to the Monty Python ditty of - "Always look on the bright side of life.")

be

[kimel]

Hmmm...thanks BE.

Now I am pondering how a guy could make one at home...hmmm....shouldn't be THAT hard...

Maybe Dillon needs to make one.

Oh great...now that ditty is stuck in my head for the second time this week!    Just watched Life of Brian again Monday night and spent most of Tuesday whistling that tune.  Drove the wife nuts...  

[diehli]

Aha... therein lies the problem. I searched the Glock forum for "fully supported barrel" and came up with a locked thread that had very little substance. Then the dinner bell rang.

This damn 31.2k connection is the bane of my existence!

Thanks for the 411, be.

[warpspeed]

BE is exactly correct  ( as usual I might add )

Kimel,

I use a casepro from  

http://www.casepro.net

It is pretty solid and set up to be fed from a Dillon casefeeder. It works very well.

300lb,

try Barsto Precision Machine for a Glock barrell that is fully supported. I think they will even fit it for you if you send them the gun.

http://www.barsto.com

[Flexmoney]

OK...he is my two cents.

-  I shoot a Glock.

-  In 40

-  with a factory Glock barrel

-  I use a progressive press (less chance of a double powder charge)

-  I do NOT shoot lead bullet

-  I don't use the Dillon re-sizing die (mine is Federal)

-  I do use a Dillon case gauge to check each round

-  I am picky about which brass I use for Major loads

-  my loads don't show any signs of pressure

(TiteGroup powder, 180g JHP from Zero Bullets)

[kimel]

Ahhh...Case Pro.  Yeah, I looked into those once and they are kinda expensive.  But I am sure they are worth it.  Didn't I hear a rumor that they stopped making those awhile back?

I don't shoot a Glock, they don't fit my hand right...at least the ones I have shot don't.  

My 40 barrel is fully supported but I do buy once-fired brass that comes from ranges where lots of Glock's are used so see a few bulged cases now and then.

Thus far I have just run the obviously bulged cases through an RCBS sizing die and they have worked just fine.  Many are on their 3rd or 4th reload with 175PF loads an no problems.

Currently pondering how to make a "poor man's roll sizer".    Will have to wander by and visit with a machinist friend one of these days.

Cheers!

Kevin

[Rich Bagoly]

I have seen a few cases that were cracked in the web area, and separating.  My take is that any brass that needs more than a Lee U-die, should not be reloaded.  I toss any case that I can ID as having been roll sized, because I don't know how much it was worked.

.40 s&w brass is too cheap to re-use anything questionable.

I pick up cases at the range that have me convinced that some real idiots are out there.

[warpspeed]

There seems to be this misconception that roll sizing brass works it more than vertical sizing does. I do not think that to be the case. In fact, if you think about it, when you roll size you push the brass back in the direction it came from. On a traditional press, you are squeezing it down and in. Same net effect, brass back where it came from. The amount of "working" is basically the same. The advantage to roll sizing is that you resize the entire length of the case all the way down to the groove. This is not the case with vertical sizing dies. They need to have that flare in order to feed the case.

It is far more important to know that the brass was truly once fired from commercial loads and not range pick-up at a match where everyone was shooting major loads. True once fired cases are very plentiful and very inexpensive. There is no real reason to shoot major loads in range pick ups.

I started shooting roll sized brass for 1 reason: The gun functions better with it than without.

[gm iprod]

I have machined the shellplate on the Dillon to accept the sizing die a little lower, and I have removed a small amount of material ( not the carbide ) from the bottom of the sizing die. These two things individually do not make a huge difference, but together they work real well.

Be carefull about removing to much from the shellplate, it will weaken the area that pulls the case from the sizing die. Too much metal removed will result in a broken shellplate. Complete cleaning and lubrication of cases is madatory, this helps ease everything along nicely.

[Singlestack]

EGW sells a Lee U die that they modify to go down further that a standard die. When using a Dillon sizing die I would get about 20 rejects per 100 (40 S&W). Since switching to the EGW die, its down to 3 or 4.

I was using a Dillon sizing die for my 38 Super until I bought a non-Dillon case gage and found out that the only thing that would pass my gage out of the Dillon die was new brass. I just loaded 1000rds of Super this morning using a EGW die I just got and I had 9 that did not pass the gage and they all will still chamber easily.

Cheaper than a roll sizer.

[cardboardkiller]

Just get a Schuemann AET barrel, they are so loose you can run with whatever you end up, I'm new to loading 40 and it is still quite spooky to me to be using "Glocked up" brass, any thoughts on the AET barrels and the aforementioned brass? My brass won't pass the case gage, but run like a champ in my SV.

[tightloop]

That does not sound like it contributes to good accuracy.

[cardboardkiller]

A five shot group at 50 yards that measures 1 1/4" with factory cor-bon ammo, sounds like perfect accuracy. My understanding is that the loose fluted chamber allows the gas to flow more uniformly along with  the progressive twist rifling of the barrel keeps the bullet more stable. A friend of mine has a 9mm with a test target that measures .472 at 50 yards, he can shoot 8'"plates at 50 yards all day long. The AET system must work, if not they wouldn't sell and SV wouldn't jeapordize their reputation with them, call and get the lead time on one of their true Limited pistols if you don't believe me.

[shred]

The poor-man's roll-sizer is a 'push-through' setup-- remove the decapping stem from a .40 sizing die (or crimp/seat bits from a Lee FCD, which is probably better) and fashion a punch for the shellplate such that the case-to-be-sized is pushed completely through the sizing die and out the top.  You can push them either right-side up or upside down.

Easiest done on a spare single-stage press with a die like Dillon or Lee FCD that have a full-diameter when the decapping stem is removed.  It won't work with a RCBS-style die.

Somebody was demoing a commercial version of this with casefeeder attachment at Area 2 this year.  Looks a whole lot like the Case-Sizer jr at : http://www.magmaengr.com/

(Edited by shred at 6:09 pm on Dec. 29, 2002)

[S-Hurt]

Yeah ... Casepro is the best if you can get one. My advice is to spring for all the dies to your new Casepro because it is really hard to get a set after your initial purchase.

[Baer45]

Case Pro.....please fill our orders......please?????

[RePete]

I bought one last year and will not part with it.

Well worth the wait.