Trumpet Posted February 19, 2014 Share Posted February 19, 2014 Ok, So first off, I pretty much posted this on ARFCOM and similar questions on SH as well, so if you're seeing my "handle" and the topic....I apologize, just move on . Anyway, I'm looking to build a precision AR build. However, I'm on a budget and I DON'T like the big varmint style bull barrels. I want a rifle that can really shine in terms of accuracy, but also fit the 3 gun role should I A) get the time to go, and find a place near me that sponsors matches. Anyway, I'm asking here because the more I go over what I want, the more it sounds like a really accurate 3 gun rifle. So, my wants.... 18" Wylde Stainless (or nitrided) 1:8 (but 1:7 would work too) Rifle Gas NOT a bull barrel. Think SPR-ish Very strong/light/thin rail. I don't want/need all the picatinny rail-estate for "gernade" launchers/chainsaws/IR/Thermal/Night vision etc. JUST a place for a bipod. I already have several BCM BCGs and I would be mounting this upper to an assembled lower I already have from when I shot high power, a RRA with 2-stage match trigger tweaked by John Holliger. So, you can see it really does look and sound like a 3 gun upper. Now, for sheer accuracy ON A BUDGET..which barrel would you go with..... WOA (1:7, but I think I can deal) Black Hole (supposedly very nice barrels, but I don't know about their accuracy) AR Performance (great reviews, and the fluted melonited barrels sound nice) Nordic (MarkCO has been speaking to me over at SH about them, and they sound sweet) At one time, I had a GAP bolt gun, so I'm no stranger to accuracy.....it's just that now I'm a stranger to BUDGET accuracy. Recommendations? Thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blairmckenzie1 Posted February 19, 2014 Share Posted February 19, 2014 (edited) I have a black hole that is turned down quite a bit. shoots well and cleans up easily. if you didn't have access to a lathe i think it would be way heavy for 3 gun the way it comes. White Oak and Nordic are all good choices too. Edited February 19, 2014 by blairmckenzie1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheDude Posted February 19, 2014 Share Posted February 19, 2014 I have used a Nordic barrel and it has performed well over the years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B45C22 Posted February 19, 2014 Share Posted February 19, 2014 The Nordic or a Jp will serve you well. I use a carbon fiber handguard from lancer and it is awesome. You will want 1:7 or 1:8 so you can shoot the bigger bullets for a little better accuracy in wind. I know it's a 223 but every little bit helps. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jjw Posted February 19, 2014 Share Posted February 19, 2014 (edited) Ok, So first off, I pretty much posted this on ARFCOM and similar questions on SH as well, so if you're seeing my "handle" and the topic....I apologize, just move on . Anyway, I'm looking to build a precision AR build. However, I'm on a budget and I DON'T like the big varmint style bull barrels. I want a rifle that can really shine in terms of accuracy, but also fit the 3 gun role should I A) get the time to go, and find a place near me that sponsors matches. Anyway, I'm asking here because the more I go over what I want, the more it sounds like a really accurate 3 gun rifle. So, my wants.... 18" Wylde Stainless (or nitrided) 1:8 (but 1:7 would work too) Rifle Gas NOT a bull barrel. Think SPR-ish Very strong/light/thin rail. I don't want/need all the picatinny rail-estate for "gernade" launchers/chainsaws/IR/Thermal/Night vision etc. JUST a place for a bipod. I already have several BCM BCGs and I would be mounting this upper to an assembled lower I already have from when I shot high power, a RRA with 2-stage match trigger tweaked by John Holliger. So, you can see it really does look and sound like a 3 gun upper. Now, for sheer accuracy ON A BUDGET..which barrel would you go with..... WOA (1:7, but I think I can deal) Black Hole (supposedly very nice barrels, but I don't know about their accuracy) AR Performance (great reviews, and the fluted melonited barrels sound nice) Nordic (MarkCO has been speaking to me over at SH about them, and they sound sweet) At one time, I had a GAP bolt gun, so I'm no stranger to accuracy.....it's just that now I'm a stranger to BUDGET accuracy. Recommendations? Thanks many of us use dan def, 1/7-14.5" lite wt bbls. dont get any better than that. 3 gun with a s&b or an eotec on same with 11.5. bbl. i will never be a serious competitoragain becaue of injuries bt i see no difference in 11.5 and 14.5 and longer in the 3 gun i shoot to 400 yds. longer i use the s&b uppper. my accuracy ios still good just cant move as fast as i could at 1 time. jjw Edited February 19, 2014 by jjw Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gose Posted February 19, 2014 Share Posted February 19, 2014 -1 on WOA. I have two of their 20" SDM barrels but the experience of sending one of them back to have it fixed left a sour taste in my mouth, both in terms of quality and CS. Kinda the exact opposite of Nordic... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ClutchUSMC Posted February 19, 2014 Share Posted February 19, 2014 Sounds like you want a Nordic barrel then! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike_M Posted February 20, 2014 Share Posted February 20, 2014 I'm not sure how you do "precision" on a budget but the local AR shop around here says that accuracy comes from the bolt and the barrel. So how much precision are you willing to pay for there? I ended up with a Black Hole barrel and it seems to shoot great, but I'm only using iron sights, so I'm not really sure. As long as it's not a chrome lined barrel, I'm sure you'd have to spend an exponential amount of money more for a "precision" barrel for it to shoot a little better over a more "budget" barrel. See what I'm saying? It's not linear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike_M Posted February 20, 2014 Share Posted February 20, 2014 PS - FWIW, I had basically the exact same build requirements for my rifle as your list. I wanted the most precsion I could get for the least amount of $. I jumped on a good deal on my BHW barrel and it's not exactly what I had spec'd out, but seems to shoot better than me anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ac4wordplay Posted February 20, 2014 Share Posted February 20, 2014 I'm not sure how you do "precision" on a budget but the local AR shop around here says that accuracy comes from the bolt and the barrel. So how much precision are you willing to pay for there? I ended up with a Black Hole barrel and it seems to shoot great, but I'm only using iron sights, so I'm not really sure. As long as it's not a chrome lined barrel, I'm sure you'd have to spend an exponential amount of money more for a "precision" barrel for it to shoot a little better over a more "budget" barrel. See what I'm saying? It's not linear. Yeah... I'd like someone to explain how an AR bolt can demonstrably deliver superior accuracy over any "in spec" AR bolt. Which local shop was this - I hope it wasn't Curt's? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flatland Shooter Posted February 20, 2014 Share Posted February 20, 2014 (edited) I have a black hole that is turned down quite a bit. shoots well and cleans up easily. if you didn't have access to a lathe i think it would be way heavy for 3 gun the way it comes. White Oak and Nordic are all good choices too. I went with the Black Hole Weaponry 18" standard barrel and you are right, it is kinda heavy. But I'm upgrading from an inexpensive unlined 16" barrel so it may just take me a little time to get used to the extra weight. I'm very impressed with the accuracy but would like it a bit lighter. Probably won't mess with it for fear of hurting the accuracy. One other point about the BHW barrel, when I ordered it I thought it would come with a Wylde chamber but it turns out I was looking at old information. At some point last year they went to 5.56 chambers. Bill Edited February 20, 2014 by Flatland Shooter Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trumpet Posted February 20, 2014 Author Share Posted February 20, 2014 I have a black hole that is turned down quite a bit. shoots well and cleans up easily. if you didn't have access to a lathe i think it would be way heavy for 3 gun the way it comes. White Oak and Nordic are all good choices too. I went with the Black Hole Weaponry 18" standard barrel and you are right, it is kinda heavy. But I'm upgrading from an inexpensive unlined 16" barrel so it may just take me a little time to get used to the extra weight. I'm very impressed with the accuracy but would like it a bit lighter. Probably won't mess with it for fear of hurting the accuracy. One other point about the BHW barrel, when I ordered it I thought it would come with a Wylde chamber but it turns out I was looking at old information. At some point last year they went to 5.56 chambers. Bill Hmmmm I was told that their 18" tubes had Wylde chambers..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan Sierpina Posted February 20, 2014 Share Posted February 20, 2014 Black Hole told me that they use a Wylde chamber. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
larry weeks Posted February 20, 2014 Share Posted February 20, 2014 Maybe the gunsmith that said the bolt and barrel are key was talking about bolt fit, not so much the bolt itself. And that really comes down to Key to gas tube fit. Make sure they line up perfectly and the key slides over smoothly, make absolutely sure the barrel nut isn't tweaking the gas tube and you'll be fine with most any decent quality barrel and a load it likes. All my barrels outshoot me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike_M Posted February 20, 2014 Share Posted February 20, 2014 Yeah... I'd like someone to explain how an AR bolt can demonstrably deliver superior accuracy over any "in spec" AR bolt. Which local shop was this - I hope it wasn't Curt's? You got it AC! I was looking at a rifle they had on consignment with a Young Manufacturing National Match bolt and the kid (wasn't Curt) was talking about the bolt and barrel being the only things that really affect accuracy... So if the bolt DOESN'T affect accuracy, what is a "National Match" bolt for? Just more mass so it increases lock time or something? Has nothing to do with accuracy? I'm also confused by BHW barrels. Their website I think lists them as Wylde chaimbers, but my barrel is certainly marked 5.56! I think I got mine in Nov-13, so not that long ago... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StarvinPilgrim Posted February 20, 2014 Share Posted February 20, 2014 I just built the same type of rifle basically. MI gen II SS handguard with a Nordic barrel. Unfortunately my barrel was having some accuracy issues and i had to send it back to them a few days ago. The employee I spoke with was good to work with and I'm sure they will make it right. Everything I hear about these barrels is top notch but lucky me I got a 1 in a thousand defect. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flatland Shooter Posted February 20, 2014 Share Posted February 20, 2014 Black Hole told me that they use a Wylde chamber. If it is a Wylde chamber, how would it appear on the barrel. My barrel indicate 5.56. so could it be a Wylde chamber? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fastshooter03 Posted February 21, 2014 Share Posted February 21, 2014 Black Hole told me that they use a Wylde chamber. If it is a Wylde chamber, how would it appear on the barrel. My barrel indicate 5.56. so could it be a Wylde chamber? I doubt it. Would say " 223 WYLDE ". Nick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan Sierpina Posted February 21, 2014 Share Posted February 21, 2014 That's what I was told in an email when I inquired. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flatland Shooter Posted February 21, 2014 Share Posted February 21, 2014 I guess in my case it don't make no difference. I'm very happy with the accuracy and that's what counts. Bill Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trumpet Posted February 23, 2014 Author Share Posted February 23, 2014 Ok, So I'm gradually getting my stuff together. I'm pretty much decided on a Mega upper or a Spike's "slickside". However, does anyone have any experience with WMD uppers? I've heard about their BCGs but not their uppers. I've seen some pretty good deals on them. Are they built with good specs? Will the Nordic barrel run well with 193? On occasion I might use that too. Trying to pick a lightweight but STRONG forearm. I like the looks of the MI SS G2, I like the Seekins too but it's a little on the $$ side. How are the Nordic tubes and the various carbon fiber? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve RA Posted February 23, 2014 Share Posted February 23, 2014 I've got an AP carbon fiber, 15", weighs 6 oz. Like it quite well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flatland Shooter Posted February 23, 2014 Share Posted February 23, 2014 How are the Nordic tubes and the various carbon fiber? For the money, the Nordic Comp handguards are one of the best deals out there. Weight is not bad and the quality is excellent. Just recently put a 15" HG on my 18" gun. Bill Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StarvinPilgrim Posted February 25, 2014 Share Posted February 25, 2014 Ok, So I'm gradually getting my stuff together. I'm pretty much decided on a Mega upper or a Spike's "slickside". However, does anyone have any experience with WMD uppers? I've heard about their BCGs but not their uppers. I've seen some pretty good deals on them. Are they built with good specs? Will the Nordic barrel run well with 193? On occasion I might use that too. Trying to pick a lightweight but STRONG forearm. I like the looks of the MI SS G2, I like the Seekins too but it's a little on the $$ side. How are the Nordic tubes and the various carbon fiber? I mainly shoot 193 and the nordic I had would not shoot it. But it wouldn't shoot heavier bullets either. Best it would do was 3" @ 100yds. Sent it back last week and waiting on Nordic to get back with me. I'm hoping they'll exchange it because I really liked the set up with the MI SS G2 and I know guys with the same barrel that shoots great. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LoganbillJ Posted February 25, 2014 Share Posted February 25, 2014 I put a Nordic on my new build for this season. Shoots great. Shot a .546" 10 shot group at 100 yds with hand loads. Can't say enough good things about the barrel. I am running a 15" AP carbon fiber on it and it swings well. Very light out front. I don't know how "slick" sided you want your upper but I went with a rainier with the FA deleted and love it. Barrel extension was a very tight fit in the receiver. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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