thompsoncustom Posted December 30, 2013 Share Posted December 30, 2013 I've got some time on my hands and some money burning a hole in my pocket so I might make a Open style gun just for target shooting at home. I've never had any experience with any Open guns but I'm guessing that the compensators are mostly for major loads. Is there any that work great for minor? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
a matt Posted December 30, 2013 Share Posted December 30, 2013 Steel challenge Shooters shoot open minor. Maybe one of them will help. You can check with Shay at Akai I know he has built open minor steel guns. Cheers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thompsoncustom Posted December 30, 2013 Author Share Posted December 30, 2013 I've got some time on my hands and some money burning a hole in my pocket so I might make a Open style gun just for target shooting at home. I've never had any experience with any Open guns but I'm guessing that the compensators are mostly for major loads. Is there any that work great for minor? I posted the above in the Open pistol form and one of the members said this might be a better place to ask. So you steel shooter have any recommendations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toolguy Posted December 30, 2013 Share Posted December 30, 2013 Also ask in the Bianchi Forum. Everyone there shoots minor, many with comps. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hi-Power Jack Posted December 30, 2013 Share Posted December 30, 2013 I've shot some minor loads thru my TruBor, and the recoil seems less than with my BHP (No comp). Not sure how much or if there's a "better" comp for minor loads, but this seems to help, to me. IMHO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toothguy Posted December 30, 2013 Share Posted December 30, 2013 You might look for something like a STI Steelmaster I see them for sale on this forum occasionally. It has a T1 comp with 2 ports that is designed to shoot minor loads. The right powder and bullet combo makes a big difference when shooting minor with a comp. You want a slower powder and light bullet so you have more gas to work the comp. AutoComp and Power Pistol are both great slower powders that work well for minor comped guns. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rick88 Posted December 30, 2013 Share Posted December 30, 2013 I have shot some legal steel loads with no comp that almost felt like a 22, I dont why you would even need a comp for steel but many use them, so there must be something that I dont know...Unless it just a matter of making a gun function that is not a dedicated steel gun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drysideshooter Posted December 30, 2013 Share Posted December 30, 2013 I have an XDm 9mm with a Springer 2 port comp on it, and tomorrow will be receiving a new XDm in 9mm from Springer Precision with a 2 port comp and some other work that is set up for Steel Challenge. I was talking with Scott Springer about the comps, and with their two port comp his thoughts are if the load is enough for the gun to function, the comp will reduce muzzle rise. I had a SVI 2011 in 38 super comp (major) and loaded with Autocomp for that. For the 9mm minor loads I have been happiest with WSF so far. My goal with any gun with an optic on it is for the dot to stay on the target, and if my grip and everything is right, the gun will return to where it was when I pulled the trigger. If you want to delve into an open gun for target shooting or steel with minor loads I would suggest going with an XD/XDm or a Glock. Threaded barrels and comps are available and easy to install, and you will have a gun that should be easy to get running and keep running. There are quite a few choices in optics and mounts. If you decide it's not for you, the components that you used to make it an open gun are pretty easy to sell and you can take your gun back to being a base gun very easily. You will want a good trigger for steel, but that work and anything else you do to improve the base gun isn't lost if you return it to base form. Talk with Scott Springer about XD/XDm's, or if you are more of a Glock guy, talk with Bobby Carver. There seems to be an increasing number of people using platforms other than a 2011 for open guns, even in major. The general consensus seems to be that for major, a 2011 is probably the platform that makes the most sense though. Shooting with an optic is a real kick in the pants and it's easy to get addicted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hornetx40 Posted December 31, 2013 Share Posted December 31, 2013 I have shot some legal steel loads with no comp that almost felt like a 22, I dont why you would even need a comp for steel but many use them, so there must be something that I dont know...Unless it just a matter of making a gun function that is not a dedicated steel gun. What do you mean by "Legal" steel loads? There is no power factor for SC. Matt Cheeley has done a lot of work on Comps and has a new Ti Comp that is supposed to work much better. I'll find out once my new open gun is done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thompsoncustom Posted December 31, 2013 Author Share Posted December 31, 2013 (edited) I'll probably throw it on a old surplus CZ 75, no plans on competing with it just a range toy. I see a lot of 3+ ports available but not a lot of 2 port comps. I'm guessing less gas works better with less ports. Edited December 31, 2013 by thompsoncustom Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DougCarden Posted December 31, 2013 Share Posted December 31, 2013 When I get my Shorty STI steel gun back from Hard Chrome and it warms up a bit you are welcome to come down and shoot my SC loads 115jhp at 1050 and then try some 95jhp loads at 1200 and see what you like. I know I tried the 95s for a couple of years, but due to price and ease of loading I settled on the 115 at 1050. The Comp may work better with the 95 grain loads but I am more consistent on the plates with the 115 load..... Just send me a PM... DougC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toothguy Posted December 31, 2013 Share Posted December 31, 2013 (edited) http://www.ccgunworks.com/store/shop/titanium-open-compensator/ http://www.egwguns.com/comp-blanks-extras/3-port-aluminum-comp-hybrid/ http://www.shootersconnectionstore.com/Bedell-Custom-Titanium-Comp-P1759.aspx http://gansguns.com/MAINCOMPS.html Edited December 31, 2013 by toothguy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kneelingatlas Posted December 31, 2013 Share Posted December 31, 2013 Dan, Your 60gr zinc bullets would make an awesome minor load! If you loaded them over a case full (9-10gr) of a slow powder (HS-6, AutoComp, etc.) you'd get enough gas to work just about any comp, but still be way under major PF (maybe even under minor PF).This airsoft comp actually shot pretty flat albeit pretty hard in the hand with Major loads (there's not much baffle area), but work great with your light bullets. This is how it started: then I cut off the male threads, drilled it out and tapped it; it was like $17 shipped from China.I also have a few two port small frame Witness comps like this one from Numrich: The nice thing about Small frame Witnesses is that their barrels have an OD of 14mm, just like CZ Tactical Sport, SP01, and others (basically all of them but the 9mm 75B and 9mm compacts). I have the taps and dies, so I'd love to help with ideas and/or implementation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rick88 Posted December 31, 2013 Share Posted December 31, 2013 I have shot some legal steel loads with no comp that almost felt like a 22, I dont why you would even need a comp for steel but many use them, so there must be something that I dont know...Unless it just a matter of making a gun function that is not a dedicated steel gun. What do you mean by "Legal" steel loads? There is no power factor for SC. Matt Cheeley has done a lot of work on Comps and has a new Ti Comp that is supposed to work much better. I'll find out once my new open gun is done. If I read it right 95gr is the lowest legal weight, the gun I shot was using that with a very light load there seemed to be no recoil at all, and no comp. I'm not sure how steel shooting works but if your ever had to knock steel down instead of just hitting it one time that load would need to be bumped up, then I could see needing a comp. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hornetx40 Posted December 31, 2013 Share Posted December 31, 2013 Recoil is detrimental to consistent, accurate, fast shooting. If it wasn't we would still be shooting 45's. Because there is no power factor requirement in SC competitors have slowly switched over to the 9mm and sub minor loads. The egos of men tell them I can shoot that big hand cannon and I like it. The truth is the male ego likes the adrenalin rush but doesn't like to loose. If you think recoil in any amount doesn't matter then time yourself with a 45 vs a 9mm. The further you can reduce recoil the faster you can be. Adding a comp to a gun immediately changes how the action works and will need different recoil springs. Usually the slides are also lightened to help with faster sight acquisition....Everything you modify changes how the gun works. There are many other factors also. If you are just shooting SC you can run light loads and design the gun around that. Many shooters also shoot IDPA or USPSA and must follow their respective rules. Money is a limiting factor to most shooters so a gun that will shoot multiple disciplines is ideal for them. It all depends on what you want to shoot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
56hawk Posted January 1, 2014 Share Posted January 1, 2014 Comps work fine with minor loads. You just need to run the lightest weight bullets with the slowest powder. What's going to be harder is finding an open gun that will run at minor pf. Might need some extra slide lightening. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drysideshooter Posted January 1, 2014 Share Posted January 1, 2014 I just received this gun from Scott Springer today. It's my second open XDm for Steel Challenge. This one has had a LOT of slide lightening though and is using a 1911 recoil rod/spring. It has a two port comp. I am looking forward to working up a load for this gun. I have been most happy with WSF in my other comp'd XDm 9mm and I will try that and Autocomp for this one, and some Vit N320 when I can get some. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZackJones Posted January 1, 2014 Share Posted January 1, 2014 That's a good looking gun! If it were mine though I'd be a little nervous about those slide cuts up front. The meta left between the first and second cut looks mighty thin to me (at least it does in the photo you posted). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thompsoncustom Posted January 1, 2014 Author Share Posted January 1, 2014 I'm building the gun so no big deal there. Thanks for the tip on the steel shooters lots of responses there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toothguy Posted January 1, 2014 Share Posted January 1, 2014 drysideshooter, that's really nice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thompsoncustom Posted January 1, 2014 Author Share Posted January 1, 2014 What I was thinking is getting a old surplus CZ 75 and throwing a comp on it, C more serendipity, Comp hammer and your normal internal upgrades, undercut the trigger guard, turn the beaver tail up what I can. I don't have a mill so I'm not sure if I want to put any cuts in the slide with a dremel/file but I'm sure I can if the slide needs lightened. Would love you hear any ideas. I'm just throwing things around right now and seeing if this is a project I want to do. Again not a competition gun just a range toy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drysideshooter Posted January 1, 2014 Share Posted January 1, 2014 Thanks Zack and Tooth. The metal left between the cutouts probably looks thinner than it is, but it is very thin. It is surprisingly strong, and I trust Scott Springer's judgment completely. I just took it out back and tried a couple of loads. With 4.2gr of WSF it would stovepipe and not drive the slide all the way back. At 4.5 grains it was almost there, very close, but the fired cases wouldn't quite clear the gun. It looks like for WSF it will be 4.7gr of WSF, which is what we have run in our production XDm 9mm's for USPSA, and also the load our other compensated XDm seems to like the best. I thought with the slide being lightened on this one might make a difference. As far as feel, it makes a real difference. The dot was barely moving at all, and not much of a push either. I have a good stockpile of the 4.7gr loads so I am going to head to the range with it and some other guns in a bit. thompsoncustom, it wouldn't cost much to send your slide to someone to have it lightened a bit. Are threaded barrels readily available for the CZ75's? If they are, that would probably be a pretty inexpensive way to try it out. With regard to the Serendipity, make sure you talk with some other CZ folks that have run that mount. WIth some guns that mount, being two sided, can cause some ejection problems. Might want to see if there is a single/non-ejection side mount for the CZ's. Another option might be a slide ride sight of some sort. I have two friends that have been running Leupold Delta Points on their 38 Super open guns and have been very happy with them. Maybe when you send the slide to get lightened you could have the gunsmith also mill the back of the slide and drill and tap for an optic? Some of the S&W's come that way not, and it's pretty cool. Gets your sight as close to the bore as possible. Folks seem happy with the Trijicon RMR sights for that application. Have fun, and HAPPY NEW YEAR! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thompsoncustom Posted January 1, 2014 Author Share Posted January 1, 2014 No threaded barrels are not readily available but 6 inch barrels are so it would just need cut down, threaded, and recrowned. I've thought about running a doctor sight as they make slide mount that go right in the stock sight dovetail. Kneelingatlas great work with the airsoft comp. I wonder how far you can take the airsoft Chinese stuff. They make a knockoff doctor sight for 40 bucks I might give that a shot and if it doesn't work just throw it in the trash as cheap is it is and get the real thing. Lonewolf comps are pretty cheap but i'm not sure I'm loving the design but if it works I guess I wouldn't really complain. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drysideshooter Posted January 1, 2014 Share Posted January 1, 2014 Here is a place that seems to have some threaded barrels for CZ's: http://czcustom.com/cz-factory-barrels-upper-top_end.aspx Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thompsoncustom Posted January 1, 2014 Author Share Posted January 1, 2014 (edited) I was thinking that was just for the sp01 but either way that price is outrageous for a threaded barrel it cost 125 more for some threads. I have the handles and some taps and dies but probably not what I'd want on the barrel. Still would be cheap to buy a 6in and buy the die and do it myself and send it to CGW for recrowning. Might just get some bar stock and build a comp to seems easy enough Tho this one looks promising. http://yhm.net/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=2_7&products_id=118 Edited January 1, 2014 by thompsoncustom Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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