jm9x23 Posted October 11, 2004 Share Posted October 11, 2004 Has anyone tried using 9mm's in their 38 supers. I tried in mine and it works great, all I had to do was open the rear of the chamber a little bit to aid extraction. With all the people crying for S&W to make a 9mm wheel gun you think S&W would make a 2 caliber gun. The TK solid moonclips hold the 9mm's better than the supers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DougCarden Posted October 11, 2004 Share Posted October 11, 2004 Silly question, how is accuracy of 9x19 versus same 38 super type load in the gun? That will answer your question, since conventional wisdom says that the jump in the cylinder to the forcing cone will hinder accuracy, but sometimes it will, and then again sometimes it wont! DougC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jm9x23 Posted October 11, 2004 Author Share Posted October 11, 2004 How is this a silly question. The gun shoots one hole groups at ten yards with the 9mm loads. Since you can fire 38 specials out of a 357 mag and 40s out of a 610 10mm and 44 specials out of a 44 mag revolver, then Why not a 9mm out of a 38 super gun especially since they head space off the moonclip. I was wondering about chamber erosion and things like that. Is there any harm to the gun or safety concerns that anyone knows about? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bountyhunter Posted October 11, 2004 Share Posted October 11, 2004 It couldn't erode the chamber. 9mm loads are typically a lot milder than .38Super. Same as shooting the shorter .38spcl in a .357. I have a .357 gun with at least 25k rounds of .38Sp fired in a .357 cylinder and the tube looks perfect (when I clean it). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DougCarden Posted October 12, 2004 Share Posted October 12, 2004 You should be good to go, you might check with some of the Revo smiths and see if there is a "best" taper to put on your forcing cone, but you should be ok. It will be interesting to see what it will do at 25yds. Good luck, and I was wondering about that combo! DougC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leroy Posted October 12, 2004 Share Posted October 12, 2004 I have been wondering about this also.. I have one of the 686 6 shot and 2 of the 627 8 shots. I havent tried the 9mm brass in a moon clip yet but i will today. sounds like a good plan if it works Let me know please. Leroy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpeedStick Posted October 12, 2004 Share Posted October 12, 2004 Gentlemen, Why is chambering a gun, especially a 38 super, to 9 mm so desireable? It can't be for the cost of brass. Or the difference in the speed of reloads. This has been an ongoing topic and discussions, for ICORE shooters, for the past 4 years. I could never see the advantage. Could someone explain to me the errors of my way? :-( Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob Boudrie Posted October 12, 2004 Share Posted October 12, 2004 It can't be for the cost of brass.. One of us is out of touch with the brass market, and I hope it's me because I would love to find a reliable supplier of once fired 38 super brass for $9.00/1000 (mixed headstamp) or $20.00/1000 (same headstamp) - proces quoted from www.brassmanbrass.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spook Posted October 12, 2004 Share Posted October 12, 2004 Gentlemen,Why is chambering a gun, especially a 38 super, to 9 mm so desireable? It can't be for the cost of brass. Or the difference in the speed of reloads. This has been an ongoing topic and discussions, for ICORE shooters, for the past 4 years. I could never see the advantage. Could someone explain to me the errors of my way? :-( To me, it would be so I can shoot my Glock 17 production loads in my revolver. Saves me an extra reloading setup. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spook Posted October 12, 2004 Share Posted October 12, 2004 QUOTE (SpeedStick @ Oct 12 2004, 06:47 PM) It can't be for the cost of brass. . One of us is out of touch with the brass market, and I hope it's me because I would love to find a reliable supplier of once fired 38 super brass for $9.00/1000 (mized headstamp) or $20.000/1000 (same headstamp) - proces quoted from www.brassmanbrass.com Rob, please PM me. I can get you some $20.000/1000 .38 super brass. For that price I'll even ship it overseas to the US for free Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob Boudrie Posted October 12, 2004 Share Posted October 12, 2004 QUOTE (SpeedStick @ Oct 12 2004, 06:47 PM) It can't be for the cost of brass. . One of us is out of touch with the brass market, and I hope it's me because I would love to find a reliable supplier of once fired 38 super brass for $9.00/1000 (mized headstamp) or $20.000/1000 (same headstamp) - proces quoted from www.brassmanbrass.com Rob, please PM me. I can get you some $20.000/1000 .38 super brass. For that price I'll even ship it overseas to the US for free 20.000 is still twenty dollars, even with a zero to the right of the decimal It's a culltural thing - here in the US we use a "." as the decimal separator, and a "," to break up large numbers (ie, $1,000,000.00) - I understand the use of these two characters is reversed in some other nations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spook Posted October 12, 2004 Share Posted October 12, 2004 argh......(slaps his forehead). Does this mean I owe you lots of .38 sooper brass now? Now I understand why all of those Hollywood houses are so cheap Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shred Posted October 12, 2004 Share Posted October 12, 2004 It can't be for the cost of brass.. One of us is out of touch with the brass market, and I hope it's me because I would love to find a reliable supplier of once fired 38 super brass for $9.00/1000 (mixed headstamp) or $20.00/1000 (same headstamp) - proces quoted from www.brassmanbrass.com Um, with a moonclip gun, it's not like you lose any brass, even at lost-brass matches. The only reason I'd be interested is for cheap "I'm outta ammo and don't want to reload" shooting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flexmoney Posted October 12, 2004 Share Posted October 12, 2004 Instead of asking why 9mm, I'd like to ask...why not? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redmist10 Posted October 12, 2004 Share Posted October 12, 2004 With all the people crying for S&W to make a 9mm wheel gun you think S&W would make a 2 caliber gun. Funny you should say that....We stopped by the Smith and Wesson "booth" at the 2004 IDPA National Championship to ask them the same question. They claim the market is so small for a 9mm revolver that they would never recoup their tooling costs. HUH? Now I could be biased since I know I would personally buy two or three of them if they made them (and so would others I shoot with - always have a backup gun) but wouldn't it make more sense for them to push 9mm over .38spl/.357mag? Think of all the guys with smaller hands that don't want to compete with a bulky 625 or a small speedloader gun (IE model 10, 15, etc.). Also, what about juniors and ladies? Cost of loaded 9mm is probably cheaper than .38spl in most places. As for converting your gun to shoot 9mm out of a .38 super - I'm not sure about some shooting sports but I bet the "powers that be" in IDPA would put a stop to it just like converting a 686 to accept moonclips (don't even get me started on that one!) That rule makes NO FREAKING SENSE. Anyway, we sat there trying to plead our case as we looked over all the 7 and 8 shot demo guns they had on display at the IDPA NATIONAL CHAMPIONSHIP....HEY DUMMIES>>>>>> we don't use 7 and 8 shot revolvers in IDPA!!!!!!.....now you're getting close to the reason they don't make 9mm revolvers. They simply don't understand the market. Shooters are not in control of gun manufacturing anymore. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jm9x23 Posted October 12, 2004 Author Share Posted October 12, 2004 Well I shot an IDPA match last night and the gun performed flawlessly. As far as I can tell in IDPA it is a kin to shooting 40's out of the 610. All your doing is running a shorter cartridge using the same gun and moonclips. I asked that question to HQ and they told me it was OK to run 9x23's out of the 686 gun. The only class in IDPA that has a quota on the number of guns made is SSP. What I was saying is that the 9mm shells fit the moonclips better than the 38 super and 9x23. I would like a K frame better but in light of no gun made this gun seems to be the answer for now. You can use lost cost ammo and get it anywhere. Also I just shot it at 25 yards and it held a 2" group, perfect for Combat shooting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Nesbitt Posted October 12, 2004 Share Posted October 12, 2004 I just tried it in my 686x6 38 super. I couldn't get every round to chamber while in moon clips even after they had passed in a chamber gauge. If they fit in the chamber they fired OK but I had sticky extraction. I'll stay with 38 super since I have a good supply of brass and it should last a long time loaded to minor. It's nice to know I have an option though. Bill Nesbitt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
revchuck Posted October 12, 2004 Share Posted October 12, 2004 FWIW, the base diameter of the 9x19 is .3926"; the base diameter of .38 Super is .3840". Maybe if you sized your 9x19 in a .38 Super die it would work? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpeedStick Posted October 13, 2004 Share Posted October 13, 2004 Rob, The cost of brass is negligible. I bought 1000 rounds of new 38 brass 10 years ago, for a special cylinder I had built, and I'm still using the same brass. Sure I've lost about 30-40, but compared to auto brass it is nothing. So, I personally, don't see the cost of brass as a factor with moonclip revolver brass. Furthermore, using once fired brass, from auto, in a mooncliped revolver does not work well. You will have to sort the brass, after resizing, to see which will fit in the cylinder. They all won't fit even after full length resizing! Sorry, I still don't see an advantage in a 9 MM! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leroy Posted October 13, 2004 Share Posted October 13, 2004 Well I have a 686 and 2 627's in the 38 super and I have a hard time finding moon clips that work good. only ones i find that work good are the smith brand. I have a bunch of tc customs and Dave from hearth sent me some samples to try for free but I sent them back because they were floppy too and the moon setter tool wont work with out grinding out a grouve for his clips.. Now Tom and Dave are great guys I am not trying to down grade thier clips or tools... Can't find a better bunch of guys to deal with...I beleive this is a gun that smith is only makin a few of and man i dont think it is going to take off but i sure wish it would.. I love the 38 super revolvers Damm I did try some 9x19 rounds in my 6 shot 686 today in the tc clips, and they did fit nice. havent shot them yet couldnt in the livin room wife hates that and it is hard on the TV... Smith and wesson has built just a few of these guns and teasing us i think but I do like them Fun too shoot for sure. I sure wish Smith and Wesson would listen to the shooters more.. My .02 worth Leroy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bubber Posted October 15, 2004 Share Posted October 15, 2004 Lost my Post, Try again. Revchuck brought an observation on the difference in the deminsions of the two cases in question. The unfired 9mm is slightly larger than the 38 super. And after the 9mm is fired depending on the tolerances of the chamber of the 9mm the case would be larger still. And if fired in an unsupported barrel it can be buldged. After resizing it may still be buldged slightly not enough to affect it in a 9mm chamber but critical in a 38 super chamber. It would probably be advantageous to use only new brass. Brownell's has a chamber cutter for a 9mm which could be used on the cylinder but then any 38 supers fired in that cylinder would not fit a tight 38 super chamber. Well just my thought of the day. Leroy let us know how it goes when you try those 9mm in your 627 PC. My spelling is not the best but hey it is late here and I missed my naptime. later rdd Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leroy Posted October 15, 2004 Share Posted October 15, 2004 Bubber, I tried the 9mm in both the 686 and 627 and like i figured and everyone else says after being shot in an auto the case buldge a litte and the bottom and dont fit well at all. Now maybe new brass may work well. I use the rp nickle brass and never shoot it in an auto in 38 super and it works well.. A thought i have had is when the nickel brass starts to crack maybe try a few and trim to the same length as a 9mm and see what happens but need to chane the load and not built up too much pressure.. Probably the safest thing to do is just shoot the 38 super. Leroy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mover480 Posted October 15, 2004 Share Posted October 15, 2004 Yeah, I couldn't get 9mm reloads to fit in my super either. May try new ammo though. BTW, Academy has 115 gr. 9mm Blazer for $3.86/box. That's less than $80/1000! I did try 38 short colt in my super once. It reloads fast and shot extremely well. However, the cases were unusable afterwards - buldged too much. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeFoley Posted October 24, 2004 Share Posted October 24, 2004 Academy has 115 gr. 9mm Blazer for $3.86/box Who is Academy? Thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
revchuck Posted October 24, 2004 Share Posted October 24, 2004 Who is Academy? Thanks. It's a sporting goods store in the South. I've only seen them in LA, TX and (I think) GA. AFAIK, they don't do mail order, either. Since they put 9x19 Blazer on sale, I don't reload 9x19. It costs that much to reload jacketed bullets, and now I don't feel guilty about leaving good brass behind. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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