List 5 things that will suck the fun out of a match

[dme45acp]

As a match director:

#1. People who bitch, complain and bash your match but who did not actually attend or shoot the match. Just heard about it and decide to go on-line and complain...

[Stlhead]

You have been a member since 2008, but not felt the need to post until now when you reserect a long dead thread and post a complaint about people who complain? Am I the only one who is enjoying the delicious irony of this? Please elaborate on the situation that has awoke you from your long slumber so that we may fully understand and learn from it.

[allenr]

I am considered a newbie to the sport and have only been in a few local IDPA matches. I really enjoy shooting in them and am not really competitive yet (finished last twice and not last by one or two once). Anyway, here are mine...

#1 - ROs who are not patient with those new to the sport. Since I am still learning, penalties are what is hurting my score the most, so I ask a lot of questions during the walk through. Some ROs are impatient in answering my questions. I never have an attitude as they are volunteers and I really appreciate them. I just don't want an attitude from them.

#2 - good shooters who are really cocky, not approachable, and argue about everything with the RO. I would really like to ask them questions, but since they are not approachable.

#3 - Prop failures or crappy stage equipment (barricades literally failing apart etc.). Yes, in my limited experience I had. Swinging prop failure.

[Joe4d]

Walk through at a match isnt a class on how to shoot, Put yourself in the RO/SO shoes, are you asking questions easily answered by the rule book ? have you read the rulebook ? Also yo will learn when to ask, good shooter are very helpful. Ask away AFTER they have shot but before going to the next stage. Before shooting shooters are gettign game face on and trying to focus. They may look to be just loading mags but they are probably memorizing stage and rehearsing in their mind. Nothing wrong with compaigning about bad barricades but goes over better if you phrase it with a solution... "Hey this barricade is wobbly, I have a screw gun and woodscrews int the truck , " IE offer a solution, if you get shot down you tried.

[Piney]

Brass Chickens-- the guy(s) that just have to get all the brass right now. Targets taped, stages reset. Shooter and SO waiting-- and they're still downrange pecking up the brass.

[allenr]

Have read the rule book....seems some apply the differently. I think It helps the sport for all to hear the answers, that way their are fewer assumptions. Maybe it is just the engineer in me.

[Jim Norman]

Having just read through the thread I picked up what seem to be repeating thoughts and decided to list them or interpret them in my own words and post them in no particular order. Some of these are more critical than others, but they all have an effect on how a match feels. I added a few of my own as well.

Poor Match Planning. Failure of the MD to do the math that says you can’t have 15 people on a squad shooting a stage that takes 5 minutes to shoot and set plus the walk-through plus the travel time between stages and only allow 60 minutes per squad. Nice to allow everyone that wants to shoot a slot, but if you can’t finish the match in the time allowed it will more than annoy a lot of people.

Stage Guns not at the beginning of a stage. Stage Guns w/o back-ups

Ridiculous hit requirements just to build round count, i.e. 4 hits per target . Ammo is not cheap. You want to up the round count, give us a reason, put out more targets. If most people need two hits to score, they’ll fire extra, make it 4 rounds and you can both slow the match as people will take either more time to make the shoots or fire a lot of extra shots. Extra shots mean more target changes and that means more time and cost to the match. No gain in the end.

Targets that require searching, this is not a sniper match. Put up contrasting backers.

Either paint the steel for every shooter or paint it lead gray and leave it alone, everyone gets the same presentation.

Not needing a sling. This is a Multi-Gun Match, why am I only tasked with carrying one gun at a time? Have us keep the long gun slung when switching to pistol. Long gun of course must be emptied and under control.

Slugs past 75 yards.

Coaching, particularly by the Staff and especially when it only is there for certain shooters.

Uneven calls where friends of staff get a pass on things that should have ended their match.

Shooters that have an attitude. Discuss it fine, get loud or worse, threaten an RO then you really need to get a new hobby.

RM’s that are biased, inconsistent and don’t support their staff.

Inconsistent scoring and/or calls on flash steel

Really long runs for no real reason. This is not a track meet.

Shooting positions that are impossible for your shooters. If you have mandatory prone, put it last if at all possible. Make sure ports are accessible for people from 5-0 to 7-0. Make sure your props will support your shooters from 100 to 300 pounds.

More than about 18-20 shotgun shots on a stage.

Slugs other than the first or last shots on a stage.

Bunkering a gun other than EMPTY or in a position where it doesn’t matter. No one should go home for a safety getting knocked off or failing to be set. Make the abandonment itself safe or don’t do it.

Lazy shooters that don’t won’t set and tape. Also, conversely RO’s that berate a squad that has a system where they are all working but not all at once, no point in 14 people going down range to set/tape 10 targets.

Poor construction, the stage needs to run for at least double the number of people in the match. If it fails once it will fail again. Build it bullet proof, GOOD ENOUGH, ISN’T!

Staged that can’t be completed by the majority of the competitors in the time allowed.

Scoring where one stage can determine the match outcome. Time plus needs to be converted to 100 points per stage or it is likely that there will be one long stage that one or two people will blow away and that will allow them to win, even when the rest of the match went poorly for them. Usually this is a long range rifle stage where one person manages to shoot it in half the time of everyone else.

Not enough port-a-johns and not located near to enough stages.

Water and Shade.

Edited January 1, 2013 by Jim Norman

[1chota]

Having just read through the thread I picked up what seem to be repeating thoughts and decided to list them or interpret them in my own words and post them in no particular order. Some of these are more critical than others, but they all have an effect on how a match feels. I added a few of my own as well.

Poor Match Planning. Failure of the MD to do the math that says you can’t have 15 people on a squad shooting a stage that takes 5 minutes to shoot and set plus the walk-through plus the travel time between stages and only allow 60 minutes per squad. Nice to allow everyone that wants to shoot a slot, but if you can’t finish the match in the time allowed it will more than annoy a lot of people.

Stage Guns not at the beginning of a stage. Stage Guns w/o back-ups

Ridiculous hit requirements just to build round count, i.e. 4 hits per target . Ammo is not cheap. You want to up the round count, give us a reason, put out more targets. If most people need two hits to score, they’ll fire extra, make it 4 rounds and you can both slow the match as people will take either more time to make the shoots or fire a lot of extra shots. Extra shots mean more target changes and that means more time and cost to the match. No gain in the end.

Targets that require searching, this is not a sniper match. Put up contrasting backers.

Either paint the steel for every shooter or paint it lead gray and leave it alone, everyone gets the same presentation.

Not needing a sling. This is a Multi-Gun Match, why am I only tasked with carrying one gun at a time? Have us keep the long gun slung when switching to pistol. Long gun of course must be emptied and under control.

Slugs past 75 yards.

Coaching, particularly by the Staff and especially when it only is there for certain shooters.

Uneven calls where friends of staff get a pass on things that should have ended their match.

Shooters that have an attitude. Discuss it fine, get loud or worse, threaten an RO then you really need to get a new hobby.

RM’s that are biased, inconsistent and don’t support their staff.

Inconsistent scoring and/or calls on flash steel

Really long runs for no real reason. This is not a track meet.

Shooting positions that are impossible for your shooters. If you have mandatory prone, put it last if at all possible. Make sure ports are accessible for people from 5-0 to 7-0. Make sure your props will support your shooters from 100 to 300 pounds.

More than about 18-20 shotgun shots on a stage.

Slugs other than the first or last shots on a stage.

Bunkering a gun other than EMPTY or in a position where it doesn’t matter. No one should go home for a safety getting knocked off or failing to be set. Make the abandonment itself safe or don’t do it.

Lazy shooters that don’t won’t set and tape. Also, conversely RO’s that berate a squad that has a system where they are all working but not all at once, no point in 14 people going down range to set/tape 10 targets.

Poor construction, the stage needs to run for at least double the number of people in the match. If it fails once it will fail again. Build it bullet proof, GOOD ENOUGH, ISN’T!

Staged that can’t be completed by the majority of the competitors in the time allowed.

Scoring where one stage can determine the match outcome. Time plus needs to be converted to 100 points per stage or it is likely that there will be one long stage that one or two people will blow away and that will allow them to win, even when the rest of the match went poorly for them. Usually this is a long range rifle stage where one person manages to shoot it in half the time of everyone else.

Not enough port-a-johns and not located near to enough stages.

Water and Shade.

Hallelujah! and Amen! Great presentation, brother Jim. I can't add a thing. also; Happy New Year! it won't be long til shots fired.

[Dan Sierpina]

Damn,

I not only agree with Jim, but, Wynn too!

[USCSBarney]

Amen, but I have one more thing to add to the list: Dianne Feinstein

[Jesse Tischauser]

Not having enough ammo at the gun store to shoot more than two stages.

[Langenator]

Not having enough ammo at the gun store to shoot more than two stages.

Amen to that...I've got 500 rounds of 68 gr .223, 300 rounds of 55 gr, about 350 rounds of 9mm on hand...I can't even find bullets to reload with available, everything's out of stock.

I think that's enough ammo for 3 of my local matches, maybe 4 or 5 if I break out the .45 instead of the 9mm. Except the 55 gr I've got sucks for targets past 100-150, and the close ones at the local match usually start at 200...

Might have to break out the Garand again...

[Got Juice?]

1 DQ's

2 Running out of ammo.....

3 Stages that you have shot, and later get tossed because a 'god squad' member muffed it an complained enough so it got tossed.

4 Delta, Mike, No Shoot.... all in the same target!!!!

5 Admiring your shots as you called snakeyes... and forgetting that the timer IS RUNNING!

[Boxer1]

I have to go with shooters not helping reset the stage. I want to shoot as fast as possible not wait arround all day for shooters to load mags and BS. Also I am still laughing at the Brass Chicken comment I must have missed that one in the past too funny.

[Vespid_Wasp]

When I was new to the sport I dreaded/disliked the BIG shotgun stage that required 35+ rounds.

Honestly I now look forward to them and they are probably one of my favorite type of stages to shoot.

[Jesse Tischauser]

When I was new to the sport I dreaded/disliked the BIG shotgun stage that required 35+ rounds.

Honestly I now look forward to them and they are probably one of my favorite type of stages to shoot.

I would agree. Not having at least one 35+ round shotgun stage sucks the fun outta the match.

[SteveU]

When I was new to the sport I dreaded/disliked the BIG shotgun stage that required 35+ rounds.

Honestly I now look forward to them and they are probably one of my favorite type of stages to shoot.

I would agree. Not having at least one 35+ round shotgun stage sucks the fun outta the match.

I agree so much that I routinely shoot 35+ shotgun rounds regardless of the stage round count!

[phm14]

Getting DQed for steel core ammo that's not steel core.

[JMIS]

Getting DQed for steel core ammo that's not steel core.

Keep a magnet in your range bag from now on.

[phm14]

Getting DQed for steel core ammo that's not steel core.

Keep a magnet in your range bag from now on.

Bi-metal jackets were legal for this match. The RO even cut the round and still couldn't figure out that it was not steel core (it was Wolf). Got jerked out of my squad and spent 20 minutes convincing the MD before I could get on with the match. Are you picking up stray rounds off the ground and using them at matches? How else would you not know what your running to need a magnet in your bag?

[JMIS]

No! I do not pick up ammo at matches. I offered advice. I was told by a fellow shooter that makes many major matches and he told me some matches check ammo with magnets.

[phm14]

No! I do not pick up ammo at matches. I offered advice. I was told by a fellow shooter that makes many major matches and he told me some matches check ammo with magnets.

That's true. They did check it with a magnet, right before they cut the slug. Problem is, the magnet can't distinguish between a steel jacket and a steel core. They should have known there was no steel core when they cut the bullet in two, but for some reason I've never figured out, they didn't.

[Bryan 45]

Let them try to cut a SS109 round. The difference will be quite noticeable.

[phm14]

Let them try to cut a SS109 round. The difference will be quite noticeable.

Exactly. I understand the need to protect people & expensive steel targets, and I appreciate the hard work put in at matches. In this case, a mistake turned into a half hour ordeal, and it would have resulted in (more) significant consequences for me had I not fought it.

[EaZeNuTZ33]

1: Shooters who don't help reset, tape.....yet complain

2: Overly complicated stages...run up, run back, run up, run back

3: Every shot fired from a single shooting position

4: Slugs fired on small targets and/or from unstable platforms

5: Blatantly obvious target positions that require or encourage unsafe shots. (shooting a headshot on a paper silhouette 7' away with a noshoot covering all but the head, at an upward 15 degree angle with a 168gr SMK)

I dont mind a few single and two gun stages....it will play to some strengths and expose some weaknesses for everyone if there is an all pistol, all shotgun, and all rifle stage present. Tho 3/10 being single gun sucks too!

I dont mind slugs out to 75 yards or so on large poppers, but not clay targets or small steel at 50 yards, never from swinging tables or bridges.

I dont mind a little athletic ability being required and I'm fat! Gets the heart rate up and breathing rate increased to make the next part more challenging.