dmshozer1 Posted May 12, 2011 Share Posted May 12, 2011 What is the sense in laying out three grand for a 1x6 scope, and mount? Go on forever about ballistic programs, and then state that a 400 or 500 hundred yard target in a match is not worth the time it takes to hit it. Would it not be better to buy a reasonable priced scope and spend the $2OOO you saved on ammo to practice with? I mean really, most of the stages require a low power, wide field of view scope so why waste the money? Just saying Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alaskapopo Posted May 12, 2011 Share Posted May 12, 2011 (edited) What is the sense in laying out three grand for a 1x6 scope, and mount? Go on forever about ballistic programs, and then state that a 400 or 500 hundred yard target in a match is not worth the time it takes to hit it. Would it not be better to buy a reasonable priced scope and spend the $2OOO you saved on ammo to practice with? I mean really, most of the stages require a low power, wide field of view scope so why waste the money? Just saying Everyones situation is different. First off the scope and mount I have (Swarovski Z6i with Larue mount) did not cost me 3 grand. Swarovski offers a good LEO military discount so I paid a lot less than that. Second. In some matches the longer targets have significant penalties if you don't hit them so they are worth it. 3rd I find myself running more short on time vs money when it comes to the game. I am not rich but I can usually afford the toys I want. The problem is up here in Alaska we have a short outdoor shooting season so we only have a narrow window for three gun matches. (May -Sept) I work a 4 10 schedule and on my three days off I usually spend one day traveling to and shooting a match, 1 day practicing at the range and 1 day getting the house clean, and getting ready for the next work week. I work swings so I can' really shoot before or after work. So for me even if I could afford all the ammo I wanted I would not have the time to shoot it all up. I also do use my Spikes 22 long rifle AR for a lot of my rifle practice. I find that I don't practice with my shotgun much at all. I mostly practice with my pistols and my Ar's. In the winter I shoot 2 pistol matches a month. I have to drive 3 hours to get to them and they are at an indoor range. 1 IDPA match and 1 USPSA match. I practice outdoors as much as the weather allows. Which during some months means never. Edited May 12, 2011 by Alaskapopo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jesse Tischauser Posted May 12, 2011 Share Posted May 12, 2011 (edited) Because I can! Edited May 12, 2011 by jtischauser Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tyro Shooter Posted May 12, 2011 Share Posted May 12, 2011 One advantage of "Good" glass is that it is brighter and clearer than lower priced options that are out there. This could be important to you if your squad in a Major 3 gun match is still shooting after the sun goes down. I.E. 2010 MGM Iron Man: Day two, Stage One 9pm "Good Glass" = "at least the sun is no longer in my eyes"!!! "Not so Good Glass = "Where the F*@k did Travis hide the D*mn targets????" 2010 Ft Benning During the RO shoot. . . 8pm in the dark / last stage . . . (Me) "Could we get the lights on??? (RO in Army Green) "Suck it up Cupcake!!!! (P.S. Fiber optic front sights don't work woth a damn in the dark either) Another differance is "Quality of Construction" I.E. 'Will it hold Zero after that 2000 rounds of newly aquired practice ammo? After a full 9-10 months of Club matches and 7 major matches, will it still hold zero? or will your retical be bouncing all over the map with each recoil cycle. Retical options: Illumination Options: To each his own, but Just because it cost more that your first and second cars combined, does not meat it is a good scope eather. You just have to decide what level of dedication to this sport your willing to put up with. (Read: how much can you afford to spend?) Ohh and I know of no one that would not take 2k of practice ammo if given the chance! (Even the Fancy Shirt squad!) Just my opinion. . . I could be wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dmshozer1 Posted May 12, 2011 Author Share Posted May 12, 2011 Because I can! Why post something negative instead of just not posting at all? Just saying. Because I can! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DyNo! Posted May 12, 2011 Share Posted May 12, 2011 Better yet, don't buy a scope at all and use all of the money to shoot in Limited! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jesse Tischauser Posted May 12, 2011 Share Posted May 12, 2011 (edited) Better yet, don't buy a scope at all and use all of the money to shoot in Limited! Isn't that prismatic considered a scope? Edited May 12, 2011 by jtischauser Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GentlemanJim Posted May 12, 2011 Share Posted May 12, 2011 If you knew how many low cost scopes crapped out when they were needed the most...you would have your answer. Good glass is just as important as your rifle is Jim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DyNo! Posted May 12, 2011 Share Posted May 12, 2011 Better yet, don't buy a scope at all and use all of the money to shoot in Limited! Isn't that prismatic considered a scope? Just saying! LMAO. Well, last year I was an Iron Man but I got lucky enough not to waste any money on a scope and just trade some equipment. OP, you can get a good scope for $300 and the folks that pay more probably feel as if it is worth their while. (And in many cases it is) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carbon9 Posted May 12, 2011 Share Posted May 12, 2011 What is the sense in laying out three grand for a 1x6 scope, and mount? Go on forever about ballistic programs, and then state that a 400 or 500 hundred yard target in a match is not worth the time it takes to hit it. Would it not be better to buy a reasonable priced scope and spend the $2OOO you saved on ammo to practice with? I mean really, most of the stages require a low power, wide field of view scope so why waste the money? Just saying Because they can Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlamoShooter Posted May 12, 2011 Share Posted May 12, 2011 I love this thread. I over heard several shooters discussing "just throw a few shots" at a 500+ yard target in the last match. I had to ask just how painfully would the drive home be if they did that. No mater how good or cheep the glass if the shooter does not make real at-temp the target, it will not get hit. Now the drift What I consider good has evolved a bit. I don't eat cheep Ice-cream I don't have time for cheep speakers I wont drink dirty water and I rather shoot Iron sights over a cheep glass scope. money spent on a good quality scope is the most cost effective shooting expenditure a smart shooter can make. a Quality scope will out last several barrels. Quality glass will make perfect practice possible. Quality glass will help the shooter , not hold them back with mystery misses, and fuzzy haze Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dmshozer1 Posted May 12, 2011 Author Share Posted May 12, 2011 What is the sense in laying out three grand for a 1x6 scope, and mount? Go on forever about ballistic programs, and then state that a 400 or 500 hundred yard target in a match is not worth the time it takes to hit it. Would it not be better to buy a reasonable priced scope and spend the $2OOO you saved on ammo to practice with? I mean really, most of the stages require a low power, wide field of view scope so why waste the money? Just saying Everyones situation is different. First off the scope and mount I have (Swarovski Z6i with Larue mount) did not cost me 3 grand. Swarovski offers a good LEO military discount so I paid a lot less than that. Second. In some matches the longer targets have significant penalties if you don't hit them so they are worth it. 3rd I find myself running more short on time vs money when it comes to the game. I am not rich but I can usually afford the toys I want. The problem is up here in Alaska we have a short outdoor shooting season so we only have a narrow window for three gun matches. (May -Sept) I work a 4 10 schedule and on my three days off I usually spend one day traveling to and shooting a match, 1 day practicing at the range and 1 day getting the house clean, and getting ready for the next work week. I work swings so I can' really shoot before or after work. So for me even if I could afford all the ammo I wanted I would not have the time to shoot it all up. I also do use my Spikes 22 long rifle AR for a lot of my rifle practice. I find that I don't practice with my shotgun much at all. I mostly practice with my pistols and my Ar's. In the winter I shoot 2 pistol matches a month. I have to drive 3 hours to get to them and they are at an indoor range. 1 IDPA match and 1 USPSA match. I practice outdoors as much as the weather allows. Which during some months means never. I understand your problem. My problem is with people that spend a ton of money on equipment that is capable of making the long shots then post that they are not worth the time it takes to make them. Sounds to me like the shooter is the problem. I like your videos! Take care Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dmshozer1 Posted May 12, 2011 Author Share Posted May 12, 2011 If you knew how many low cost scopes crapped out when they were needed the most...you would have your answer. Good glass is just as important as your rifle is Jim I agree with you Jim. But I think you will agree that there are very good scopes available to do the job in the $500 to $1000 range. Take care Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
latewatch Posted May 12, 2011 Share Posted May 12, 2011 Now the drift What I consider good has evolved a bit. I don't eat cheep Ice-cream I don't have time for cheep speakers I wont drink dirty water and I rather shoot Iron sights over a cheep glass scope. It just doesn't get clearer then that. Jamie I didn't realize you were such a philosopher. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dmshozer1 Posted May 12, 2011 Author Share Posted May 12, 2011 I love this thread. I over heard several shooters discussing "just throw a few shots" at a 500+ yard target in the last match. I had to ask just how painfully would the drive home be if they did that. No mater how good or cheep the glass if the shooter does not make real at-temp the target, it will not get hit. Now the drift What I consider good has evolved a bit. I don't eat cheep Ice-cream I don't have time for cheep speakers I wont drink dirty water and I rather shoot Iron sights over a cheep glass scope. money spent on a good quality scope is the most cost effective shooting expenditure a smart shooter can make. a Quality scope will out last several barrels. Quality glass will make perfect practice possible. Quality glass will help the shooter , not hold them back with mystery misses, and fuzzy haze The first part of your post is what I am talking about! Shooters with capable gear but don't even try. I agree that you need a quality scope but I think you can buy them for a lot less than $2000 or so. I have the "cheap" Vortex 1x4. Scott at Vortex assured me that with a good mount it would hold zero and it is not hazy. Take care Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dmshozer1 Posted May 12, 2011 Author Share Posted May 12, 2011 I love this thread. I over heard several shooters discussing "just throw a few shots" at a 500+ yard target in the last match. I had to ask just how painfully would the drive home be if they did that. No mater how good or cheep the glass if the shooter does not make real at-temp the target, it will not get hit. Now the drift What I consider good has evolved a bit. I don't eat cheep Ice-cream I don't have time for cheep speakers I wont drink dirty water and I rather shoot Iron sights over a cheep glass scope. money spent on a good quality scope is the most cost effective shooting expenditure a smart shooter can make. a Quality scope will out last several barrels. Quality glass will make perfect practice possible. Quality glass will help the shooter , not hold them back with mystery misses, and fuzzy haze The first part of your post is what I am talking about! Shooters with capable gear but don't even try. I agree that you need a quality scope but I think you can buy them for a lot less than $2000 or so. I have the "cheap" Vortex 1x4. Scott at Vortex assured me that with a good mount it would hold zero and it is not hazy. Take care P.S. Paid $500 for it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RUSHARP2 Posted May 12, 2011 Share Posted May 12, 2011 First answer... if you got the money why not buy good glass. It takes all kinds to participate in our sports. I look back and wish I had bought a step or three up in my glass. Fish eye and loss of the reticle have cost me a ton in matches, not that it was the difference in finishing where I did and the top 100, but it screws with my competitive nature. Second Answer... is that those shooters may have been gaming a particular stage and a particular match with a certain set of rules. I recently read a thread where there was a 500 yd target and the penalty was only a miss(+10 IIRC). The point of the thread was is it better to take the the time and try to hit the target or move on after one shot. From a scoring perspective for that target in that match, it was better to put a shot on it and move on. If the topic of the thread was a 500 yd shot with a 30 second penalty, I bet they would have a different response. my .02 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doug H. Posted May 12, 2011 Share Posted May 12, 2011 I had the orginal Swaro Z6i with circle dot and now I have the BRT. I smile every time I shoot my rifle. Why did I get that scope, because my wife said I could! Doug Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jesse Tischauser Posted May 12, 2011 Share Posted May 12, 2011 (edited) oops Edited May 12, 2011 by jtischauser Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boomfab Posted May 12, 2011 Share Posted May 12, 2011 (edited) nevermind Edited May 12, 2011 by boomfab Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cas Posted May 13, 2011 Share Posted May 13, 2011 Everyones situation is different. Yep, for some people $2k is a days pay, for others a month and a half. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigbrowndog Posted May 13, 2011 Share Posted May 13, 2011 hoser, everyone that posted gets beat with cheaper glass than they have on their guns. trapr Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlamoShooter Posted May 13, 2011 Share Posted May 13, 2011 hoser, everyone that posted gets beat with cheaper glass than they have on their guns. trapr That is very true. A good shooter with Irons will beat me most of the time. And when I place well in a match its only because I have more experience at getting beat than most of the shooters at the match. I had many years of shooting with scopes that failed during a match Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
actionshooter Posted May 13, 2011 Share Posted May 13, 2011 I had the orginal Swaro Z6i with circle dot and now I have the BRT. I smile every time I shoot my rifle. Why did I get that scope, because my wife said I could! Doug Doug, Do you think you could get your wife to talk to my wife??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dchang0 Posted May 13, 2011 Share Posted May 13, 2011 To the OP: You're assuming that the 6X power will only come in handy at the extreme distances. Having a 6X definitely speeds up the shorter range shots such as 200yds to 400yds, where a 10" plate is as big as the sky and you can see the pockmarks in the steel like craters on the surface of the moon. Plus it sure helps for smaller-than-usual targets such as a plate rack with 8" plates at 200yds. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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