Uspsa Vs. Idpa

[Truegent2004]

About a year ago in FRONT SIGHT magazine, Mike Voight commented that the USPSA/IDPA war was over and that both sports learned that they complimented each other.

I think not.

At a recent indoor shoot at a range that also hosts IDPA events. I noticed some professionally made pamphets for IDPA left out. The caption read, "IDPA: THE REAL PRACTICAL SHOOTING SPORT".........................Obviously the word REAL was a dig at USPSA, as was several offhand comments in the pamplet making reference to that other "competition shooting sport............and their "racy" equipment"

I dont know about other parts of the country but in MN, USPSA crushes IDPA in terms of popularity and the number of matches. They are weak sister and probably always will be.............period.

[Chuck D]

Not for nothing but the "fires" won't burn out of control if EVERYBODY would stop throwing gasoline on the fire.

IDPA has the RIGHT to market their product any way they see fit...

If you like it great....if not...

[rmills]

I dont know about other parts of the country but in MN, USPSA crushes IDPA in terms of popularity and the number of matches. They are weak sister and probably always will be.............period.

In the southwest Ohio area, attendance at USPSA matches is down approx. 40%, while the IDPA matches continue to grow. At our local IDPA match, we have added another session to be able to accomodate the extra shooters.

[Ron Ankeny]

In my mind, there is no controversy because I shoot both and I like both. They are both games, one uses a little green book and the other a little red book.

When we chartered our USPSA club a couple of years ago, we also started shooting IDPA. In the beginning we had a much better turn out at our USPSA matches because the guys like the longer field courses, higher round count, and freedom to solve problems they way they choose. I like that too.

I enjoy IDPA because I shoot it with my carry gear and the courses of fire are shorter in duration and of course there is an empahsis on accuracy. I like IDPA and it discourages me that more of our members don't want to shoot. I think it's because they have limited budgets in the form of time and money so they shoot USPSA stuff instead.

Anyhow, I wasn't around when the IDPA crowd split away from IPSC so I really can't relate to the bad blood. When I first got into the practical shooting gig, I did notice IDPA made it clear that they were not IPSC and implied they were more "practical". I assumed it was nothing more than a marketing strategy to recruit shooters into IDPA who were like thinkers. I didn't view it as IPSC bashing at all.

[Sam]

I totally agree with Ron. There may be a few individuals that criticize either sport, but IDPA isn't making a "dig" at USPSA with the brochure. I am very active in both sports. And many folks I shoot with are active in both sports. I look at it this way. IDPA stresses practicality in problem solving, USPSA stresses creativity in problem solving. Either way, no problem. I have to shoot fast and accurately in both sports. So, I like both sports.

[Hey QuicksDraw!]

I don't know what all the fuss is over. USPSA or IDPA, we are all shooters. Forget which is better and enjoy shooting your friggin guns whatever they may be. Shooters have enough trouble without fighting among ourselves.

With me it's all about trigger time. IDPA, USPSA, sporting clays, plinking at a can, I don’t care. I love to shoot!

Support Brian, your local gunsmith and your local range.

[jimstc]

Sam,

I have never seen it put more correctly: Practicality vs Creativity. I shoot both disciplines and enjoy them both. I wish people would quit the one versus the other BS. It is all about shooting fast and accurately. Have fun and shoot as much as possible.

[TriggerT]

I have shot both, but like USPSA a little more.

I think a HUGE factor is whether or not a state has concealed carry. IL doesn't (and probably never will) so IDPA isn't as popular here as it is in some other states. I think if CCW passes in either IL, or WI, you could see a very large jump in IDPA matches.

[Rufus The Bum]

At my particular club, IDPA and USPSA have equal billing. Most IDPA people in our area don't shoot USPSA, but most USPSA people shoot IDPA. Why? I don't know.

I like to shoot both and enjoy both tremendously, so I could care less about which one is the "Real" practical shooting sport.

[Tom Mainus]

Iagree, trigger time is trigger time. I like USPSA alot more than IDPA but so what. Just go out and shoot and have a good time.

Rufus,

I see the same thing. Our new IDPA club can get 65 shooters in one night shooting indoors. They are all faces that I never see at a USPSA match. But USPSA guys will shoot IDPA, I don't get it.

[dajarrel]

As QuicksDraw said,

"With me it's all about trigger time. IDPA, USPSA, sporting clays, plinking at a can, I don’t care. I love to shoot! "

I shoot them both and for the same reason. Trigger time. Putting bullets on the target.

If I play chess today I use chess rules, If I play checkers tomorrow, I use checkers rules. Either way, I gets to move pieces on the board.

dj

[DJPoLo]

Most IDPA people in our area don't shoot USPSA, but most USPSA people shoot IDPA.  Why?  I don't know.

I was out at the range doing some repairs today and stumbled upon an IDPA match in progress. I stayed around to watch for a while and only ran into two people I knew. They are both shooters who compete in our IPSC 3-gun matches.

After seeing this match and the footage on the TV show, "Shooting Gallery", I'd like to try IDPA. It's a totally different animal than IPSC, but so is Steel Challenge a different animal, too, and I love that game.

It's all running around and shooting fast. And I like that.

-Chet

[JT Johnson]

I shoot them both and for the same reason. Trigger time. Putting bullets on the target.

If I play chess today I use chess rules, If I play checkers tomorrow, I use checkers rules. Either way, I gets to move pieces on the board.

dj

While shooting both USPSA and IDPA may be beneficial due to the extra trigger time one gets, the example of chess and checkers doesn't support that premise. To my knowledge there is not a single high-ranking chess player (master and above) that recommends playing checkers to gain over the board experience to help with chess.

I used to play many 5 min games at the club level at U of I with players of various skill levels. I never heard of any of the weaker or stronger player recommending checkers to improve their chess game. The only improvements to make at chess involved studying and practicing various stages of the chess game to improve.

Well, I take back what I said about checkers. There was a patzer that after going on a five game losing streak that was topped off by losing to the ten year old wonder (same ten year old that cost me 1st place in the lower rated 5 min club championship) asked if anyone wanted to play checkers? Nobody responded and thankfully that guy never showed up again. His personal hygiene was as poor as his attitude.

I would imagine that if you want to improve at IDPA you'd be better off practicing IDPA instead of shooting that USPSA match. Same thing goes for USPSA. I'm not saying don't shoot both, but probably the best way to improve is to stick with your game of choice. Do whatever floats your boat though

Josh

[Ron Ankeny]

Golly, I thought the chess and checkers analogy was a good one. I concentrate my efforts in IPSC, but I shoot IDPA because I like the people and it gives me a chance to shoot my carry gun. I don't think shooting the occasional IDPA match will retard my development in IPSC, but I'll be careful.

[Flexmoney]

Checkers will get you killed!

[JT Johnson]

Chess uses impractical and racy pieces!

[short_round]

several offhand comments in the pamplet making reference to that other "competition shooting sport............and their "racy" equipment"

I'm currently in the market for cargo pants and shorts for IDPA because I don't own a stitch of either. I am also looking for a concealment garment. Whether this is an "official" IDPA vest or another shirt that I can stiffen the front panels on, I'm not sure yet.

Not that I will ever wear these new pieces of clothing in the "real" world.

What I don't understand is why I can't retain my magazines into my front flannel shirt pockets that I used last time. A shirt that I have used in the "real" world. I don't really have to know why if those are the rules and everyone plays by them.

If I play chess today I use chess rules, If I play checkers tomorrow, I use checkers rules

Exactly.

BTW, I'm not trying to fuel the controversy but checkers has much more racy pieces. Whoever heard of "tactical red?"

[Merlin Orr]

Maybe this is what you want ? vest I will be shooting in my first IDPA tourney on this next Sat. Got to see if all the hubbub is real or imaginary..

[Ron Ankeny]

LMAO...leave to Flex and JT.

[Matthew_Mink]

Checkers will get you killed!

But Tactically Castleing will work. (That's where you swap both pieces with one hand for all you non-TACTICAL dorks.)

[Duane Thomas]

Most IDPA people in our area don't shoot USPSA, but most USPSA people shoot IDPA. Why? I don't know.

I believe it's because most IDPA shooters are intimidated by USPSA. By contrast, experienced USPSA shooters are not intimidated by IDPA.

[Duane Thomas]

I don't see anywhere dajarrel was using his chess/checkers analogy to say that playing chess (USPSA) will help you in playing checkers (IDPA). He was only saying that the rules are different, and when playing the appropriate game he has no problem using the appropriate rules. Me either.

[Duane Thomas]

What I don't understand is why I can't retain my magazines into my front flannel shirt pockets that I used last time. A shirt that I have used in the "real" world.

And why couldn't you? There's nothing in the rules that says that.

[short_round]

MerlinD,

Thanks for the link! It is afterall designed for "stylish concealment for the competitive shooter, on and off the range." Although competitive doesn't sound very tactical. Killer color selection though. Too bad they don't have tactical red.

Duane,

from online IDPA rulebook

Under Competition Rules:

17. TACTICAL LOAD: ... To be in the “spirit” of the stage, the shooter must retain the magazine in one of the following ways PRIOR to the firing of the first shot after a tactical load: pants pocket, vest pocket, jacket pocket, waistband or magazine pouch. Using specially designed pockets, shirt pockets or holding the magazine in the hand or teeth is NOT permitted.

Fascinating how my soon to be purchased "Designed by IDPA Shooters for IDPA Shooters" vest pocket is going to be more in the "spirit" than the front pocket of my off-the-rack Timberland flannel.

[MBaneACP]

IMO, checkers pieces would be easier to hit, but chess pieces would be more challenging. Especially the pawns.

And speaking of pawns...having just come back from SHOT 2004 where, as as the president of a major handgun company once noted, you need a scorecard to know who really, really hates me at any given moment, I'm more convinced than ever that it's gettin' on time for the pistol shooting organizations to get a grip and figure out what they really need to do to grow the sport.

I mean, the cowboys just issued badge number 58,000 [and many many many of the ones who no longer shoot still pay their memberships]; the Steel Challenge is having a gigantic year and opening up venues around the country; precision rifle, sporting clays, fill in the blank are booming...and we just limp along, pausing only long enough to shoot ourselves and our friends and anyone who does anything that might be construed as positive in the...feet.

It would be funny if it wasn't so...exhausting.

Michael B