What was TopShot missing?

[Steven Cline]

I enjoyed (overall) TopShot.

I admit a bias to thinking we do it better at USPSA. When I watched TopShot I noted a lack of balance in that it seemed over focused on accuracy, maybe even hyper-accuracy. I am fairly uncertain there was any test of power, though everyone apparently shot the same factory ammo.

The speed seemed to come less from shooting and more from having speedy feet (running the hill, sprint to the rifle, sprint to the gun/one shot, sprint back).

This was the impression I got at least. I agree there were some balanced tests (shooting gallery, the tree, head-to-head eliminations brought in some speed element)

I would have prefered a more balance as "we" define it.

What say you?

[Sarge]

More power!! I still would like to see some long range 50 BMG rifle shots.

[Jaxshooter]

My impression was that the show was to have shooters from different disciplines compete with different weapons to determine who came out on top shooting. If it was or is going to be just a speed shoot why not just run USPSA stages and shoot SC. I would like to see more shooting and less conversation in the lodge at night.

I would also like to see the knfe throwing etc done away with and stick to shooting since it is named Top Shot not Top Knife Thrower

[Aint No Rest 4 The Wicked]

I think what was missing was Top Shooters! Some of the guys and the girl would have had their butt handed to them in a local match. Like the NYPD Swat guy. I think it would have been a much better show if they really had more world class shooters like JJ. People like Max Micheal, Jerry Miculek, Todd Jarrett, Doug Koeing, Mike Voigt. Byron Furgen with the long Bow. Tom Napp with the shotgun. And of course Bob Munden! That would be the real Top Shots

[BayouSlide]

Blake Miguez seldom gets his butt handed to him at an Area championship, let alone a local one. Don't diss our hometown guy

Curtis

[Aint No Rest 4 The Wicked]

Blake is very good! Expect that last shot....Anyway he should have been on the show, but a bunch of the others...Not so much.

[wide45]

Nothing all that wrong with what they did.

It's called Top Shot.

Several competitors failed to put together an accurate shot when one was called for. They lost, and deservedly so.

[BlackSabbath]

So much of it was done by audition...who looked good on tape.

The only ones I thought should've been on there were Blake, Mike, JJ, and maybe Kelly.

Most of them were horrible shooters.

[Steven Cline]

OK, fellas, but what shooting skills would you have preferred to see?

It can't just be our run-n-guns.

I got no issue with making the participants shoot stock M9/92f or 1911 or... dare I say it... Glocks (cuz of the different grip angle)

Bianchi plates?

A Steel Challenge Stage?

A full on USPSA stage?

The Polish Plate Rack?

The slide-chair again?

The steel tree?

What?

[carlosa]

I think what was missing was Top Shooters! Some of the guys and the girl would have had their butt handed to them in a local match. Like the NYPD Swat guy. I think it would have been a much better show if they really had more world class shooters like JJ. People like Max Micheal, Jerry Miculek, Todd Jarrett, Doug Koeing, Mike Voigt. Byron Furgen with the long Bow. Tom Napp with the shotgun. And of course Bob Munden! That would be the real Top Shots

Allot of those guys went to the auditions but just did not get cast...

Anyway I enjoyed the show.

But the challenges never really seemed that hard.

Then I again I guess that's what made it so hard to watch when JJ Blake And Mike went out.

Kelly most defenetly belonged in the show.

I thought it was kind of lame that he went out the way he did.

Very anti climatic.

[Wideload]

OK, fellas, but what shooting skills would you have preferred to see?

It can't just be our run-n-guns.

I got no issue with making the participants shoot stock M9/92f or 1911 or... dare I say it... Glocks (cuz of the different grip angle)

Bianchi plates?

A Steel Challenge Stage?

A full on USPSA stage?

The Polish Plate Rack?

The slide-chair again?

The steel tree?

What?

I'd like to see a larger number of contestants start (maybe 64 or so) with a set of events on a point system that demonstrates their skill and the right to be in the final 16.

As far as events in the initial points rally to get to the final 16...

Pistol Events to include:

1. Bianchi plates with an out of the box stock M9.

2. 18 round IDPA stage with a Glock22.

3. 18-24 round ICORE stage with a S&W 686 and speedloaders.

(I am suggesting IDPA and ICORE stages because time plus scoring is a heck of a lot easier to explain to the television audience than hit factor scoring.)

4. An abbreviated Bullseye cof with an entry level 1911.

5. An abbreviated Silhouette event with a Ruger Blackhawk.

Similar range of shooting activites for rifle, shotgun and non-firearms.

Show the highlights from the initial qualification events (both the very good and the disasters)

Once you have the top 16, have the two best scoring shooters become the captains to pick their team, and have them justify the picks on camera... using the video clips from the qualification events.

Once the teams are formed, the events can become less conventional ....like:

1. Bullseye match with a mousegun.

2. Polish platerack with a LE trade-in fixed sight K-frame.

3. Return to the IDPA stage, but this time in low light with couple movers, using a Glock36 and a Surefire G2. Also with a robotic paintball gun to encourage the use cover.

4 A western trick shots episode

5. Western Cowboy match

6. Model 1903 sniper match

7. Duelling tree shoot offs (maybe start them off on a Texas Star that they have to clear before engaging the duelling tree to add to the disaster-drama factor).

8. .50 BMG precision match

9. Full auto Thompsons vs field of steel

10. Modern compound bow vs moving targets.

11. Atlatl vs movers.

12. Ninja style blowguns from under water.

[Sam]

I can't claim to know much about the program. I only watched the first episode. I saw immediatly that there were a couple of very important elements missing.

Respect and humility.

And everyone seemed to be pre-occupied about who was going to get "voted off the island". It saddens me to see the sport I love brought down to this level.

Epic Fail.

[Graham Smith]

There are a hundred different things they could have done and hundred different ways they could do them. Some challenges lend themselves to speed some don't, for example, if you are shooting an arrow from a compound bow at a target at 50 ft, then time might be a factor. But if you are shooting field archery with a long bow at 100 yd targets, there is not such a need to put people on the clock.

An an example of how you can make time a factor is a COF we shot at a tactical rifle course. There were 24 targets of varying sizes at various distances from 50 to 200 yds. You had 28 rounds and 60 seconds to hit as many as you could in any order from any position within a 6' wide area. So, you had to decide how to get the most hits with the ammo you had in the time you had. Scoring was simple, whoever got the most hits won, and if more than one person got all 24 then the fastest time won.

I'll bet that in one day of kicking ideas around, the folks here could come up with two shows worth of challenges that would be as good or better than anything they had.

[Carmoney]

I think it would have been a much better actual test of shooting skill if they had not required the use of all the "issued" equipment (some of which was obviously junk), and instead had the competitors bring their own stuff. For example, everybody shows up with (1) one semi-auto shotgun, (2) one scoped bolt action center-fire rifle, (3) one semi-auto rifle, (4) one centerfire handgun, (5) one rimfire handgun, (6) one rimfire rifle, and all the various ammo and stuff. Then they are presented with a bunch of surprise shooting challenges which could be accomplished with one or more of those firearms.

The way they did it the first season, the competitors had to spend way too much time figuring out where the guns were hitting, which gun was the "good one," and that sort of thing. My way, everybody's stuff would presumably be sighted in correctly and functioning properly. No whining about equipment. And some of the luck factor we saw this year would be removed. The best shooters would actually do the best, and the winner could truly claim to be Top Shot.

Of course, that would sorta take away from the historical aspect of the program, which is the connection to the History Channel in the first place.

Edited September 8, 2010 by Carmoney

[BlackSabbath]

I would like to see a bowling pin table challenge, man -vs- man....Very fun to shoot and fun to watch.

[Corey]

What was wrong with what they did on the show? It wasnt a show to see who owned the best rifle or who could run a USPSA course the fastest. It was a show to challenge shooters with weapons from all across history (thus it was on the History Channel not VS or Spike). I liked seing them use the supplied weapons. A true "Top Shot" would be able to figure out its POI rather easily and adapt to it properly. Plus the same gun puts that part of the equation on a level playing field. If everyone brought their own guns, why did they win? B/c they are the better marksman or b/c they spent $3000 more to build a rifle setup better than someone else's? With the same guns, the shooters and their own skills were the determining factor.

As for what Id like to see/what was missing: Obviously more shooting. The last 2 episodes were the best, by far! but they were making a show to try to gain viewing audience from a broad range of viewers, not just shooters. As as been discussed too many times to count, when looking at reality tv shows: drama sells, PERIOD! If they thought they could have gotten a bigger audience showing shootoffs all day, they would have. But they knew better.

I personally did not care for the voting off the island concept, but again, its the drama that that creates that a lot of people liked. You tune in to see if your favorite guy/girl or the villian/jerk will get kicked off.

I would rather see no one go home, but rather EVERYONE compete in EVERY challenge, with challenge from different shooting disciplines: USPSA matches, multi-gun matches, high-power palma matches, rounds of trap/skeet/sporting clays, F-class shooting, tactical sniper matches, SASS cowboy shooting, etc. Also can throw in challenges like cutting a rope with bullet, etc. Points awarded for based on position of finish. Season ends and the winner and thus "Top Shot" from the group wil be the person with the most points. Its what I'd like to see, but I doubt will happen.

[dirtybomb]

I would love to see top shooters (all pros or semi pros) from all different disciplines (trap/skeet, f-class, USPSA etc). Lets see who is the most well rounded marksman in the world. A format with world class shooters where at the end where the viewer truely believes that the winner is the top shot.

[JeffWard]

I would love to see top shooters (all pros or semi pros) from all different disciplines (trap/skeet, f-class, USPSA etc). Lets see who is the most well rounded marksman in the world. A format with world class shooters where at the end where the viewer truely believes that the winner is the top shot.

Now we're getting somewhere... Not on the History Channel, but how about VS, or the Outdoor Channel.

Invite Only: National level shooters from IPSC, Sporting Clays, Bianchi, High Power, Bullseye, Trap, Skeet, Archery, and rimfire events... If you finished top-3, at Nationals, in the past 2 years, you're invited.

Equipment Sponsors: Equally prepared IPSC Limited Gun from STI, Benelli Shotguns, S&W Rimfire Pistols, DPMS ARs, etc...

Each competitor shoots each discipline and throws out their worst finish... Top-Shot is crowned!

Who's getting it started???

Jeff

[Carmoney]

Lets see who is the most well rounded marksman in the world.

Let me just answer that question right now: It's Jerry Miculek.

Hands down.

[Dan Hefta]

I think that a lot of us are forgetting something about Top Shot... It is a completely different game than what we are used to playing and they are not playing by our rules, it is what it is. They need to attract a lot larger audience than just us shooters or the show will fail. I noticed all season that a lot of shooters complained about how awful the show was... yet they tuned in every Sunday night right along with my wife and I... My wife sat and watched a shooting show with me... I rest my case, that's a miricle in it's self.

[Chris iliff]

Last couple of episodes seemed to hit the right stride. Really love to see a broader range of disciplines. I think they should cut the girly drama and give us shooting drama. I want to see some more heads up competitions. Why they didn't pit the contestants against each other in contests that played to just one discipline. Example

Everyone shoots a steel challenge stage. Points awarded

Everyone shoots an IPSC stage. Points awarded

Everyone shoots a SASS stage. Points awarded

You get the picture, criminy, long range rifle, skeet, clays, bows, knives, sporting clays, Geez. The list is endless. No one gets top billing or an unfair advantage, but everyone gets a shot at there specialty. I would have loved to see some mounted shooting. Didn't they have a mounted champion? Experts set out thier specialty, but co host that episode and show them how it is done. Did anyone see JJ shoot an ipsc stage? After so many shows the contestants with the lowest points are "self" eliminated.

MORE SHOOTING!!!!!!!!!!!

Several episodes like this to whittle the contestants, then team them up and go head to head exploiting the specialties on each team. One team could be Ipsc, shotgun, long range. The other team could be Mounted shooting, SASS, multigun. Team losing votes member out.

eventually your down to man against man again and then run it like the last couple episodes.

Really upset that I didn't get to see more shooting, inside documentaries on contestants doing their thing. They had JJ "Freakin" Racazza and didn't show case him? Geez what a miserable waste? I'm sure they could have showcased a lot more of the contestants better, I just use JJ as an example. Who wouldn't love to see a montage of JJ doing his thing? Or some shotgun expert, or long range expert? Just poorly planned.

It's like some guys that don't have any kind of shooting experience decided to do a show and it was a work in progress and learning on the fly with each episode getting a little better.

Ok, it was missing D,V, and C IMHO.

[Jaxshooter]

Elimination could be done by score. Lowest score after each competition is eliminated. Ties settled by shootoffs. That eliminates the buddy system eliminating a competitor they don't like or they don't want to compete against because they are better.

[cletus9mm]

+1 to what jax just said. the part that troubled me most was it was turned into a popularity contest. top shot to me means that the most well rounded shooter should win. i would much rather see a point system employed to eliminate the competition vs a vote. kelly was a prime example of this through a good portion of the season. he constantly faced elimination not because of his lack of skill, but for his lack of "popularity" with the people he was rooming with.

[Aglifter]

I agree on using supplied equipment, but I do think it should have been better quality. Also, I agree that a fair percentage of the competitors had no business being there.

[dirtybomb]

Lets see who is the most well rounded marksman in the world.

Let me just answer that question right now: It's Jerry Miculek.

Hands down.

I can not disagree. I top pick.