Chuck Anderson

I'm going for both. Production for one and I haven't figured out what I want to shoot for the other.

Area 1 Director is aware. I'll try Sedro to look at the date. If not we'll have some computers available for signup there. Awards are at 4:00 PM local and the waitlist goes live at 8:00 PM Local so hopefully most folks won't have to wait around too long.

162 Woo hoo!!!!

Okay, I clicked. Please, please, please let me be quick enough.

Oops, and to the OP. Please leave the cans at home. They are no advantage at 3-Gun and a royal pain in the butt for the scorekeeper. I can rarely pick up the last shot on any of my supressed guns. They're slower to handle on field courses because of the extra weight as well.

Looks like everyone needs to step back and look at their arguments a bit. It seems you guys are arguing two different theories. One set arguing that compensators are more effective than suppressors and another arguing that suppressors are more effective than nothing. A proper compensator on a rifle will, normally, be the most effective solution to reducing recoil. Some of that changes depending on the size of the gun the can is on. The comped JP rifle I've got doesn't move. My duty gun doesn't move much with the SureFire can on it. It doesn't move at all when I take the can off and use the MB556AR muzzle break only. My experience with several different cans has been, Most recoil: bare muzzle Less recoil: suppressor Least recoil: compensator. Accuracy has been about a push for me. Some have seen an increase, some (normally cheap cans) a decrease and some it really doesn't matter As far as velocity. Depends on the gun and your load. I've got some cans, that with some ammo will increase velocity. Some it stays the same. A lot has to do with how much barrel you have leading up to the can and how your load is developed. If the projectile uses up the gas in the available barrel, you won't see any increase. If your projectile is still speeding up, the additional pressure in the can add a few feet per second. My duty rifle (12.5" Larue with SF can) gains about 50 fps. Same with a suppressed Glock 17 that I have. My longer barreled applications don't show much a of a change at all. And for those that have never shot one, my G-17 has significantly more recoil suppressed than unsuppressed. That's because it has a recoil booster so it will work though, not because of the can.

You can also buy a Glock Lower complete now for less than the cost of a new gun. You could keep one lower stock for USPSA and the current one for IDPA.

I've got my Production and Metallic guns built now though. At least I can use them for other disciplines if I decide I'm not a fan of the NRA and AP. If I build an Open gun, it's specific to AP. I think I'll wait till after the Cup before I go for that little expense. I do have a couple of Base guns I could probably build up. But right now I'm not sure If I'll be shooting AP after May.

Above is your first comment on Production Barrels Below is you second quote "Production is not being pushed, what some people seem to be missing is, NRA Action Pistol is more then just the Bianchi Cup, it was introdused to make it easier for people to start shooting NRA Action Pistol with minimum cost, incentives at the Championship will always be intruduced. This year we have also added a Speed Team Event, which will be a fired by 3 competitors on Sat, 29 May. Now the barrel issue, there has NOT been a rule change, this is one of the bad things about trying to keep the shooters informed. The definition of OEM is An original equipment manufacturer, or OEM, manufactures products or components that are purchased by a company and retailed under that purchasing company's brand name. OEM refers to the company that originally manufactured the product. That doed NOT mean you can replace the barrel with any barrel you wish. Tom... " Aftermarket is not OEM by definition. Is the NRA now saying that Aftermarket barrels aren't allowed? When you just said they were? Please clarify this before Monday so I can hopefully salvage some of my money from this supposedly legal modification which you are now saying isnt' legal.

Production is not being pushed, what some people seem to be missing is, NRA Action Pistol is more then just the Bianchi Cup, it was introdused to make it easier for people to start shooting NRA Action Pistol with minimum cost, incentives at the Championship will always be intruduced. This year we have also added a Speed Team Event, which will be a fired by 3 competitors on Sat, 29 May. Now the barrel issue, there has NOT been a rule change, this is one of the bad things about trying to keep the shooters informed. The definition of OEM is An original equipment manufacturer, or OEM, manufactures products or components that are purchased by a company and retailed under that purchasing company's brand name. OEM refers to the company that originally manufactured the product. That doed NOT mean you can replace the barrel with any barrel you wish. Tom... Sorry the quote from you that I read said that barrels could be replaced wtih aftermarket barrels. I thought that was pretty clear. If you are now saying that they can't be replaced with aftermarket barrels PLEASE clarify this since I just sent mine off to get fitted with a KKM barrel and I'm going to be seriously upset if NRA is flip flopping on this again.

I think the problem in this case is it's not a case of shooting better. It's a case of hide in one of the smaller Divisions to get more loot. If you finish #21 in a Divsion with 100 shooters, you're out of luck. If you finish 21 in a division with half that number, you're walking away with cash. Taking it a step farther, the Division with the lowest points will end up with the most stuff. Not exactly a case of shoot better, win more. Now I understand the reasons why Production is being pushed so hard. It's the reason I'm dragging my lazy innaccurate butt to Missouri this year. Figure I should at least be able to pay for ammo even with a likely unimpressive performance. It wouldn't have been worth it for me to build an Open gun and do the same even if they ran the table down to 50th in Open (doubt I would make it to that mark). Wish I could see a solution, but I'm guessing, "just get more prizes" probably isn't all the realistic. My big issue this far is trying to figure out how the "rules" and the referree have decided that aftermarket barrels in Production are cool at the Cup, but I can't shoot one at my club match the week before, or after Bianchi. That one seems a bit off to me. (Of course that said I just shipped my G34 off to SJC for an emergency aftermarket barrel fit)

Yep, he was in civvies at the SHOT Show this year and working the Remington booth when I talked to him. Excellent pick for Remington in my opinion.

The reason this is not in the rules is because there are many clubs where it is not an issue. Why force those clubs, with no legitimate need to change to forward fallers to swap them out? There are a lot of ranges where a shot over the berm is really not an issue at all, Rio Salado, Reno, Parma, Emmett all jump to mind since I've shot them recently. I'm sure there are others. If you're club has an issue that makes it imperative to not drive down poppers and potentially send one over the berm, by all means switch to forward falling poppers. But don't make up a local rule, in violation of USPSA rules, because it's easier. DQ'ing shooters for double tapping steel is not within the rules, unless you have a variance from the President, or there is a local law (not club rule) to back it up. Can't say I've ever seen a jurisdiction create an ordinance banning double tapping steel targets. I've heard many people talk about how easy it is to just turn them around, or add a piece of something or other to make them FFP's. Hate to say it, but not everyone uses the same popper design. I've seen almost as many popper designs as clubs I've shot. Trust me, it's a fair number. Some are easy to modify, some are not. I've never seen a modified setup that was as reliable as a rear falling popper. And several FFP designs will cause problems with calibrations. The ones that use a latch change when you shoot them. The latch may slide down, and even if it was a legitimate hit initially and the popper didn't go it almost certainly will to the calibration shot. This can be fixed with course design, or local purchase of FFP's if needed. I don't see making this an across the board rule change though.

Gen 4 definitely does not use the same Guide rod/spring assembly. That's one of the big changes. There are 8 different parts: slide, frame, recoil spring assembly, trigger bar, trigger housing, trigger housing pin and magazine release and magazine. The older mags work as long as the mag release is left on the left side. I haven't done a lot of shooting with the backstraps installed but I didn't notice anything when I did. Avoid the RTF for concealed carry. That's the main reason they switched to the different polymids on the current generation. The RTF would chew up clothing or skin when worn concealed.

How much?

Great match again this year. Thanks to Carrie and Tim and the rest of the Idaho crew who helded set up and run an awesome match. It's really a blast seeing folks who don't normally have the opportunity to shoot such a fine platform as the Glock and are stuck shooting those silly 2011's. The stages seemed a lot more technical this year with a bit less close range hosing. A change I was happy to see. The stage with the Polish Plate Rack, Two drop outs, and new popout target array backed up a lot (who'd have guessed with all that stuff in there) but was a blast to shoot. Some of the guys managed to get that rack moving so fast I thought it was going to take off. They also had a surprise stage that was run very well. Competitors were threatened with a severe ass whooping along with zeroing the stage if they talked about it. It seemed to work. I didn't hear anyone talking about it before shooting it. And no details from the folks that did, just groans. I was also happy to see a Standards with the targets waaaay out there. Just something about a target way down there that separates the men from the boys. Congratulations to the winners. I remember Mike Gibson won Subcompact again. Unfortunately I can't remember the name of the guy who unseated Russ Honeywell in Compact. We didn't get off the range till it was dang near dark. Kepa (not even gonna try you're last name) turned in an awesome performance with the full sized Glock to beat Mike Hughes and Yong Lee (two of our best Production shooters out of Washington state). Awesome job Kepa. Looking forward to seeing you at Area 1.

It won't be a game changer. I doubt anyone will use it. It's essentially a sporting gun with some really cheap feeling plastic covering it. I had the chance to handle one at SHOT this year, although I didn't get a chance to shoot it because they couldn't find the firing pin for it. It feels really cheap in the hand. Did I mention it feels cheap?

Yep, you can leave your holster at home. You can use a G17 in all categories except Major Sub and Subcompact, but you can use your 30 in Sub and Major Sub if you want. The Warren sights on the 17 are perfectly legal, in fact all the GSSF Rangemasters use them as well. The trigger job, maybe, maybe not. GSSF rules say the guns have to be essentially stock and use only parts available from Glock on one model or another. For example if you're running a 17 with an extended mag release from a 34 or 21 you're good to go, or the 3.5 connector from the 34. If you're using a Ghost Rocket, Scherer, Glockworx etc. connector, or a Ti Striker, or Wolff Springs, you're going against the rules. I've never seen them check but you'll know you're breaking the rules. I de-tune my Glocks before I go to GSSF just to stay in compliance. It's not that difficult. BTW, if you are a USPSA shooter, slow down. Even if you think you're going too slow, you're not. The universal mistake I see USPSA shooters make when going to these matches is shooting too fast. The "C" zone adds 1 second and the D adds 3 seconds. Couple C's and D's on a stage and your looking at more penalties than it took you to shoot the stage. You gain time in a GSSF Match on Transitions and getting the gun to the target quickly after the buzzer. As far as GSSF or a USPSA match, I would pick the GSSF match. USPSA will be there next month, GSSF won't be back till next year.

So it looks like I'm shooting on Squad 23. Does anyone know anyone on that squad? I must have really ticked Cindy off to get slotted in there.

GSSF is designed as an entry pistol competition. There are a ton of guns, money, and other prizes given away to amatuers and newcomers. There are new member drawings, random giveaways and awards based on performance. It's an excellent way to get new shooters involved with action pistol shooting. If they find it boring, get them to a Steel Challenge or USPSA match. While the courses of fire are boring for seasoned USPSA competitors, they are tough. There is always a goal to reach. Since it uses the same courses you can easily compare performance from match to match, gun to gun and year to year. Yes GSSF costs a bit for the first match. Take advantage of the discount certificate, multiple matches and multiple entries at each match. That price goes down a bit. I normally shoot about 500 rounds in 2 hours each GSSF match I go to. In 6 matches last year I took home $4800.00. (At least according to the tax form Glock sent me). It's a really cool event for newcomers and masters alike. Go to a match, slow down more than you think you need to and shoot a score. Then see if you can beat it. I'm still trying to break into the 20's with a Major Sub gun and under 35 with my Unlimited. Hopefully this year.

John's response. Chuck, If you will note, Steve is talking about a response I sent to him in 2006, we were operating under different rules then and my response fit those rules, however, an email as pointed out in the new rules Q&A from July of 2009, does not make a ruling, only the rules and an NROI official ruling through the proper procedure is accepted. The section on sight pictures today, reads totally different than in 2006, under today’s rules there is nothing wrong with a loaded sight picture. If it goes off, it’s on the competitor. John

I emailed John and copied the thread. I'm not sure which rules have changed since 2006 and don't know if his answer to you would apply any more. We'll see what he says.

Then the clubs you shoot at aren't following USPSA rules and that's a bigger issue. If you want email Amidon and print out his reply saying you can do it. The bottom line is it's allowed under the rules.

That totally goes against the most basic gun safety rule in existence....."hey, it's okay, it's unloaded....BANG" I understand the sentiment here but we have to know when our gun is loaded or not when shooting USPSA. We have to dry fire at the end if the stage and the gun better be empty then. Any shooter with half a brain should be able to remember for 30 seconds that they put ammo in the gun at LAMR. As far as the rule George and Troy covered this very well. We've discussed this before and come to the same conclusion.

Yeah, I've had my ammo weighed three times. Twice they kept about 100 rounds. First time was September 14, 2001 on my way to Nationals. But the others have just been random trips. Kind of a pain when you're scrambling for ammo at a match. Your better off just shipping it to the hotel.