GoinBroke Posted March 3, 2009 Share Posted March 3, 2009 I was out at my local indoor range yesterday and, as I was picking up MY OWN 9mm brass as usual, I was told that this would no longer be allowed. This was explained in some convoluted dissertation on how MY club was being financially hurt by my actions. I must point out that, although I spent more than $4700. on JUST targets and ammo last year AND bought 4 guns and lots of misc. stuff, I also spent an EXTRA $100. on the membership that ALLOWS me to use ANY ammo or targets I want. I have never used it as I do not have my reloading equip yet. I have only been shooting for about 14 months but if this is the way they treat really good customers, they deserve to fail. I only wish I had not talked several of my friends into joining this "club". I really believe in loyalty, but this proves that no good deed goes unpunished. What would you guys say to this owner. or am I all wet? Jay Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rtr Posted March 3, 2009 Share Posted March 3, 2009 It's amazing that an owner would risk losing your business over a few bucks worth of brass. But I've seen it elsewhere. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rolex Posted March 3, 2009 Share Posted March 3, 2009 Pick it up and shoot outside-be free! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CSEMARTIN Posted March 3, 2009 Share Posted March 3, 2009 I'd tell him I'm keeping my brass, and I want my lead back too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CenTX Posted March 3, 2009 Share Posted March 3, 2009 If you are not reloading, shoot aluminum case Blaser and let them keep it, but buy everything somewhere else. I once owned part of and worked in an indoor range. You have a tremendous advantage over other gun shops. Each time someone comes in to shoot you have the opportunity to establish a relationship that goes well beyound just selling range time. Some of the people that come to shoot will make an impulse purchase of anything from ammo to guns. If someone buys a gun they can try it out right away and probably will be buyimg the ammo from you. With the indoor range people can shoot regardless of the weather. When it's raining cats and dogs and the outdoor ranges can't shoot. I understand a rule that you can only pick up your own brass, but to prevent you from picking up your own brass is bad business. Their profit may go up because of the rule, but in the long run it will cost them money in lost sales that they will probably never know about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
speculatorking Posted March 3, 2009 Share Posted March 3, 2009 I started a thread back recently regarding my indoor range wanting to charge me $5 to shoot because I did not buy any ammo from them. I recently bought a membership for $250. I complained to the owner who said it was posted in at least three places that members and non-members would be charged a $5 fee to shoot if you didn't use their ammo. Not being able to pick up your own brass is INSANE. The owner of my range was also chewing out his employee for field-stripping a gun too far to clean it and wasting time. I told him cleanliness is next to Godliness. I think they are all being pinched hard by this economy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoinBroke Posted March 3, 2009 Author Share Posted March 3, 2009 If you are not reloading, shoot aluminum case Blaser and let them keep it, but buy everything somewhere else.I once owned part of and worked in an indoor range. You have a tremendous advantage over other gun shops. Each time someone comes in to shoot you have the opportunity to establish a relationship that goes well beyound just selling range time. Some of the people that come to shoot will make an impulse purchase of anything from ammo to guns. If someone buys a gun they can try it out right away and probably will be buyimg the ammo from you. With the indoor range people can shoot regardless of the weather. When it's raining cats and dogs and the outdoor ranges can't shoot. I understand a rule that you can only pick up your own brass, but to prevent you from picking up your own brass is bad business. Their profit may go up because of the rule, but in the long run it will cost them money in lost sales that they will probably never know about. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- I wholeheartedly agree. When my good customers need something, they get it! This guy does NOT allow alum/steel cased ammo either. When I mentiond once that the cardboard D1 targets work much better for me (he dosen't have them) he promptly told me they are not allowed. I use at least 12 of his paper per week. He knew I just used cardboard at a GSSF tourny at a rival club about 10 miles away. I wonder if the fact that I bought the ammo, presumably that INCLUDED the brass, from him, if he has any right at all to claim it as HIS when it hits the floor. Didn't I buy it? Cost of 9mm reloads there is $14 for reloads and $17 for factory. BTW, there is a HUGE fued going on between the two local clubs. I only WISH I had only one competitor locally, we'd be out having beers together every night. Jay, not understanding some people's idea of business, or honor for that matter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steel1212 Posted March 3, 2009 Share Posted March 3, 2009 If you are not reloading, shoot aluminum case Blaser and let them keep it, but buy everything somewhere else.I once owned part of and worked in an indoor range. You have a tremendous advantage over other gun shops. Each time someone comes in to shoot you have the opportunity to establish a relationship that goes well beyound just selling range time. Some of the people that come to shoot will make an impulse purchase of anything from ammo to guns. If someone buys a gun they can try it out right away and probably will be buyimg the ammo from you. With the indoor range people can shoot regardless of the weather. When it's raining cats and dogs and the outdoor ranges can't shoot. I understand a rule that you can only pick up your own brass, but to prevent you from picking up your own brass is bad business. Their profit may go up because of the rule, but in the long run it will cost them money in lost sales that they will probably never know about. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- I wholeheartedly agree. When my good customers need something, they get it! This guy does NOT allow alum/steel cased ammo either. When I mentiond once that the cardboard D1 targets work much better for me (he dosen't have them) he promptly told me they are not allowed. I use at least 12 of his paper per week. He knew I just used cardboard at a GSSF tourny at a rival club about 10 miles away. I wonder if the fact that I bought the ammo, presumably that INCLUDED the brass, from him, if he has any right at all to claim it as HIS when it hits the floor. Didn't I buy it? Cost of 9mm reloads there is $14 for reloads and $17 for factory. BTW, there is a HUGE fued going on between the two local clubs. I only WISH I had only one competitor locally, we'd be out having beers together every night. Jay, not understanding some people's idea of business, or honor for that matter. I don't think he can tell you that the brass is his, that would be stealing as you own it. What he can tell you is that if you don't leave it don't shoot there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bkeeler Posted March 3, 2009 Share Posted March 3, 2009 I started a thread back recently regarding my indoor range wanting to charge me $5 to shoot because I did not buy any ammo from them. I recently bought a membership for $250. I complained to the owner who said it was posted in at least three places that members and non-members would be charged a $5 fee to shoot if you didn't use their ammo. Not being able to pick up your own brass is INSANE. The owner of my range was also chewing out his employee for field-stripping a gun too far to clean it and wasting time. I told him cleanliness is next to Godliness. I think they are all being pinched hard by this economy. Ummm, I thought gun sales... are the only thing that is up right now. They are around here. BK Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
atbarr Posted March 3, 2009 Share Posted March 3, 2009 I don't think he can tell you that the brass is his, that would be stealing as you own it. What he can tell you is that if you don't leave it don't shoot there. The last time I shot in that big Paris, KY gun store, you were not allowed to pick up your own brass. I have not been there for a few months, so that rule might have been removed. Stay Safe, A.T. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
raz-0 Posted March 3, 2009 Share Posted March 3, 2009 Well, here's something to try. You paid for a membership. If this was not explained to you when you signed up. tell him he has materially altered the terms of your contract in a manner that is financially detrimental to you, and that you want your membership fee back. Also tell him that personally, you will no longer be purchasing any firearms or accessories there, and that unless there is a good reason for changing this policy that is not financially motivated, it won't be making him any money off of you. In fact, quite the opposite. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tzygä Posted March 3, 2009 Share Posted March 3, 2009 If you are not reloading, shoot aluminum case Blaser and let them keep it, but buy everything somewhere else.I once owned part of and worked in an indoor range. You have a tremendous advantage over other gun shops. Each time someone comes in to shoot you have the opportunity to establish a relationship that goes well beyound just selling range time. Some of the people that come to shoot will make an impulse purchase of anything from ammo to guns. If someone buys a gun they can try it out right away and probably will be buyimg the ammo from you. With the indoor range people can shoot regardless of the weather. When it's raining cats and dogs and the outdoor ranges can't shoot. I understand a rule that you can only pick up your own brass, but to prevent you from picking up your own brass is bad business. Their profit may go up because of the rule, but in the long run it will cost them money in lost sales that they will probably never know about. +1 Use aluminum case Blaser and don't spend any money there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob Boudrie Posted March 3, 2009 Share Posted March 3, 2009 MY club was being financially hurt There are two kinds of clubs - non profit "member owned" and "commercial". If it's "your club", the officers are answerable to the membership. If it's a business, he has no reason to call it "your club". The only reasonable reason to ban pickup at indoor ranges is firing line control, or to keep a match moving - rental booths, a clientele of "mixed skill levels" (sometimes to put it mildly) and an always hot line can make retrieval difficult. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoinBroke Posted March 3, 2009 Author Share Posted March 3, 2009 MY club was being financially hurt There are two kinds of clubs - non profit "member owned" and "commercial". If it's "your club", the officers are answerable to the membership. If it's a business, he has no reason to call it "your club". The only reasonable reason to ban pickup at indoor ranges is firing line control, or to keep a match moving - rental booths, a clientele of "mixed skill levels" (sometimes to put it mildly) and an always hot line can make retrieval difficult. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Thanks guys, This range is DEFINITELY "for profit". I have bought so much ammo there that the joke is "hide the ammo!" when I walk in. 6 boxes is about the minimum that I shoot on any given day and that is about 3 days a week. I have bought cases many times. I figure I have shot more ammo in the last 14 months than any 10 other "members". Way over $12,000. last year alone if you count guns etc. There is no document given to members with range rules, only the usual safety stuff going into the range plus no steel case ammo. There is one other rule about "rapid fire" on the door. Although I have been told to slow down on many occaisions, I have never been told what "slow" is..... Sorry about the rant but I am a range rookie with little experience with range owners. I guess my expectations are too high. I will be buying my ammo elsewhere and making that fact as obvious as possible. Same with guns and everything else. The only problem is even Wally World is completely out of all major calibers most of the time. Great..... J Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tzygä Posted March 3, 2009 Share Posted March 3, 2009 Good decision, GoinBroke. They will notice that they step over the line there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JKSNIPER Posted March 3, 2009 Share Posted March 3, 2009 MY club was being financially hurt There are two kinds of clubs - non profit "member owned" and "commercial". If it's "your club", the officers are answerable to the membership. If it's a business, he has no reason to call it "your club". The only reasonable reason to ban pickup at indoor ranges is firing line control, or to keep a match moving - rental booths, a clientele of "mixed skill levels" (sometimes to put it mildly) and an always hot line can make retrieval difficult. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Thanks guys, This range is DEFINITELY "for profit". I have bought so much ammo there that the joke is "hide the ammo!" when I walk in. 6 boxes is about the minimum that I shoot on any given day and that is about 3 days a week. I have bought cases many times. I figure I have shot more ammo in the last 14 months than any 10 other "members". Way over $12,000. last year alone if you count guns etc. There is no document given to members with range rules, only the usual safety stuff going into the range plus no steel case ammo. There is one other rule about "rapid fire" on the door. Although I have been told to slow down on many occaisions, I have never been told what "slow" is..... Sorry about the rant but I am a range rookie with little experience with range owners. I guess my expectations are too high. I will be buying my ammo elsewhere and making that fact as obvious as possible. Same with guns and everything else. The only problem is even Wally World is completely out of all major calibers most of the time. Great..... J +1 to a lot of what guys here already said. I'd look hard for another range to shoot at and make it clear why I was leaving and taking my business with me. Good luck. JK Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buddy_fuentes Posted March 4, 2009 Share Posted March 4, 2009 Some years ago one of our indoor ranges up and decided to stop letting anyone shoot ammo that was bought elsewhere. They claimed that it was their insurance carrier's rules. Their number of shooters dropped drastically and suddenly their insurance carrier didn't care anymore, and decided to allow outside ammo. Yep, you could bring you own ammo to the range. A few years later no aluminum or steel ammo was allowed and that didn't last too long either. I would never shoot at a facility that won't let me pick up my own brass. Buddy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TMC Posted March 4, 2009 Share Posted March 4, 2009 I would confront him and remind him of your purchase history and ask if he is willing to loose that kind of business over a couple dollars worth of brass that you own. I would ask how he justifies that part of the ammo you bought becomes his property when it hits the floor, what if you drop your range bag on the floor, is it his? I would also remind him that you are a member of that club and wihout members there is no club and there are other places to shoot in the area. I would then smile and say, this is a nice place, it would be a shame to have to shoot some place else. Very bad business. I will never shoot at a range where I am not allowed to take my brass with me, regardless of whether I want it or not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seth Posted March 4, 2009 Share Posted March 4, 2009 (edited) Do they claim rights to your pistol as well if you happen to set it down? Edited March 4, 2009 by Seth Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flatland Shooter Posted March 4, 2009 Share Posted March 4, 2009 Try shooting revolver and dump the brass directly into your range bag. Never touched the ground. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Storm52 Posted March 4, 2009 Share Posted March 4, 2009 Try shooting revolver and dump the brass directly into your range bag. Never touched the ground. My thoughts too! I haven't made the move to pistol ownership, although I am terribly close (need to decide on caliber(s). I always dumped spent brass into my bag. Goin', with the amount you spend/spent on ammunition, you could easily cut your cost by half with a Dillon 1050. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VegasOPM Posted March 4, 2009 Share Posted March 4, 2009 I like Raz-o's response. If you signed a contract see what it said. If you have receipts, or even an itemized tally- let the owner know how much it will cost him to lose your business. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bofe954 Posted March 4, 2009 Share Posted March 4, 2009 For the money you are/have already spent- Call Brian buy a press and reloading set up and find an outdoor club where they leave you alone. I can't imagine the reloading set up and quantity of ammo you could have for 12K. Chalk up this club as a mistake. I am so much happier now that I reload and am a member at an outdoor club. I live in Minnesota and as long as it is over 20 degrees I'd rather shoot outside. I've shot matches a lot colder. I don't miss smelly, smokey, noisy indoor ranges where I can't draw from a holster or move. I don't miss people at Walmart commenting on the quantity of ammo I buy. If you can't do that for some reason remind the guy how much money you spend, but if it was me, I'd just never go back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ciscoip Posted March 4, 2009 Share Posted March 4, 2009 MY club was being financially hurt There are two kinds of clubs - non profit "member owned" and "commercial". If it's "your club", the officers are answerable to the membership. If it's a business, he has no reason to call it "your club". The only reasonable reason to ban pickup at indoor ranges is firing line control, or to keep a match moving - rental booths, a clientele of "mixed skill levels" (sometimes to put it mildly) and an always hot line can make retrieval difficult. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Thanks guys, This range is DEFINITELY "for profit". I have bought so much ammo there that the joke is "hide the ammo!" when I walk in. 6 boxes is about the minimum that I shoot on any given day and that is about 3 days a week. I have bought cases many times. I figure I have shot more ammo in the last 14 months than any 10 other "members". Way over $12,000. last year alone if you count guns etc. There is no document given to members with range rules, only the usual safety stuff going into the range plus no steel case ammo. There is one other rule about "rapid fire" on the door. Although I have been told to slow down on many occaisions, I have never been told what "slow" is..... Sorry about the rant but I am a range rookie with little experience with range owners. I guess my expectations are too high. I will be buying my ammo elsewhere and making that fact as obvious as possible. Same with guns and everything else. The only problem is even Wally World is completely out of all major calibers most of the time. Great..... J Wow, that range really sucks! You've got a lot more patience than me . . . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bear23 Posted March 4, 2009 Share Posted March 4, 2009 I'd have a nice long discussion with the owner, in front of other customers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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