sasquatch981 Posted February 6, 2009 Share Posted February 6, 2009 So I have been reading the forums here about mills, and understand they are much like gun-safes. Find the size you think you want, and then double it. So my question is this. I am not made of money, and will only be using this as a hobby type thing. Working on my own projects, and pistols/parts. I know bridgeport is the big name and the from what I understand is the pinnacle to strive for. But what about JET, Shop Fox, or Grizzly? I live in Bellingham and we have a Grizzly warehouse here so I would not need to worry about shipping. Any opinions? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toolguy Posted February 6, 2009 Share Posted February 6, 2009 Grizzly is a great place to go for metalworking tools. Their cheapest mill that you would enjoy using is model #G3102 at $2550.00. Stay away from the mill drills that have a round pipe for the vertical column. They have a nice variable speed version that is $3995.00. If you want more help, PM me with a phone # and time to call. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
want2race Posted February 6, 2009 Share Posted February 6, 2009 I'm currently looking for a used Lagun. Usually about $5k though. I used a Bridgeport in the shop a little, but the Lagun with air powered collet ratchety thingy (technical term, look it up) was awesome. So much faster than reaching up on top with a wrench to release the tool from the collet. I passed on a $1200 mill a year ago because I didn't think I could run a 3 phase in my single phase garage. I was wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billfer Posted February 6, 2009 Share Posted February 6, 2009 air powered collet ratchety thingy aka.... power drawbar I agree, they are one of the nice options you could have on a mill A used bridgeport could be found for around 3500.00 on up, depending on what extras might be on it. That might be a good place to start as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
want2race Posted February 6, 2009 Share Posted February 6, 2009 Just spent an hour on ebay looking at BP's. Couple of nice'uns on there. Power Drawbar, got it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GTOSHootr Posted February 6, 2009 Share Posted February 6, 2009 I have a Kurt power drawbar on my Bridgeport. If you take the cover off, it is just an Chicago Pneumatic air wrench in a fixture. It is a nice option. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Franksremote Posted February 6, 2009 Share Posted February 6, 2009 You can get BPs for $1000-$2k on places like CL. Even Ebay has 'em for cheap if you're willing to wait for a good deal. Big difference compared to a few years ago when you couldn't get squat for less than $3500. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HSMITH Posted February 6, 2009 Share Posted February 6, 2009 You can have Gans or someone like him do a TON of work for a lot less than a mill is going to cost. Having it to do a couple things now and then doesn't pay, but I completely understand just wanting to do it yourself and have that satisfaction. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shooterbenedetto Posted February 6, 2009 Share Posted February 6, 2009 I saw a table lathe from Harbor freight. Is it worth getting for little projects on our guns? sale for $499.00..Just got a FREE milling from my uncle that he no longer use..it is converted to single phase and do not have to worry about 3 phase crap! just plug in and go. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carlos Posted February 6, 2009 Share Posted February 6, 2009 I am not made of money, and will only be using this as a hobby type thing. Can you be more specific? Bigger mills require re-wiring your household electrical outlets to "3-phase". Figure in tooling as well. If your budget is less than $1500, you should take a look at either the Enco imported mills or a chinese mini-mill (which I own) and contrary to the machine snobs' opinions out there, the small Chinese mills CAN yeild enough precision to perform the machining operations on an STI/SV (including milling the frame for a ramp) - AND they teach you how to machine. You can also sell that mill for most of what you have in it in a few years and then make an INFORMED decision on what mill to buy next. Look, would I like to drive a Maserati, 7 series BMW or loaded Hummer? Sure. Are they nicer rides? No doubt. But our new mini-van meets our minimum needs. Moreover, OP is only using the mill in his free time (when he ain't shooting or dry firing that is). Air powered collets & bridgeports are nice for full-time, paid machinists. Anyone think they are needed for the OP's planned hobby work? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ed Robinson Posted February 6, 2009 Share Posted February 6, 2009 The smaller Grizzly machines will do the job but you will need to make some modifications. I have their biggest Mill/Drill/Lathe and the machine does a great job. The only problem is the dials on the machine. Not accurate at all. I set indicators on all axis (or axes?) rather than relying on their dials on the machine. Otherwise it does a great job for a benchtop mill/lathe that was under 1400 bucks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sasquatch981 Posted February 7, 2009 Author Share Posted February 7, 2009 I know what HS Smith is talking about when he says that Gans or someone can do alot of work for the money spent on a mill. I have often thought about that very topic, and waffle either way depending on the week. The nice thing about Grizzly is it is litteraly 3 miles from my house, and I go to the tent sale every year. In fact got a medium sized gun safe this year for $100. It had a scratch on the back!!!! You know the part that goes against the wall I see the bigger mills and lathes they have as demos, or close-outs, or floor models for upwards of 50% of retail, and no shipping. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
h2osport Posted February 8, 2009 Share Posted February 8, 2009 (edited) As far as the 3 phase vs 1 phase goes you will not be rewiring anything in your household power to get 3 phase. You would have to have the elec company bring 3 phase onto your sight at a tremendous cost. The best way to get 3 phase cheaply is to run a static phase converter on a 220 v outlet. The catch is you will drop 1 phase of the power when the machine is up and running, so you will be a little short on power. Static phase is not good for units being turned on and off a lot. The best to get full 3 phase power in a 1 phase situation would be to get a rotary phase converter. This will give you fairly consistent 3 phase power off of 1 phase 220v, and will work decent with at unit that will be started and stopped a lot. Make sure you size the rotary phase converter about 25% over your motor rated capacity. As for the different types of machinery you asked about(Jet, Shopfox, Grizzly) I have worked on them all and would recommend jet products. I have been a jet warranty service center since 1984 and have done very few warranties in that time. 75% of those were related to user error, not product failure. I think jet is running a promo on their 18" mill/drill combo right now. You might check on that. I could tell you some horror stories on Grizzly through the years, although their quality has improved some over the years. Customer service not so much. Definately stay away from the harbor freight $499 units. Just my $.02. I am sure many people have had good success with all of the brands. My opinions are solely from having worked on the products. Edited February 8, 2009 by h2osport Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CSEMARTIN Posted February 9, 2009 Share Posted February 9, 2009 I picked up a nice Bridgeport for 1300 bucks. The thing to know is that is the cheap part. You'll need tooling, a vice, perhaps a swivel base, indicators, cutting fluid, collets, clamp set, etc. I sold the 3 phase motor and went with a single phase 220 V 1.5 HP Baldor motor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimmyZip Posted February 9, 2009 Share Posted February 9, 2009 (edited) edited because the answer was already given. Edited February 9, 2009 by JimmyZip Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
warpspeed Posted February 9, 2009 Share Posted February 9, 2009 I picked up a used BP clone for $ 700. Good deals can be had if you look long enough. I'd stick with the BP size mill if you have room. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shred Posted February 9, 2009 Share Posted February 9, 2009 Get a VFD for a 3-phase machine. Light years ahead of the static or rotary phase converters. I have one on my Millrite and it's really nice to have dial-a-speed on tap. 1HP and under and you can get one that plugs right into a 110v socket and gives you 220 3-phase out plus variable speed and direction. Bridgeports are nice, but big... bigger machines tend to sell cheaper used than smaller ones that are easier to move and store. More commitment with a 2500lb chunk of iron that needs 30 square feet of floor space. For basic home pistolsmithing, you really don't need all that much iron-- as Carlos says, if you aren't getting paid for it, you can do a lot on a little machine, it just takes longer and more passes. I've been hanging out with some model-makers recently and some of the work they turn out on tiny machines is incredibly nice, but it takes them a while to do it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pat Miles Posted February 9, 2009 Share Posted February 9, 2009 Bought my Bridgeport a couple of years back. Paid $2300 for it and had to drop another $300 to rebuild the head. Bearings, bushings, belts, etc.. This mill has a power feed on the X axis which is worth its weight in gold. Sold my Clausing 8520 for $1800 so about $600 difference. Tooling can be purchased as needed when needed and you will need/want additional tooling. You'll just go nuts waiting for new stuff to arrive. Buy only what you need, not what you might use some day. You can buy that tooling when "that day" arrives. I went with a rotary phase converter. In a previous life I was an electrician so running a new 20 amp 110vac dedicated circuit was no problem. In retrospect I wish I had known more about VFD's. Not really a problem my the BP is a Varispeed. You have to do a little soul searching about spending the $$$ for a good mill. As long as you truly plan on using it they are an absolute kick in the a$$ to have in the shop. Need something done? Go to the shop and do it! As stated earlier, stay away from the round column mills. Stay with a square column unit. Regarding lathes. In pistolsmithing there is very, very little need for a lathe. If you want to do any long gun work then a bigger lathe (13"x40") is the cats pajamas. A bigger lathe because of the size of the through hole in the head for barrel work and the rigidity of the machine for accurate longer cuts as well as the increased horsepower (like my BP mill vs. my Clausing 8520) for heavier accurate cuts. CYa, Pat Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RIIID Posted February 9, 2009 Share Posted February 9, 2009 (edited) "In pistolsmithing there is very, very little need for a lathe." I don't agree with that statement, I use my lathe a lot in my pistolsmithing business, almost as much as my mill. There are plenty of Bridgeport mill out there at a good price, one just has to look and don't be a big hurry to buy. Rich Edited February 9, 2009 by RIIID Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toolguy Posted February 9, 2009 Share Posted February 9, 2009 There are relatively few jobs you can do with just a mill or just a lathe. If you have both, there are very few jobs you can't do. Get full size machines if you have the space ( Bridgeport or similar, 12/14 x 36/40 Lathe). There are good machines cheap if you spend the time & effort to locate them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyer Posted February 9, 2009 Share Posted February 9, 2009 (edited) Another way to generate 3 phase is to use a 3 phase motor to generate 3 phase power from single phase. Woodworkers (I use to be one) have been doing it for years. Usually cheaper than buying rotary convertors since used 3 phase motors are fairly easy to get. Here's some web links discussing it: http://www.woodweb.com/knowledge_base/Buil..._converter.html http://www.metalwebnews.com/howto/ph-conv/ph-conv.html Edited February 9, 2009 by flyer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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