rtr Posted August 21, 2007 Share Posted August 21, 2007 Here's the scenario. Shooter is shooting production division with a Glock 17. Shooter comes to the line on LAMR stuffs a 32 round Glock magazine into his pistol. Shoots the stage. The 32 round mag is later found to be over 170mm. So what happens to this shooter? Should/can the RO say something before starting the shooter? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D.Hayden Posted August 21, 2007 Share Posted August 21, 2007 When we get new shooters.. especially those registering Production.. I'll review thier equipment with them. Lots of new shooters have no idea what fits in each division. Hopefully you can get to them before they shoot. So, they went Open for the big stick, then went to 'shoot for no score', for the > 170MM. At a club match, I would stop them if I knew. And if they were new and already shot that one stage, I'd say change the equipment, reshoot the stage, stay in Production. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smokey Posted August 21, 2007 Share Posted August 21, 2007 When we get new shooters.. especially those registering Production.. I'll review thier equipment with them. Lots of new shooters have no idea what fits in each division. Hopefully you can get to them before they shoot.So, they went Open for the big stick, then went to 'shoot for no score', for the > 170MM. At a club match, I would stop them if I knew. And if they were new and already shot that one stage, I'd say change the equipment, reshoot the stage, stay in Production. +1 Definitely stop them before they started if it was a club level match. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChrisStock Posted August 21, 2007 Share Posted August 21, 2007 IMHO, the RO SHOULD say something, but if it is a local just for grins type match, he may not care. I have seen all manner of non sanctioned gear at local matches, (my own mag pouches included) and as long as it's just a backyard thing, nobody seems to care. Production=10rds of powder puffiness max, but no one warned me when I was starting out. If it's an experienced shooter, it is kind of a lame thing to do. Just my $.02. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpl Posted August 21, 2007 Share Posted August 21, 2007 From the current rulebook: US Appendix D9 8 Maximum magazine length No 9 Maximum ammunition capacity Yes, 10 rounds loaded maximum in any magazine after the start signal. -JPL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SA Friday Posted August 21, 2007 Share Posted August 21, 2007 From the current rulebook:US Appendix D9 8 Maximum magazine length No 9 Maximum ammunition capacity Yes, 10 rounds loaded maximum in any magazine after the start signal. -JPL ya, i was thinkin this too. if the shooter had more than 10 in that big big stick at the buzzer, then it was a change of perspective to Open. If there was only 10 rounds, then I think he was fine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iweiny Posted August 21, 2007 Share Posted August 21, 2007 (edited) From the current rulebook:US Appendix D9 8 Maximum magazine length No 9 Maximum ammunition capacity Yes, 10 rounds loaded maximum in any magazine after the start signal. -JPL yep, that is the call. No violation, unless he has more than 10rds in the mag. Lorrie and I had the same thing happen at our first golden bullet shooting L10. The Chrono man told Lorrie she could not use her 10rd mag for her Sig 220, as it did not fit in the guage. She was just about crushed thinking she would have to shoot with 8rd mags, or worse!!! We all 3 had to consult the rule book. We still joke around about that. Enjoy, Ira Edited August 21, 2007 by iweiny Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flexmoney Posted August 21, 2007 Share Posted August 21, 2007 G18 mags...in a G17, the call that I heard is that the G18 is not an approved gun for USPSA Production. Therefore, none of the parts that are G18 exclusive are legal to use in USPSA Production. So, no G18 mags in Production. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
driver8M3 Posted August 22, 2007 Share Posted August 22, 2007 aren't aftermarket mags allowed in production? if so, i can't see why the big stick wouldn't be OK. the new rulebook definitely removes any amiguity since it has a production box...and i don't think that mag is going to fit! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flexmoney Posted August 22, 2007 Share Posted August 22, 2007 FWIW...I have shot with G18 mags. They don't fall out of the gun worth shit (they are so long they hang up unless you get them perfectly vertical at release). They are a competitve disadvantage in a 10 round game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gary Stevens Posted August 22, 2007 Share Posted August 22, 2007 The magazines can be aftermarket, but they must be the same dimensions as the specific magazine for that gun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nik Habicht Posted August 22, 2007 Share Posted August 22, 2007 aren't aftermarket mags allowed in production? if so, i can't see why the big stick wouldn't be OK. the new rulebook definitely removes any amiguity since it has a production box...and i don't think that mag is going to fit! The Glock big stick isn't aftermarket. I always thought it would have been fun to go to an international match with a Glock 26 and a big stick ---- just to see what the tradeoffs are. Of course that's not legal either.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
driver8M3 Posted August 22, 2007 Share Posted August 22, 2007 (edited) aren't aftermarket mags allowed in production? if so, i can't see why the big stick wouldn't be OK. the new rulebook definitely removes any amiguity since it has a production box...and i don't think that mag is going to fit! The Glock big stick isn't aftermarket. I always thought it would have been fun to go to an international match with a Glock 26 and a big stick ---- just to see what the tradeoffs are. Of course that's not legal either.... my point is, if i can use an aftermarket mag...it makes sense that i can use any mag made by glock??? of course, not everything in the production rules makes sense... Edited August 22, 2007 by driver8M3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sestock Posted August 22, 2007 Share Posted August 22, 2007 If a USPSA match, inform them that they are shooting for fun and not score. IF they argue then they are done for the day. Letting people slide only reinforces bad behaviour. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boz1911 Posted August 22, 2007 Share Posted August 22, 2007 If it's a new shooter and I gave him/her a safety briefing it would have included a rundown on their equipment and the division they were shooting. At that point I could have found some loaner mags for the shooter to use. I have seen on more than one occasion a new shooter show up with only 2-3 mags to fire a 30+ round cof. Barring all that, first time shooter at a weekly match, let them shoot. Please don't tell me you worried about being beat??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
racerba Posted August 22, 2007 Share Posted August 22, 2007 The magazines can be aftermarket, but they must be the same dimensions as the specific magazine for that gun. Where does it say that in the USPSA rule book? It only says that in IPSC rule book. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
racerba Posted August 22, 2007 Share Posted August 22, 2007 I always thought it would have been fun to go to an international match with a Glock 26 and a big stick ---- just to see what the tradeoffs are. Of course that's not legal either.... No, you can't shoot IPSC like that, but you could shoot USPSA like that. There's no rule that prevents you from doing so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nik Habicht Posted August 22, 2007 Share Posted August 22, 2007 I always thought it would have been fun to go to an international match with a Glock 26 and a big stick ---- just to see what the tradeoffs are. Of course that's not legal either.... No, you can't shoot IPSC like that, but you could shoot USPSA like that. There's no rule that prevents you from doing so. I think the 33 rounders are longer than 170 ---- and there's no point to loading them with 10 for production...... Maybe I'll shoot Topton with 170s and a 26 ---- after I make sure it'll stay in the holster.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buddy_fuentes Posted August 22, 2007 Share Posted August 22, 2007 If it was a new shooter, I feel that he should be allowed to use any safe equipment that he brought. He should be informed that he would be allowed to use the particular equipment, this time and shoot for fun. That is what this game is about anyway, isn't it? The next time he would have to have equipment that is approved for his division. Buddy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SLC Posted August 22, 2007 Share Posted August 22, 2007 Here's the scenario. Shooter is shooting production division with a Glock 17. Shooter comes to the line on LAMR stuffs a 32 round Glock magazine into his pistol. Shoots the stage. The 32 round mag is later found to be over 170mm.So what happens to this shooter? rule 6.2.5.1: ipsc & uspsa (pdf-files) However, if a competitor fails to satisfy the equipment or other requirements of a declared Division during a course of fire, the competitor will be placed in Open Division, if available, -> otherwise the competitor will shoot the match for no score. <- Should/can the RO say something before starting the shooter?of course "should" the ro ask the compertitor in this case 'are you sure about about your equipment ?'. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
racerba Posted August 23, 2007 Share Posted August 23, 2007 I think the 33 rounders are longer than 170 ---- and there's no point to loading them with 10 for production......Maybe I'll shoot Topton with 170s and a 26 ---- after I make sure it'll stay in the holster.... It is longer. There is no max length restriction in PD. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loves2Shoot Posted August 23, 2007 Share Posted August 23, 2007 I was at a match where a guy came with +3 mag extensions on his brand new STI setup, it was obvious it was his first match. I took him aside and told him that they weren't legal for Limited, and don't put more than 19 rounds in them and I wouldn't tell anyone else. It was obvious in shock and his attitude that he had NO idea he had done something outside of the rules. He was very gracious and didn't try to sneak anything by, just a mistake from a new shooter. If he came back with them, I wouldn't make the exception again. Personally, I think this is a "for fun" sport, and most folks take it that way and play inside the rules, some flexibility that doesn't give a competitive advantage isn't the end of the world. In your example, I would hope the RO would ask the shooter something like, "So, you are shooting in Open today?" and wait for their response. The RO should check to see the competitor's equiptment in in compliance, and since you may not know the Divsion they are shooting in, questions about complaince should be acceptable. repeat offence should be dealt with firmly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nik Habicht Posted August 23, 2007 Share Posted August 23, 2007 I think the 33 rounders are longer than 170 ---- and there's no point to loading them with 10 for production......Maybe I'll shoot Topton with 170s and a 26 ---- after I make sure it'll stay in the holster.... It is longer. There is no max length restriction in PD. Bob --- I get that. But there's really no point to downloading 33 rounders to 10, so that I can continue to play in PD ----- oh, wait, I understand your evil plan: First Dave, now me; pretty soon all the production shooters will get moved to open..... :P Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
racerba Posted August 23, 2007 Share Posted August 23, 2007 Bob --- I get that. But there's really no point to downloading 33 rounders to 10, so that I can continue to play in PD ----- oh, wait, I understand your evil plan: First Dave, now me; pretty soon all the production shooters will get moved to open..... :P Only way I can stop you from beating me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now