Tigger Pull Weight And Non Federal Primers 625-8

[Bubber]

Dave,

You kind of answered your own question there.

The hammer mounted firing pin, isn't going to go through the Frame mounted firing pin hole too easily. And if you look at the face of the steel hammer it's not going to like smacking the frame mounted firing pin, with it's forked tongue.

On another note -

I loaded up some old fashioned everyday Winchester primers tonight and went to practice. I only loaded 18 rounds now, but each and every one fired without complaint. I even fired them without benefit of moon clip just to make it harder on them. Trigger pull set at 7.00 lbs.

Jim, Did the Wincesters come in a Blue box? Tried some today and they seem to soft. They are a brass or gold in color. I will be using them for my Non-Randy gun. But the Randy gun fired 8 with no prob. Just a thought and as I get so few of them it seems sad to let it get away...

[aerosigns]

Bubber,

Yeah they were in the plain old usual blue box, gold in color.

I bought them last year some time before I began to chase the elusive '150'.

Since they worked pretty well, I figured I could load them up for practice rounds, and save my precious primers for the 'big' matches.

[aerosigns]

Here is the latest rendition of the 'Claw Hammer'.

It is 313.0 grains. I think this is where I will stop. Without a mill to cut straight into the area below the hammer face, and without cutting the tail off I don't think the return is worth the effort to go farther.

I have found that the head of a MIM hammer is VERY hard. To cut the area out it took two cobalt drills and a titanium dremel/router bit.

[Airedale]

If metal prices stay high, I'll switch back to cast lead in my 625 and let Sam shoot the plated bullets in the 25-2.

Mike,

I've been shooting Masterblasters in both of my 25-2's-they are as accurate as plated-and cheaper.

Dave

[Carmoney]

Dave, one of these I might have to give those a try. Wonder if maybe they don't run them through a sizer and they're a little oversized--if so, that might explain why they shoot well. Back in the day when we cast a lot of our own bullets, we made special "25-2 ammo" by taking the bullets straight from the molds, tumble-lubing them with Liquid Alox, and loading them up. That was the only way we could get lead bullets to stabilize in the 25-2s (we had the same experience with multiple guns, it was a very well-known issue at the time).

Only problem for Sam shooting good bullets in his 25-2 is he won't get any more freebies from the keyholing effect!

[Airedale]

Mike,

I've run these through both of my 25-2's using 4.1gr of Clays. I've seen no keyholing from muzzle to 50 yds. I just ordered 1700 more-I like them.

They performed well out of my 22-4 4" and my Auto Ordnance Thompson for 3 gun today. Fixed sight N frame, a Thompson, and a 1924 born model 12 Winchester. I am cutting edge

Dave

[revchuck]

Fixed sight N frame, a Thompson, and a 1924 born model 12 Winchester. I am cutting edge

Dave - You definitely maxed out on style points!

[Carmoney]

Fixed sight N frame, a Thompson, and a 1924 born model 12 Winchester. I am cutting edge

Ha! You must've been born about 50 years too late....

[Hog Sniper]

Dont forget about Remington primers.. I just ran about 400 factory rounds of UMC 45 through my 5.75 lb Randy gun...No failures...The bullets are another story..I cant get them all to fly where I'm looking!!!

Just an FYI

Gary

[Rogan]

Now that the IRC is over, I have some time to experiment. I ran some federal primers against some winchester primers at varying trigger press levels and got the following results.

It takes 1 1/4 more "pounds" in trigger press weight to light off the winchesters.

I was able to get consistent ignition of the federal 100 small pistol primers at 5 lbs of trigger weight. 4 1/2 lbs failed to ignite most of the federal's.

I had to keep turning up the weight of the trigger for the winchester small pistol primers (these are in the standard blue box without any special markings). I finally got consistent ignition between 6 1/4 and 6 1/2 lbs.

The load I used is billy bullets 135 gr moly, 4.7 gr VV320, winchester nickle 38 special brass, loaded on a SDB.

Not a very scientific test, but a huge difference in performance. If I can get them , I'll stick with federal primers for matches and ease that trigger poundage down.

Rich

[Tom E]

I finally found some Federal primers (155). I have a 625-8. With the 155's I get 100% ignition at 5 3/4 lbs. White box WLPs need 7 1/2 lbs. What is a good trigger pull (lbs) in a 625? Tom

Edited June 12, 2007 by Tom E

[pskys2]

I finally found some Federal primers (155). I have a 625-8. With the 155's I get 100% ignition at 5 3/4 lbs. White box WLPs need 7 1/2 lbs. What is a good trigger pull (lbs) in a 625? Tom

Oh Lord, talk of loaded questions!!!

Randy Lee original 4 Lbs.

Randy Lee tweaked 4 3/4 Lbs.

Randy Lee extra 5 3/4 Lbs.

Clark 7 Lbs.

I've stroked a pair of Dr. Dremel Specials and they felt pretty good, my guess was 5 1/2 Lbs.

The trick is getting reliable ignition and a smooth operation. You don't want a "Hitch" on the rebound.

If it's smooth stick with the 5 3/4 Lbs. and practice, things may lighten up a bit as you wear them in.

[Carmoney]

In my opinion, 5.75 pounds, with the springs appropriately balanced to each other, is pretty close to optimal for a 625. My competition guns are all right in that range, and I get (1) 100% ignition (not 99% with occasional clicks like you will sometimes see with those waaaay-lightened triggers) with mixed brass and mixed moonclips, and (2) a good snappy trigger rebound (with no short-strokes like you will sometimes see with those waaaay-lightened pulls).

We will all agree that there is a point of diminishing returns, where the trigger gets too light to work properly in a competition gun. In my view that point is generally less than 6 pounds, but somewhere above 5 pounds.

Edited June 13, 2007 by Carmoney

[Carmoney]

If it's smooth stick with the 5 3/4 Lbs. and practice, things may lighten up a bit as you wear them in.

Funny--even just five years ago, a revolver with a 5 3/4 pound DA pull would have been considered insanely light. I guess it's the wheelgun equivalent of what's happened with 1911 triggers, where 1 pound pulls are now fairly routine, huh?

[pskys2]

If it's smooth stick with the 5 3/4 Lbs. and practice, things may lighten up a bit as you wear them in.

Funny--even just five years ago, a revolver with a 5 3/4 pound DA pull would have been considered insanely light. I guess it's the wheelgun equivalent of what's happened with 1911 triggers, where 1 pound pulls are now fairly routine, huh?

Who knows what the future holds as more competitors start using Revolvers. That's why we need to support guys like Randy Lee, and keep developing the next generation of Wizards.

But I do predict that one day we shall be the victim of our success. Enjoy it while we can.

[underlug]

In my opinion, 5.75 pounds, with the springs appropriately balanced to each other, is pretty close to optimal for a 625. My competition guns are all right in that range, and I get (1) 100% ignition (not 99% with occasional clicks like you will sometimes see with those waaaay-lightened triggers) with mixed brass and mixed moonclips, and (2) a good snappy trigger rebound (with no short-strokes like you will sometimes see with those waaaay-lightened pulls).

We will all agree that there is a point of diminishing returns, where the trigger gets too light to work properly in a competition gun. In my view that point is generally less than 6 pounds, but somewhere above 5 pounds.

Once the buzzer goes off, I can't tell the difference in pull with any of my guns. Of course, once the buzzer goes off, I don't know what planet I'm on, either

[pskys2]

In my opinion, 5.75 pounds, with the springs appropriately balanced to each other, is pretty close to optimal for a 625. My competition guns are all right in that range, and I get (1) 100% ignition (not 99% with occasional clicks like you will sometimes see with those waaaay-lightened triggers) with mixed brass and mixed moonclips, and (2) a good snappy trigger rebound (with no short-strokes like you will sometimes see with those waaaay-lightened pulls).

We will all agree that there is a point of diminishing returns, where the trigger gets too light to work properly in a competition gun. In my view that point is generally less than 6 pounds, but somewhere above 5 pounds.

Once the buzzer goes off, I can't tell the difference in pull with any of my guns. Of course, once the buzzer goes off, I don't know what planet I'm on, either

Wherever it is, as long as it's rotating, it's all good!

[art mc]

Use a trigger pull gage. Pull trigger all the way to the rear and hold. Hook the trigger pull gage to the hammer. Pull hammer back till it stops 3 lbs. should lite winchester primers. If you are not getting 3 lbs. tighten main spring screw. This works on my guns. Usually it take a about a half tunr in to make winchesters lite versus federals.

Hope this helps.

Art

[Tom E]

I'm finding 5/8 turn difference on the strain screw (which is a socket set screw now) between Feds and WLP. PITA but I don't have enough Feds for match and practice. I suppose counseling or rehab would make my WLPs more sensitive. Tom

[Randy Lee]

Hey guys,

Sorry it's been a while. With only me in the shop, I haven't had much time to do anything.

I do know Fed primers are hitting the stores now. I just received confirmation that my order at Graf and Sons is in.

Now on to the more intersting stuff. The typical trigger pull weight which I send out rated for factory ammo is 6-6.5 lbs.

What many don't know is that I can set the trigger pull to pretty much any weight the customer wants (depending on primer choice of course). If someone prefers to use Remington primers, sub 6 lb is fairly routine. For feds, 4.5 lbs seems to be the best balance for most people. As Mike stated, short stroking can be an issue with the lighter pulls until your trigger manipulation becomes accustomed to that weight. I find for myself that recoil helps with trigger reset- so I haven't short stroked under live fire yet(knock on wood).

At this year's IRC, I debuted my 2.5 lb trigger work for Shooting USA. I shot the gun at the Steel Challenge and the pull weight then was 2.75. No misfires with my handloads on a Dillon 650. Since then I refined a few things. I really wanted to know how low I could go. I would venture to guess that this pull weight would be totally impractical for most shooters, and it took me several months to get used to the pull/return because it literally feels like you aren't pulling anything.

The implications of the 2.5 lb pull weight are far more significant- it translates to a 4.5-5 lb DA trigger pull weight that sets off factory ammo. This means that revo shooters won't have to be so dependent on only one brand of primer.

Back to work now...

[Waltermitty]

I just saw ELVIS!!

[underlug]

Hey guys,

Sorry it's been a while. With only me in the shop, I haven't had much time to do anything.

I do know Fed primers are hitting the stores now. I just received confirmation that my order at Graf and Sons is in.

Now on to the more intersting stuff. The typical trigger pull weight which I send out rated for factory ammo is 6-6.5 lbs.

What many don't know is that I can set the trigger pull to pretty much any weight the customer wants (depending on primer choice of course). If someone prefers to use Remington primers, sub 6 lb is fairly routine. For feds, 4.5 lbs seems to be the best balance for most people. As Mike stated, short stroking can be an issue with the lighter pulls until your trigger manipulation becomes accustomed to that weight. I find for myself that recoil helps with trigger reset- so I haven't short stroked under live fire yet(knock on wood).

At this year's IRC, I debuted my 2.5 lb trigger work for Shooting USA. I shot the gun at the Steel Challenge and the pull weight then was 2.75. No misfires with my handloads on a Dillon 650. Since then I refined a few things. I really wanted to know how low I could go. I would venture to guess that this pull weight would be totally impractical for most shooters, and it took me several months to get used to the pull/return because it literally feels like you aren't pulling anything.

The implications of the 2.5 lb pull weight are far more significant- it translates to a 4.5-5 lb DA trigger pull weight that sets off factory ammo. This means that revo shooters won't have to be so dependent on only one brand of primer.

Back to work now...

genius and nice guy......quite a combination

[Luke Fay]

You hang around long enogh and see it all, Randy good to see you back.

[Viggen]

Please note that Randy can also shoot.

At the just finished 2007 IRC Randy shot a 10 on the Standards, also called Far/Near, a match within a match. That is real fine shooting.

Edited June 15, 2007 by Viggen

[Carmoney]

Yes, Randy shot a very fine match at the IRC, and that 10 on the standards is very impressive.

Now....a 2.5 pound trigger??? That's crazy, man! But I mean crazy in a good way, of course.