Thinking Of Joining Uspsa, Which Gun?

[Montag]

Hello,

I'm looking into joining a local USPSA club and am not sure what weapon I should use. I want to join the group so I can be better equiped in a stressfull situation where I have to use a weapon and to have fun while doing it.

Right now I have an USMC M9 and I just ordered a CTC Laser Grip. I was thinking of getting a Springfield XD 40 SW ported. I heard that the XD is considered a non service weapon because it's technically considered a SA pistol. If I take it someone said I'll be forced into a class where people use ungodly, non stock weapons, and wouldn't stand a chance.

I plan on carrying the M9 9mm or XD 40 for CC when I can wear a jacket, and perhaps using my 9x18 Makarov when the weather gets hot. Can I use any or all of these weapons?

I'm not sure of all the classes so excuse my ignorance. I haven't even been to a meeting yet. I just want to have fun and become proficient at using my weapon in quick thinking environments.

Thanks in advance for any help...

[Merlin Orr]

Welcome to the Forums, John. Lots of different answers to your questions. Lots. If you don't mind doing some reading you might go through these Results of general search and see the relies to various related questions such as yours. Some will not directly address your question but you will come away with a lot better understanding of the overall USPSA guns and equipment needed to play in our sport.

[dirtypool40]

Welcome.

What's "best" depends on what you like and what equipment division you want to shoot.

Either a Glock, Berreta or XD is a great pistol for PRODUCTION. If you get a 9mm you can buy, soft shooting ammo cheaply at any Walmart if you don't reload your own.

If you buy a .40 you can "make major" and move into L10 if you decide that's for you, but to get nice, soft, competitive ammo for production, you'll probably have to handload.

Other than that, you'll need the gun you like, at least four mags, three mag holders, and a holster. Most of us also buy a dedicated hard, inner / outer belt.

Kydex seems to be most popular in Production, like the offerings from Blade Tech (DOH) or Blackhawk, or a host of others. The CR speed belt seems to be the most popular of the two part belts.

Check out the production threads, you should be able to find loads of info on almost any subject. Welcome to the Benosverse.

Edited February 23, 2006 by dirtypool40

[Matt Cheely]

The M9 would be a perfect blaster for production. Come on out and get hooked like the rest of us!

[kimel]

Welcome to the forums!

It isn't the XD that puts you into "ungodly class" (actually called Open) but the "ported" part.

You can get an aftermarket, non-ported barrel to use in competition and use the ported barrel for carry or just buy the non-ported XD.

[Wideload]

Hello,

I'm looking into joining a local USPSA club and am not sure what weapon I should use. I want to join the group so I can be better equiped in a stressfull situation where I have to use a weapon and to have fun while doing it.

Right now I have an USMC M9 and I just ordered a CTC Laser Grip. I was thinking of getting a Springfield XD 40 SW ported. I heard that the XD is considered a non service weapon because it's technically considered a SA pistol. If I take it someone said I'll be forced into a class where people use ungodly, non stock weapons, and wouldn't stand a chance.

I plan on carrying the M9 9mm or XD 40 for CC when I can wear a jacket, and perhaps using my 9x18 Makarov when the weather gets hot. Can I use any or all of these weapons?

I'm not sure of all the classes so excuse my ignorance. I haven't even been to a meeting yet. I just want to have fun and become proficient at using my weapon in quick thinking environments.

Thanks in advance for any help...

Bring out your M9. Instead of Laser, buy extra magazines (have at least 5 good mags), decent holster, belt and a lots of ammo. That set up will get you shooting in Production division for some time without having to perform any significant upgrades.

Go to www.uspsa.com and read up on the game... (The links to Front Sight may be extremely helpful for you.)

[Montag]

Thank you all for the responses so far. I think I found a nice place to visit and learn. I hope all the questions won't put people off?

I did a few searches myself, in addition to reading the one a member so kindly provided, and found a wealth of information.

I was thinking now of using he M9 9mm and buying a XD 40 nonported just so I have something different. Will the M9 be outclassed by the other weapons or can they hold their own? Will the XD 40 be too big to handle effectively?

I just bought a Dillon 550, so hopefully I'll be able to crank out cheaper ammo in order to come up to speed...

Thanks again for your help. It is appreciated..

Welcome to the forums!

It isn't the XD that puts you into "ungodly class" (actually called Open) but the "ported" part.

You can get an aftermarket, non-ported barrel to use in competition and use the ported barrel for carry or just buy the non-ported XD.

[DMH]

Here's one more suggestion...

Bring what you have to ANY club or match, and just ask around. Shooters are more than happy to show off their toys, answering questions and letting you play with and shoot/borrow most anything we have. My first practice session involved me having mags stuffed into every spare pocket, and was told to keep them 'till I got my own.

That's how most of these folks are. Welcome.

[D.Hayden]

The Beretta is ready to go.. you might consider some trigger work, but that's all I did to mine.

The 'true' double action is harder to get used to then a glock, but after the first shot, I don't notice it anymore.

[XD Niner]

I agree with these folks. Just take your M9 to a match and shoot it. You'll soon gain a better understanding of what type of gun and features you want.

I am a big XD fan. That said, I would not recommend the ported version. It is not Production legal in USPSA. If you want to carry it, it is essentially worthless after dark. Firing it will produce a massive flame that will effectively blind you for any additional shots. The regular XD versions are great shooters and I don't think you'll find recoil or muzzle flip are unreasonable.

[jkrispies]

Shoot what ya got! The M9 will be perfectly fine, especially if you're already used to it. If you want to buy something else, maybe you should wait till after you've done a match or two so that you can see what else is out there and maybe pop a few rounds off from other people's guns.

[ihatepickles]

The Beretta will do just fine. The XD will do just fine. I can't agree more heartily with the thoughts of other here, definately attend a few matches before you buy a lot of new pistols or gear. USPSA is a game (played with lethal force, so please be careful). Since it's a game, you money will be best spent after you understand how things play out.

New shooters need to have some notion of the different classes before they buy guns especially for USPSA. Please hold off on gun purchases until you've shot a few matches. It roughly breaks down as follows.

Production: Basic stock gun with iron sights, 10 rounds per magazine. 9mm Parabellum is the commonly used caliber in Production, it is the minimum cartridge allowed and there is no Major caliber scoring (more on the later). No ported barrels. Internal mods to improve reliability are allowed such as trigger jobs, feed ramp polishing. Pistols must fire the first shot double action. Glocks, XDs, etc... are considered double-action only for our purposes so they're legal. Holster (no race holsters) and mag pouches must be worn behind the hip bone.

Limited/Limited 10: Modified gun with iron sights, 140mm long magazines are the max for double stack guns (170mm max for single stack magazines like classic 1911). No ported barrels. .40 S&W is the most commonly shot cartridge since it meets the 10mm bullet size to reach Major scoring standards. If you shoot 9mm Parabellum in Limited/Limited 10 it will be scored a Minor power factor. Internal and external mods are allowed. Aftermarket magazine releases, slide releases, magwells, etc... are usually added to the gun. All safe holsters allowed, worn anyway the shooter sees fit. Limited 10 shooters are limited to 10 rounds per magazine, but all other mods are permitted.

Open: Modified guns with any sights, usually an electronic dot sight. 9mm bullets are allowed to be scored Major, as long as they're pushed fast enough. Most guns will shoot a high pressure 9mm (.355 caliber) round (9mm Major, 38 Super, Supercomp, 9x21, 9x23, etc...) to allow maximum magazine capacity. Magazines are 170mm max length. All manor of gun tricks are employed, and as a pirate would say: "you're off the map, thar be monsters here...". These are generally the priciest guns in the sport and require some planning and a second mortgage before you jump in. Just kidding, well almost....

There's a few other pistol classes, such as revolvers and singlestack only divisions as well. You'll pick up the rough basics of these as you compete more.

Also, keep in mind that all shooters fire the same course of fire. There's not separate areas for each type of gun. I'm not suprised that when the divisions are explained to a new shooter that this question pops into their head, but just consider that no matter what division you choose you'll have the same amount of fun as the rest of us. You might want to read the "Match Screw-Ups" forum here on be.com to help settle the pre-match jitters.

Major/Minor Power Factor: The PF is simply the bullet weight multiplied by the speed of the round divided by 1000. If the PF is above 165 it's scored major, if it's above 125 it's scored minor. If it's below 125 then the cartridge doesn't meet requirements to be used. As I said above, Production doesn't distiguish between Major and Minor, therefore Minor is the most advantageous choice. In Limited, the bullet diameter must be at least 10mm (.40 caliber) to make Major. In Open, a 9mm Parabellum round can be scored Major if pushed fast enough (factory ammo doesn't reach these speeds). The hits on the target are graded differently for Major and Minor. A marginal hit, such as a C zone, is worth more points if struck with a Major round. Factory ammo in 9mm and .40 almost always reaches respective PF so don't worry too much about this for a while.

I'm sure this sounds confusing to some extent, or at least very involved. Why is it this way? Well, USPSA is a game and people push the rules a lot. USPSA will help your shooting a lot, but it doesn't follow any real-world gunplay tactical doctrine so don't be put out by the lack of realism. It's a fun game.

Last note of my long winded post. You'll probably want 5 magazines to shoot a match. Many times a course of fire will require 40+ shots, and these are a lot of fun to shoot. If you choose to start off in Production, you'll be restricted to 10 rounds per magazine with means you'll carry 50+1 rounds onto a course of fire that requires 40 shots. If you miss very often you'll run dry. If you find this happening, consider moving to Limited for a few matches and this way you'll be able to load your magazines to full capacity. Sure your Production class gun won't be as trick as other guns in Limited, but you'll be able to focus a bit more on learning how to shoot stages.

The USPSA Homepage has a beginner's guide as well as the entire rulebook for download. When you join USPSA part of the welcome package includes a printed rulebook. You'll need a holster, 3-4 mag pouches, ear protection, and eye protection to begin. You'll find that usually Beretta magazines fit into XD mag pouches which might save you a few bucks if you start off with the M9 and move to the XD later.

Edited February 28, 2006 by ihatepickles

[Chris Keen]

When I was new, one other shooter in particular let me borrow a couple of his mags for 6 WEEKS until I could get some more for my carry gun!

We all remember when we were new, and we all love to help out in any way we can.

I would bring whatever you have now, and shoot that for at least 2-4 weeks, talk to folks at the match and see what they recomend, before going out and buying something new.

WELCOME to a fun and exciting sport as well as the forums.

Edited March 10, 2006 by C.Keen

[DogmaDog]

Bring what you have.

If your goal is to be a better shooter with the gun you will carry for self defense, then bring it, and shoot it in whatever division they put you in.

If your goal is to be competetive, and achieve a higher score than other shooters, then bring what you have and shoot it in whatever division they put you in. When you have some experience and understand some of the nuances of the different divisions, you can start to make intelligent choices about what equipment to use for each division.

Welcome to the sport!

DD

[encoreman]

Hi Montag, You came to the right place, most all of the shooters I know are more than willing to help new shooters get geared up. I started with a used 96 Beretta and shot it for a couple of years. Don't worry about asking questions to this bunch, that's what they're here for. Just remember to be safe and have fun. Don't try to run and gun for speed at first, shoot good hits and your time will improve with practice. Good Shootin!!

[ima45dv8]

Lots of good advice so far.

Use what you have. If you don't have anything to use, go anyway. As someone said recently, you'll be kicking yourself for not doing it sooner.