38supPat Posted March 3, 2020 Share Posted March 3, 2020 It shouldn’t happen but it sometimes does, I wonder if 10.2.10 could be used? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Schutzenmeister Posted March 4, 2020 Share Posted March 4, 2020 16 hours ago, 38supPat said: It shouldn’t happen but it sometimes does, I wonder if 10.2.10 could be used? As a RM I would not approve 10.2.10 for this. This is a stage design problem, not a handicap issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bret Posted March 6, 2020 Share Posted March 6, 2020 On 3/4/2020 at 9:13 AM, Schutzenmeister said: As a RM I would not approve 10.2.10 for this. This is a stage design problem, not a handicap issue. why is a wall that is hard to shoot over for a short shooter a stage design problem ? Are low ports or prone positions a stage design problem for tall or older people? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zhunter Posted March 6, 2020 Share Posted March 6, 2020 Being 6’2” senior I have a lot of issues with port height. So anytime a shorter shooter has to get in their tip toes I have zero sympathy. What comes around goes around. Shoot’em as you see’em Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
racerba Posted March 6, 2020 Share Posted March 6, 2020 6 minutes ago, zhunter said: Being 6’2” senior I have a lot of issues with port height. So anytime a shorter shooter has to get in their tip toes I have zero sympathy. What comes around goes around. Shoot’em as you see’em there are more advantages for being taller than shorter in our sport...how often do you see low ports compared to having to reach around walls without having to really stretch??? having to take 5 steps from one port to the next instead of 2 or 3 is another big advantage for being taller...that is for 90% of the stages... so yeah - i wish i was taller for most of the stages we shoot... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChuckS Posted March 6, 2020 Share Posted March 6, 2020 12 minutes ago, racerba said: there are more advantages for being taller than shorter in our sport...how often do you see low ports compared to having to reach around walls without having to really stretch??? --- snip --- Pretty much every stage. Later, Chuck 6'4" Super Senior Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bret Posted March 6, 2020 Share Posted March 6, 2020 25 minutes ago, racerba said: there are more advantages for being taller than shorter in our sport...how often do you see low ports compared to having to reach around walls without having to really stretch??? having to take 5 steps from one port to the next instead of 2 or 3 is another big advantage for being taller...that is for 90% of the stages... so yeah - i wish i was taller for most of the stages we shoot... only see the occasional stage that a wall or port is a disadvantage for a shorter person, but a lot of low ports or shooting positions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
racerba Posted March 6, 2020 Share Posted March 6, 2020 Just now, bret said: only see the occasional stage that a wall or port is a disadvantage for a shorter person, but a lot of low ports or shooting positions. if you're not short, you really don't see those challenges...we make it look easy cause we're used to doing it...and we don't usually complain... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bret Posted March 6, 2020 Share Posted March 6, 2020 7 minutes ago, racerba said: if you're not short, you really don't see those challenges...we make it look easy cause we're used to doing it...and we don't usually complain... I don't complain about the stages, I shoot them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
racerba Posted March 6, 2020 Share Posted March 6, 2020 4 minutes ago, bret said: I don't complain about the stages, I shoot them. i see a lot of complaining in this thread... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zhunter Posted March 6, 2020 Share Posted March 6, 2020 51 minutes ago, racerba said: there are more advantages for being taller than shorter in our sport...how often do you see low ports compared to having to reach around walls without having to really stretch??? having to take 5 steps from one port to the next instead of 2 or 3 is another big advantage for being taller...that is for 90% of the stages... so yeah - i wish i was taller for most of the stages we shoot... I shot a local match for years where the stage designer was 5’4”, every single wall port was perfect for him. And he loved ports. I have not gotten over it yet, sorry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
racerba Posted March 6, 2020 Share Posted March 6, 2020 2 minutes ago, zhunter said: I shot a local match for years where the stage designer was 5’4”, every single wall port was perfect for him. And he loved ports. I have not gotten over it yet, sorry NP - well, that's an isolated situation...i can see how you would be bitter... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zhunter Posted March 6, 2020 Share Posted March 6, 2020 5 minutes ago, racerba said: NP - well, that's an isolated situation...i can see how you would be bitter... I resemble that comment Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChuckS Posted March 6, 2020 Share Posted March 6, 2020 28 minutes ago, racerba said: i see a lot of complaining in this thread... Is that a complaint? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
racerba Posted March 6, 2020 Share Posted March 6, 2020 Just now, ChuckS said: Is that a complaint? no - an observation Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Schutzenmeister Posted March 7, 2020 Share Posted March 7, 2020 5 hours ago, bret said: why is a wall that is hard to shoot over for a short shooter a stage design problem ? 1.1.6 ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
38supPat Posted March 7, 2020 Share Posted March 7, 2020 4 hours ago, ChuckS said: Pretty much every stage. Later, Chuck 6'4" Super Senior I imagine at 6’4” every port looks like a low port. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bret Posted March 7, 2020 Share Posted March 7, 2020 2 hours ago, Schutzenmeister said: 1.1.6 ... why isn't a low port considered the same thing for old and tall people? do we have to build stages that takes into account old fat people too? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ima45dv8 Posted March 7, 2020 Share Posted March 7, 2020 Vertical ports/slits. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Schutzenmeister Posted March 7, 2020 Share Posted March 7, 2020 10 hours ago, bret said: why isn't a low port considered the same thing for old and tall people? do we have to build stages that takes into account old fat people too? Old, tall, and/or fat folks PHYSICALLY CAN go down to a low port. It may be inconvenient, but they can do it. At some point a port/wall can be so high that a short person PHYSICALLY CANNOT safely reach over it to shoot. Therein lies the difference. 9 hours ago, ima45dv8 said: Vertical ports/slits. Thank you! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RadarTech Posted March 7, 2020 Share Posted March 7, 2020 Thank you!Exactly!Once you have seen someone ATTEMPT to hold a gun over their head and TRY to engage a target those that say height isn’t a problem will understand.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bret Posted March 7, 2020 Share Posted March 7, 2020 2 hours ago, Schutzenmeister said: Old, tall, and/or fat folks PHYSICALLY CAN go down to a low port. It may be inconvenient, but they can do it. At some point a port/wall can be so high that a short person PHYSICALLY CANNOT safely reach over it to shoot. Therein lies the difference. Thank you! in the OP the shooter was able to accomplish it, where is there a problem? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nevadazielmeister Posted March 7, 2020 Share Posted March 7, 2020 55 minutes ago, bret said: in the OP the shooter was able to accomplish it, where is there a problem? I think there was. She was given an obstacle that disadvantaged her unfairly due to her height. Since she was such an accomplished shooter, she was "barely" able to handle the obstacle. If any other short shooter attempted to engage the target, there might have been a safety issue. Shooting blind is never a good idea and we should never force any shooter to attempt this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IVC Posted March 7, 2020 Author Share Posted March 7, 2020 2 hours ago, bret said: in the OP the shooter was able to accomplish it, where is there a problem? The question arose at about the time she was figuring out whether she could do it all. Once she determined there was a way, the question changed from "impossibility" to "inconvenience." The former is what I was mostly concerned with, not the latter - at what point does the stage become "impossible" and what are the theoretical and practical limits for accounting for different body types. As a side/humorous issue, there was a guy on the squad, a Master, who is 6'4" and likely bench-presses minivans in his spare time. The stage in OP started in a small house-like structure with narrow doors. We were joking that he either had to slide through the doors sideways, or risk catching and carrying the whole structure on his shoulders through the rest of the stage. I guess different body types always have their own challenges... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Schutzenmeister Posted March 7, 2020 Share Posted March 7, 2020 1 hour ago, IVC said: As a side/humorous issue, there was a guy on the squad, a Master, who is 6'4" and likely bench-presses minivans in his spare time. The stage in OP started in a small house-like structure with narrow doors. We were joking that he either had to slide through the doors sideways, or risk catching and carrying the whole structure on his shoulders through the rest of the stage. I guess different body types always have their own challenges... Supports my point ... This stage had numerous design/build issues. Consideration should have been given to the arguably too high wall and the arguably too narrow door. Neither is a legitimate shooting challenge and both were potential safety issues. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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