Accuracy issues 147 extreme plated BULLETS

[dtuns]

Can get any groups past 15 yards out of 5” M&P around 130 of power factor tried different lengths. Any ideas?

 

 

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[Rnlinebacker]

Can get any groups past 15 yards out of 5” M&P around 130 of power factor tried different lengths. Any ideas?
 
 
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plated bullets can't take much crimp so treat them like coated lead. however, what gen m&p do you have and is it stock barrel?

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[MemphisMechanic]

You’re shooting Xtremes. They’re notoriously shady on accuracy.

 

They’re also 147s going through an M&P. That gun shoots 4 to 6” groups on it’s best day, and is infamous for it. (APEX sells so many hand-fit barrels for a reason.)

 

Why are you surprised?

[MemphisMechanic]

53 minutes ago, Rnlinebacker said:

what gen m&p do you have and is it stock barrel?

 

As far as I’ve seen, they didn’t do anything in the 2.0 to remedy the accuracy issues of the 1.0 with heavy bullets that a lot of us struggled with.

 

That was the most hilarious place in which the 2.0 dropped the ball.

 

Edited July 8, 2019 by MemphisMechanic

[Hi-Power Jack]

How large are the groups at 25 yards, for these bullets and the

bullets you usually shoot ?

[B_RAD]

1. Check your crimp on the bullet. Are you seeing sign of tumbling?

 

2. Like already asked, how old is the M&P you're shooting?

 

 

I disagree, strongly, with anyone saying plated bullets are inaccurate.  I've shot over 50k of them over the years, I've never found them to be at all inaccurate. I've shot all brands. I pride myself on being able to shoot accurately and just don't believe from my experience that plated is at all less accurate. That doesn't mean you couldn't have gotten a bad batch. You run that risk with anything though. 

 

Check your bullet crimp. If that checks out, then I'd say your barrel doesn't like something with your particular load. Very doubtful that the bullet itself is defective.  

 

 

 

 

Edited July 8, 2019 by B_RAD

[dtuns]

You’re shooting Xtremes. They’re notoriously shady on accuracy.
 
They’re also 147s going through an M&P. That gun shoots 4 to 6” groups on it’s best day, and is infamous for it. (APEX sells so many hand-fit barrels for a reason.)
 
Why are you surprised?

I get under 3” at 25 yards with precision delta 124 JHP


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[dtuns]

1. Check your crimp on the bullet. Are you seeing sign of tumbling?
 
2. Like already asked, how old is the M&P you're shooting?
 
 
I disagree, strongly, with anyone saying plated bullets are inaccurate.  I've shot over 50k of them over the years, I've never found them to be at all inaccurate. I've shot all brands. I pride myself on being able to shoot accurately and just don't believe from my experience that plated is at all less accurate. That doesn't mean you couldn't have gotten a bad batch. You run that risk with anything though. 
 
Check your bullet crimp. If that checks out, then I'd say your barrel doesn't like something with your particular load. Very doubtful that the bullet itself is defective.  
 
 
 
 

No signs of tumbling crimped at .380


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[dtuns]

New 2.0 about a 1000 rounds through it


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[dtuns]

Stock barrel


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[dtuns]

Couldn’t get them to group past 25 yards out of GMR-15 with 14.4” barrel decent group at 25 over 6” at 50 yards


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[JohnnyD]

1 hour ago, dtuns said:

Couldn’t get them to group past 25 yards out of GMR-15 with 14.4” barrel decent group at 25 over 6” at 50 yards


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I couldn't get decent groups out of their 124gr in my PCC either.  Switched to RMR 124gr JHP which isn't much more and groups at 50 were same size or better at 25 yards.

[dtuns]

 
I couldn't get decent groups out of their 124gr in my PCC either.  Switched to RMR 124gr JHP which isn't much more and groups at 50 were same size or better at 25 yards.

The PD 124 JHP 50 yard 5 shot group is under 1” out of GMR-15


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[MemphisMechanic]

2 hours ago, dtuns said:

I get under 3” at 25 yards with precision delta 124 JHP


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I should have specified that M&P often suffer accuracy issues *with heavy bullets.*

 

But.

 

You’re also comparing perhaps the benchmark for accuracy, the PD JHP, to one of the bullets more notorious for it’s inaccuracy.

 

So it’s tough to say which the primary cause of this.

[dtuns]

 
I should have specified that M&P often suffer accuracy issues *with heavy bullets.*
 
But.
 
You’re also comparing perhaps the benchmark for accuracy, the PD JHP, to one of the bullets more notorious for it’s inaccuracy.
 
So it’s tough to say which the primary cause of this.

I wasn’t aware of M&P having issues with heavy bullets.


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[superdude]

1 hour ago, MemphisMechanic said:

 

I should have specified that M&P often suffer accuracy issues *with heavy bullets.*

 

I suspect M&P accuracy is bullet/load specific.  Some accuracy comparisons don't show heavy bullets like 147 grain any worse than other weights in a M&P.

 

https://www.shootingillustrated.com/articles/2019/3/23/ammo-accuracy-15-loads-in-three-different-guns/

 

[rowdyb]

When I have had mystery inaccuracy issues I 

1. Make sure my sights aren't loose. Run a bore snake down the barrel and look through it for anything. 

2. Qc my ammo making process. Checking tightness of dies and all measurements. 

3. Pull bullets to check I'm not harming them in some way during loading. Making sure I do nothing to change their shape and coating.

5. Finally if still having issues I either move on from that bullet in that gun at those specs or I start changing the specs. I make 20 longer, 20 shorter, 20 with o.10 grain more powder at each of the new lengths, 20 with 0.20 more grains at each of the lengths and then I go shoot these 120 bullets after I've warmed up shooting another gun. I also make an aiming point that makes it easy for me to have a very specific and repeatable aiming point on my target at 20 yards.

 

Then I feel I have real data and checked all I reasonably could.

[MemphisMechanic]

9 hours ago, dtuns said:

I wasn’t aware of M&P having issues with heavy bullets.

 

Search through the M&P forum for multiple threads on the issue. Many long  threads. My initial post hating on the M&P is... informed hatred. I shot one for nearly ten years.

 

The M&P barrel unlocks extremely early in the recoil cycle - pull your slide back slowly and look at how early it drops open compared to other 9mm guns you own. The barrel has left a fixed consistent relationship with the slide before slower loads have exited the barrel.

 

Mine shot any budget coated or plated 124gr bullet into 3.5” or so at 25yd. Shooting even the precision delta 147 FMJ (a brand known for their accuracy) groups opened up to 6 to 8 inches.

 

Installing an APEX semi-drop in brought me down to 2.5-3.0” with those same bullets at 25. Their barrel wedges itself firmly between the locking block and underside of the slide when properly fit, and has a pad on it’s underside which requires the slide to retract twice as far before the barrel begins to drop free.

 

Doing it over again, I’d have stuck with 124s and saved $200.  But I was dead-set on shooting 147s back when I thought gear mattered, and some magic handload recipe would be a similar advantage.

 

I left the M&P to shoot a Tanfoglio which could put ANY decent handload inside 2.5” at 25 - it shot 1.75”ish groups consistently when I found what it liked.

 

I now shoot Walther PPQs/Q5s and they’re very nearly that accurate. So I still consider the M&P a sloppy gun compared to what I’ve grown used to.

 

Edited July 8, 2019 by MemphisMechanic

[rowdyb]

43 minutes ago, MemphisMechanic said:

the M&P a sloppy gun

I agree this is a deserved reputation, especially in the shooting pistols in competition arena.

[dtuns]

Thanks. I guess I should have done more homework before buying this gun. I have 124's but I have way more 147 bullets.

 

[B_RAD]

47 minutes ago, dtuns said:

Thanks. I guess I should have done more homework before buying this gun. I have 124's but I have way more 147 bullets.

 

I tried multiple M&P's over the years. I was very disappointed when shooting 147 gr bullets.  

 

I know a few guys who shoot M&P's now. They seem to like them. Though, I don't know what bullet they're shooting. 

 

[dtuns]

I tried multiple M&P's over the years. I was very disappointed when shooting 147 gr bullets.  
 
I know a few guys who shoot M&P's now. They seem to like them. Though, I don't know what bullet they're shooting. 
 

Probably 124’s lol


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[CHA-LEE]

If you have a bunch of shotgun blast level accuracy 147's then it sounds like a prefect pairing with 5 yard Bill Drill practice or 1 Shot Draws at close distances. Think about the positives in that. If you have 5000 147's and do 5000 one shot draws you will likely get pretty good at drawing the gun.

[dtuns]

If you have a bunch of shotgun blast level accuracy 147's then it sounds like a prefect pairing with 5 yard Bill Drill practice or 1 Shot Draws at close distances. Think about the positives in that. If you have 5000 147's and do 5000 one shot draws you will likely get pretty good at drawing the gun.

Yeah I figured I would practice up close work draws etc.


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