j1b Posted March 20, 2005 Share Posted March 20, 2005 *Thread Drift mode on* Historically there has always been a difference between the dry fire draw and the live fire draw. There is also one other interesting little statistic, most shooters have a slower draw on the same target when they are going to shoot two shots on that target versus one. Why? Who knows. Personally I believe it's accountability. The other night I was doing .8 draws on a light swith about . . . oh I don't know - 5 - 7 yards away. I was playing like it was a head shot draw. Guess what - in a match I will never do a .8 draw on a head shot target at 5-7 yards. In practice - possibly but rarely. I believe that the target adds accountability - and accountability makes us make certain that we are achieving the ultimate goal which coincidentally isn't the .8 second first shot, but is hitting the target. Of course I ain't no psychologist - it could be the fact that we're handling a loaded gun that if dropped could flip around and end our sex lives . . . wait - that's accountability too right? *Thread Drift mode Off* JB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BritinUSA Posted March 20, 2005 Share Posted March 20, 2005 The most glaring difference was the draw....In dry fire I can do .8's all the time and see what I need to see. In live fire It was hard getting it under 1.1 and still getting a good hit. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Just curious, when doing your dry fire draws do you use a weighted mag to simulate a loaded gun ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shooterready Posted March 20, 2005 Share Posted March 20, 2005 Jake, Good luck man! You can do it. Just wait till it warms up bit more. Dick shooterready Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jake Di Vita Posted March 21, 2005 Author Share Posted March 21, 2005 Brit, Yeah I use a fully loaded mag in dry fire too. Something interesting also happened this past weekend. Shot a steel match with Flex and Anderson....and on one stage I had several draws in the mid .7's. It wasn't a 1 shot draw either it was 2 rounds on the same target then one on a 12 inch plate above it. Very strange because it was a match. The coolest thing about it is the draw felt like it was over a second. Guess I just need to stop complaining and making excuses and do it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jake Di Vita Posted March 21, 2005 Author Share Posted March 21, 2005 Thinking about it further, when I had those draws on the steel I was totally 100% relaxed. I wasn't trying for a certain result I just wanted to hit the plates as quickly as possible. When I was shooting for the el prez I was trying to hit 3.0 - 3.5.....and therefore created a shitload of tension. That could be a big aspect of why I had a hard time getting under 3.5. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duane Thomas Posted March 22, 2005 Share Posted March 22, 2005 An observation that might help. I believe the only way to get the result you're looking for is to turn the shooting over totally to your subconscious mind. Relax. Listen for the first tone of the buzzer. Then exist in a state of relaxed awareness where you're trying for nothing, just let it happen, until the last shot has been fired. And you'll find that not only have you made your time, you'll be amazed at how good the hits are. You already have the skills to do this, now you just have to get out of the way and let your subconscious mind do it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GRD Posted March 22, 2005 Share Posted March 22, 2005 Or just scream really loud as soon as the buzzer goes off and don't stop until the smoke clears. It would make for a better video... - Gabe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jake Di Vita Posted March 26, 2005 Author Share Posted March 26, 2005 Anderson and Trout, How you comin with this guys? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Anderson Posted March 26, 2005 Share Posted March 26, 2005 Jake, I have made no progress in live fire, weather has been crappy here. Dry fire tims are still the same. I wasn't having draw problems, i was having reload and hit issues... SA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MTrout40 Posted March 27, 2005 Share Posted March 27, 2005 Anderson and Trout,How you comin with this guys? <{POST_SNAPBACK}> I've only made six attempts in early february at Dale's range. Out of 6 runs, the two best were a 3.26-6 down and a 3.11 with a mike. This isn't something I'm going to practice or spend alot of time dry firing. I'm just going to make some runs at it here and there until it happens. I'm not trying to be first...just want to do it for personal satisfaction! Jake, I've heard from a few people your making great progress. Good luck bud! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jake Di Vita Posted March 27, 2005 Author Share Posted March 27, 2005 Good stuff man....3.26 - 6 down is smokin. Thanks! I'll make it happen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flexmoney Posted April 3, 2005 Share Posted April 3, 2005 A few have questioned the very idea of chasing a 3.00 El Prez... I like the idea of the quest. I shot with Jake today. I am pretty sure he turned in a 100% + classifier (99-23 Front Sight). His turn and draw was a something like 1.07. His facing draw was a 0.84. (10-A, 2-C) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tightloop Posted April 4, 2005 Share Posted April 4, 2005 Flex.... Did it make you smile when he smoked the classifier???? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rtr Posted May 13, 2005 Share Posted May 13, 2005 Time for an update folks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jake Di Vita Posted May 13, 2005 Author Share Posted May 13, 2005 Last time I tried it a few weeks ago was 3.11 with a mike (same as Trout's...kinda wierd). Perhaps I'll give it a shot (pun intended) tomorrow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeFoley Posted May 14, 2005 Share Posted May 14, 2005 Based on the data, I think one of you will make it through refinement and repetition, but I honestly feel like it will be years before anyone actually shoots a sub 3 el prez in a match without misses. Sometimes you connect, and to connect here, you have to be really, really good(you are all that good), and even then, it has to be perfect. Will it ever be done clean on demand in under 3? I don't think so. As Flex said, I like the idea of the quest too. I also agree with Duane that the time will be a by product of just doing it right like any other stage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Merlin Orr Posted May 14, 2005 Share Posted May 14, 2005 Based on the data, I think one of you will make it through refinement and repetition, but I honestly feel like it will be years before anyone actually shoots a sub 3 el prez in a match without misses. Sometimes you connect, and to connect here, you have to be really, really good(you are all that good), and even then, it has to be perfect. Will it ever be done clean on demand in under 3? I don't think so.As Flex said, I like the idea of the quest too. I also agree with Duane that the time will be a by product of just doing it right like any other stage. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> I gotta agree. Shooting a sub 3 el prez is as unlikely as someone running a sub 4 minute mile... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clay1 Posted May 14, 2005 Share Posted May 14, 2005 Yesterday at my practice session I ran a doz or so EL Pres to see where I was. If you cut my best times in half I am almost at 3 seconds but not quite - 6.07 and they were not all As at that. I practice some more and I'll get into the 5s easy enough. Set a new personal best grip and rip one shot from hands relaxed at side .67 - for a long time I never thought that I would break 1.0. That's not an average but the very best that I have been able to do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jake Di Vita Posted May 15, 2005 Author Share Posted May 15, 2005 Only tried it once or twice....On demand was a 3.55 with 8 down I think? The hardest part is getting the splits and transitions all at .14 or less. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George Posted May 15, 2005 Share Posted May 15, 2005 The fact that you can do an on demand Prez at around 3.5 without tossing a mike is stupendous and more than likely due to trying very hard for the faster time. Once again Jake, that's some real nice stuff you got there, don't ever let up :-) -- Regards, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sixx Posted June 2, 2005 Share Posted June 2, 2005 there is no reason in the world why your splits should be as fast as just a repeat hit on the same target. Nothing about the transition makes your finger faster on the trigger. If this is the case, your repeat hits are VERY slow indeed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flexmoney Posted June 2, 2005 Share Posted June 2, 2005 there is no reason in the world why your splits should be as fast as just a repeat hit on the same target. Nothing about the transition makes your finger faster on the trigger. If this is the case, your repeat hits are VERY slow indeed. You would think that would be true. But, the reality is that it isn't always true at all. Try not to let your mind set up barriers to your possible performance. Go here: http://andersonshooting.com/videos.htm Check out the third video clip from the bottom, which starts "There was a debate on Brian Enos' shooting forums about splits and transitions..." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flyin40 Posted June 2, 2005 Share Posted June 2, 2005 there is no reason in the world why your splits should be as fast as just a repeat hit on the same target. Nothing about the transition makes your finger faster on the trigger. If this is the case, your repeat hits are VERY slow indeed. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> The idea is to MAKE the gun go to the next target which results in faster transitions. Its easy to allow the gun to follow the natural arch of recoil. I no longer do that. I have just really learned about transitions and found out on closer targets my splits and transitions are basically the same. Instead of the old way of waiting for the gun to settle back on the next target I learned to move the gun to the next target. The trigger finger has the same speed for all 3 targets, 6 shots. Its learning how to get the gun to the next target, have a good sight picture AND not slow down your trigger finger thats the key. I'm still learning though. Flyin40 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
diehli Posted June 2, 2005 Share Posted June 2, 2005 Just... go... away.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GRD Posted June 2, 2005 Share Posted June 2, 2005 If this is the case, your repeat hits are VERY slow indeed.You tell 'em buddy! Freaking molasses in wintertime these guys around here.- Gabe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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