New 627 performance center.....not so much.

[Carmoney]

The best S&W revos ever were the guns built right around 1999-2000, right after the new CNC machinery was installed, when all the cutters were still nice and sharp.

The post-MIM but pre-lock guns were the smoothest and most trouble-free production Smith wheels ever made.

[Toolguy]

Yep.

[mcb]

The best S&W revos ever were the guns built right around 1999-2000, right after the new CNC machinery was installed, when all the cutters were still nice and sharp.

The post-MIM but pre-lock guns were the smoothest and most trouble-free production Smith wheels ever made.

You lie! MIM parts suck, will break, and will get you killed on the street, three times!

[Tom Freeman]

That would be the -5 series if I am remembering correctly.

[coldchar]

That would be about right. I had a -7 that S&W had to replace the cylinder as the boring was so bad.

[kmca]

Just got back from my FFL, my PC 627 came in today. The crown looks much better than the earlier post

However, you could cut yourself on the burrs around the forcing cone and the barrel and frame don't line up. I can fix the forcing cone myself. How difficult is it to reset the barrel? Is it something a competent gunsmith could do, or should I send it off to a specialist?

[bockerSV]

It's a shame Ruger doesn't make an 8 shot GP-100.

[bountyhunter]

Taurus makes the model 608 but it's a Taurus.

[Toolguy]

It's a shame Ruger doesn't make an 8 shot GP-100.

An 8 shot Ruger would have to be a Redhawk.

[bockerSV]

No, I understand it would need to be bigger for the larger cylinder I just mean something along those lines to give smith a run at the 8 shot revolver market

[Dog1]

The crown on my 627PC looked like that. The smith that bobbed the hammer, chamfered the cylinder and tuned the trigger fixed it for me.

I have a really nice 586 that has the barrel clocked bad enough that I have to run out the rear sight blade almost full left to hit POA/POI.

[Revofan]

i recently purchased a 5" 627 "PC" and same issues end of barrel had burrs the timing was off and felt like a 30lb da trigger pull love my smith revos after there tuned but at 1100.00 a PC should be just that performance and craftsmanship not just get them out as fast as posible no matter how they work look or feel !!!!!! not happy with any of my stock revos but after some tunning i love them just expect a little more from smith and wesson !!!!!!!!!

[PatJones]

Christ sakes people, they're not injection molded plastic guns. It costs money to manufacture these things and most of us are not willing to pay for the level of finish you're taking about.

I recently read that Colt figures they'd have to sell a Python for abut $3000 if they were making them today. Smiths traditionally sold for less, but would you pay even $2000 for a 929? No they don't spend a lot of time hand fitting them for us, but most of us aren't willing to pay what it would cost if they did.

[kmca]

Christ sakes people, they're not injection molded plastic guns. It costs money to manufacture these things and most of us are not willing to pay for the level of finish you're taking about.

I recently read that Colt figures they'd have to sell a Python for abut $3000 if they were making them today. Smiths traditionally sold for less, but would you pay even $2000 for a 929? No they don't spend a lot of time hand fitting them for us, but most of us aren't willing to pay what it would cost if they did.

I would expect the barrel to be clocked correctly and flesh cutting burrs removed from the forcing cone and crown. If they can't do that at their price point, either raise the price or discontinue manufacturing of that particular model. I just paid $1200 for a gun, and I'm expected to spend another $300-500 and wait another 2 to 4 months to get their guns correct?

[shopgun]

Christ sakes people, they're not injection molded plastic guns. It costs money to manufacture these things and most of us are not willing to pay for the level of finish you're taking about.

I recently read that Colt figures they'd have to sell a Python for abut $3000 if they were making them today. Smiths traditionally sold for less, but would you pay even $2000 for a 929? No they don't spend a lot of time hand fitting them for us, but most of us aren't willing to pay what it would cost if they did.

With all due respect, what does "Performance Center" mean if it's not about performance? I had four stock 625's that took a LOT less work to get to run right than did the PC 627 38 super I had. S&W is charging extra for the PC stuff, I just wish I could see what the extra gets you.

[blind bat]

I think the big gripe is tagging the guns with the 'Performance Center' moniker rather than the price. I don't know why anyone would send guns into the Performance Center for custom work if the guns with the PC label are so poorly assembled. The marketing weenies must have determined that labeling mass produced guns as PC would net more money even with the inevitable hit to PC custom work sales.

[Fordfan485]

Christ sakes people, they're not injection molded plastic guns. It costs money to manufacture these things and most of us are not willing to pay for the level of finish you're taking about.

I recently read that Colt figures they'd have to sell a Python for abut $3000 if they were making them today. Smiths traditionally sold for less, but would you pay even $2000 for a 929? No they don't spend a lot of time hand fitting them for us, but most of us aren't willing to pay what it would cost if they did.

With all due respect, what does "Performance Center" mean if it's not about performance? I had four stock 625's that took a LOT less work to get to run right than did the PC 627 38 super I had. S&W is charging extra for the PC stuff, I just wish I could see what the extra gets you.

It gets you a grey case instead of a blue one. I think the diffrences end there.

[bountyhunter]

Christ sakes people, they're not injection molded plastic guns. It costs money to manufacture these things and most of us are not willing to pay for the level of finish you're taking about.

I recently read that Colt figures they'd have to sell a Python for abut $3000 if they were making them today. Smiths traditionally sold for less, but would you pay even $2000 for a 929? No they don't spend a lot of time hand fitting them for us, but most of us aren't willing to pay what it would cost if they did.

With all due respect, what does "Performance Center" mean if it's not about performance? I had four stock 625's that took a LOT less work to get to run right than did the PC 627 38 super I had. S&W is charging extra for the PC stuff, I just wish I could see what the extra gets you.

+1 If the 627 I bought had been a "standard" gun and priced accordingly, I might sympathize with complete lack of quality. But don't sell me the "performance center" and then ship me a piece of junk that needs a ton of work and includes a defective part that a blind monkey could have spotted.

[bountyhunter]

Christ sakes people, they're not injection molded plastic guns. It costs money to manufacture these things and most of us are not willing to pay for the level of finish you're taking about.

I recently read that Colt figures they'd have to sell a Python for abut $3000 if they were making them today. Smiths traditionally sold for less, but would you pay even $2000 for a 929? No they don't spend a lot of time hand fitting them for us, but most of us aren't willing to pay what it would cost if they did.

With all due respect, what does "Performance Center" mean if it's not about performance? I had four stock 625's that took a LOT less work to get to run right than did the PC 627 38 super I had. S&W is charging extra for the PC stuff, I just wish I could see what the extra gets you.

It gets you a grey case instead of a blue one.

And a lighter wallet.

[Carmoney]

I sorta agree with Pat, fellas. It's sorta unrealistic to expect a perfectly tuned competition revolver for a thousand bucks. They are still good raw material.

[Toolguy]

Get a Taurus and shoot only that for a year. Then ANY S&W will be looking pretty good.

[kmca]

I sorta agree with Pat, fellas. It's sorta unrealistic to expect a perfectly tuned competition revolver for a thousand bucks. They are still good raw material.

I wouldn't expect a "perfectly tuned" competition gun for $1k, however, I would expect at least the barrel to be put on straight.

[PatJones]

I sorta agree with Pat, fellas. It's sorta unrealistic to expect a perfectly tuned competition revolver for a thousand bucks. They are still good raw material.

I wouldn't expect a "perfectly tuned" competition gun for $1k, however, I would expect at least the barrel to be put on straight.

It's more important that the barrel is not over-torqued than perfectly straight.

My old Colt trooper had a barrel that was over torqued and straight, this caused a constriction where it passed through the frame. It leaded very badly, and accuracy was mediocre even with jacketed bullets.

The front sight is off slightly to the left on my 627, but the torque is correct. I moved the rear sight over a couple clicks and it shoots great. It prints small groups and eats any lead bullet I put through it.

For those of you that have never worked with your hands, this stuff is not easy. A difference of .002 of an inch in the position of the barrel shoulder makes a big difference in where the barrel clocks up.

I still encounter guns from the 80's that need work from the factory. There was nothing magical about the old guns. The Colt from the 70's I mentioned above was the worst revolver I've ever owned and I was happy to see it go.

As someone who builds guns for a living I guess I get a little tired of the whining. Factory guns are just that. A gun from a factory custom shop is just a smaller run of factory guns, stop expecting more.

[PatJones]

Sigh. I'm sorry to be grumpy but we've had a few of these threads. Let's move on and talk about shooting.

[bountyhunter]

I sorta agree with Pat, fellas. It's sorta unrealistic to expect a perfectly tuned competition revolver for a thousand bucks. They are still good raw material.

I wouldn't expect a "perfectly tuned" competition gun for $1k, however, I would expect at least the barrel to be put on straight.

It's more important that the barrel is not over-torqued than perfectly straight.

My old Colt trooper had a barrel that was over torqued and straight, this caused a constriction where it passed through the frame. It leaded very badly, and accuracy was mediocre even with jacketed bullets.

The front sight is off slightly to the left on my 627, but the torque is correct. I moved the rear sight over a couple clicks and it shoots great. It prints small groups and eats any lead bullet I put through it.

For those of you that have never worked with your hands, this stuff is not easy. A difference of .002 of an inch in the position of the barrel shoulder makes a big difference in where the barrel clocks up.

I still encounter guns from the 80's that need work from the factory. There was nothing magical about the old guns. The Colt from the 70's I mentioned above was the worst revolver I've ever owned and I was happy to see it go.

As someone who builds guns for a living I guess I get a little tired of the whining. Factory guns are just that. A gun from a factory custom shop is just a smaller run of factory guns, stop expecting more.

IMHO, that is not a fair position. The PC guns are not "just factory guns", they claim to be made by the performance center which is supposed to be a cut above factory junk. And regardless, the 627 I bought was $1300 and I do not expect a gun of that price to contain obviously defective parts are need a ton of work. I am not paying $1300 for a fixer upper. If I buy a used gun that somebody is dumping, yes it's fair to say I will expect it to need work.

As for barrels: mis aligned barrels is so common now with new smiths, I am surprised when I see one that is straight. It may take some work to get a barrel on right and have the correct torque, but they should be. What galls people is that SW sets PC guns up as "semi custom" made by craftsmen and they are just schlocked together junk.