Duty Gear Exemption

[theblacknight]

8.7. Duty Gear Exemption

8.7.1. This duty gear exemption is for patrol type gear worn by uniformed personnel, not under cover,

plainclothes, or investigative type gear.

8.7.2. Police and military personnel are allowed to use their duty rigs as follows:

8.7.3. The duty holster must be a strong side belt or thigh holster with at least one retention feature.

8.7.4. All retention features of the holster must be used.

8.7.5. All belt equipment holders must be present. The shooter may decide which belt equipment is present.

8.7.6. Police and military personnel using the duty gear exemption are exempt from:

8.7.6.1. Using concealment garment.

8.7.6.2. Holster design and placement requirements (other than listed above).

8.7.6.3. Ammunition carrier design and placement requirements.

8.7.6.4. Belt design and placement requirements.

8.7.7. Police and military personnel who carry a weapon mounted light and/or laser on duty may compete

with a weapon-mounted light/laser using their duty holster. The light/laser may not be activated during a

string of fire. With the light/laser removed, the firearm must meet all division requirements.

8.7.8. The duty gear exemption is for Tier One (1) local club matches only and does not apply at sanctioned

matches.

Why does this rule exist? I would really like to do some bigger races with my duty gear.

[Moltke]

You may be able to go and shoot for no score.

[The_Vigilante]

Probably for competitive reasons. Maybe the duty rig allows for a faster draw?

[BillR1]

Not having to use concealment is a huge advantage.

If you want the practice, then shoot for no score like Ken suggested or else just take the PEs?

[Sarge]

I would think they allow it in locals to try to recruit more shooters. I think it is perfectly reasonable to have such a requirement for bigger matches.

[theblacknight]

I'm mandated a triple retention 63XX Safariland holster. How exactly is a retention holster a big advantage? This is really the only way I can play since AIWB is no no and my Production gear is obviously too gamer.

[JeffWard]

I'm mandated a triple retention 63XX Safariland holster. How exactly is a retention holster a big advantage? This is really the only way I can play since AIWB is no no and my Production gear is obviously too gamer.

It's pretty easy to dial bacy USPSA Production Gear for SSP/ESP. Just lose the off-set holsters and swith to basic mag pouches.

Jeff

[Jim Watson]

The IDPA Fundamental Principle No 1.1.1 is
"Promote safe and proficient use of firearms and equipment suitable for concealed carry self defense."

There is no mention of developing usage of police equipment for performance of job requirements.

It is an EXEMPTION to increase local participation. If you want to move up, get out your off duty gear or a reasonable approximation that fits the rules.

[Glock3422]

8.7. Duty Gear Exemption

8.7.1. This duty gear exemption is for patrol type gear worn by uniformed personnel, not under cover,

plainclothes, or investigative type gear.

8.7.2. Police and military personnel are allowed to use their duty rigs as follows:

8.7.3. The duty holster must be a strong side belt or thigh holster with at least one retention feature.

8.7.4. All retention features of the holster must be used.

8.7.5. All belt equipment holders must be present. The shooter may decide which belt equipment is present.

8.7.6. Police and military personnel using the duty gear exemption are exempt from:

8.7.6.1. Using concealment garment.

8.7.6.2. Holster design and placement requirements (other than listed above).

8.7.6.3. Ammunition carrier design and placement requirements.

8.7.6.4. Belt design and placement requirements.

8.7.7. Police and military personnel who carry a weapon mounted light and/or laser on duty may compete

with a weapon-mounted light/laser using their duty holster. The light/laser may not be activated during a

string of fire. With the light/laser removed, the firearm must meet all division requirements.

8.7.8. The duty gear exemption is for Tier One (1) local club matches only and does not apply at sanctioned

matches.

Why does this rule exist? I would really like to do some bigger races with my duty gear.

Because many of us have seen competitors show up to a sanctioned match without retention holsters and mag pouches, running STIs and saying "WTF?"

If you have "duty level" retention on your gear, concealment is not an issue. Those who chose to take advantage spoiled the intent of the previous rule set.

This was one change IDPA got right. Maybe the only one.

[Craig N]

I'm mandated a triple retention 63XX Safariland holster. How exactly is a retention holster a big advantage? This is really the only way I can play since AIWB is no no and my Production gear is obviously too gamer.

Shit get you a serpa and a uncle mike double pouch!

[theblacknight]

8.7. Duty Gear Exemption

8.7.1. This duty gear exemption is for patrol type gear worn by uniformed personnel, not under cover,

plainclothes, or investigative type gear.

8.7.2. Police and military personnel are allowed to use their duty rigs as follows:

8.7.3. The duty holster must be a strong side belt or thigh holster with at least one retention feature.

8.7.4. All retention features of the holster must be used.

8.7.5. All belt equipment holders must be present. The shooter may decide which belt equipment is present.

8.7.6. Police and military personnel using the duty gear exemption are exempt from:

8.7.6.1. Using concealment garment.

8.7.6.2. Holster design and placement requirements (other than listed above).

8.7.6.3. Ammunition carrier design and placement requirements.

8.7.6.4. Belt design and placement requirements.

8.7.7. Police and military personnel who carry a weapon mounted light and/or laser on duty may compete

with a weapon-mounted light/laser using their duty holster. The light/laser may not be activated during a

string of fire. With the light/laser removed, the firearm must meet all division requirements.

8.7.8. The duty gear exemption is for Tier One (1) local club matches only and does not apply at sanctioned

matches.

Why does this rule exist? I would really like to do some bigger races with my duty gear.

Because many of us have seen competitors show up to a sanctioned match without retention holsters and mag pouches, running STIs and saying "WTF?"

If you have "duty level" retention on your gear, concealment is not an issue. Those who chose to take advantage spoiled the intent of the previous rule set.

This was one change IDPA got right. Maybe the only one.

It's real easy, that isnt patrol type gear and a quick fone call can confirm is what the shooter has is issued or not.

[taadski]

I'm not sure asking the MD to assign someone to go digging about to verify what duty gear a given agency issues is something that's going to happen. I know it's not at our sanctioned matches given the work load of the volunteer staff already, etc...

At the same time, I was initially displeased with the new rule also. For quite a few years, I've used my duty stuff in IDPA (and occasionally in Production) at the local, State and Regional level and really appreciated being able to use my everyday equipment for the sport. Our issue holsters are level III 6360s so I'm not sure there is an associated advantage over the standard "concealed" OWB holsters but, as noted above, it's likely a situation where a few have taken advantage of the rule loop hole at bigger matches thus ruining it for everyone else. As much as I personally don't like it, I think it probably was a sensible change to keep things on the up and up at bigger matches.

t

Edited December 27, 2013 by taadski

[theblacknight]

I'm mandated a triple retention 63XX Safariland holster. How exactly is a retention holster a big advantage? This is really the only way I can play since AIWB is no no and my Production gear is obviously too gamer.

It's pretty easy to dial bacy USPSA Production Gear for SSP/ESP. Just lose the off-set holsters and swith to basic mag pouches.

Jeff

Pretty easy how? None of my kydex gear is legal for IDPA. I'd rather spend that money on primers.

I'm not sure asking the MD to assign someone to go digging about to verify what duty gear a given agency issues is something that's going to happen. I know it's not at our sanctioned matches given the work load of the volunteer staff already, etc...

At the same time, I was initially displeased with the new rule also. For quite a few years, I've used my duty stuff in IDPA (and occasionally in Production) at the local, State and Regional level and really appreciated being able to use my everyday equipment for the sport. Our issue holsters are level III 6360s so I'm not sure there is an associated advantage over the standard "concealed" OWB holsters but, as noted above, it's likely a situation where a few have taken advantage of the rule loop hole at bigger matches thus ruining it for everyone else. As much as I personally don't like it, I think it probably was a sensible change to keep things on the up and up at bigger matches.

t

It's really this easy. A open top STI rig is not patrol gear.Boom, problem solved . A 2 min phone call isnt "going digging".

Edited December 27, 2013 by theblacknight

[Glock3422]

I'm mandated a triple retention 63XX Safariland holster. How exactly is a retention holster a big advantage? This is really the only way I can play since AIWB is no no and my Production gear is obviously too gamer.

It's pretty easy to dial bacy USPSA Production Gear for SSP/ESP. Just lose the off-set holsters and swith to basic mag pouches.

Jeff

Pretty easy how? None of my kydex gear is legal for IDPA. I'd rather spend that money on primers.

I'm not sure asking the MD to assign someone to go digging about to verify what duty gear a given agency issues is something that's going to happen. I know it's not at our sanctioned matches given the work load of the volunteer staff already, etc...

At the same time, I was initially displeased with the new rule also. For quite a few years, I've used my duty stuff in IDPA (and occasionally in Production) at the local, State and Regional level and really appreciated being able to use my everyday equipment for the sport. Our issue holsters are level III 6360s so I'm not sure there is an associated advantage over the standard "concealed" OWB holsters but, as noted above, it's likely a situation where a few have taken advantage of the rule loop hole at bigger matches thus ruining it for everyone else. As much as I personally don't like it, I think it probably was a sensible change to keep things on the up and up at bigger matches.

t

It's really this easy. A open top STI rig is not patrol gear.Boom, problem solved . A 2 min phone call isnt "going digging".

When the guy shows up on match day, who is responsible for making the call? The first time anyone sees gear is on the stage.

Really now, IDPA is a concealed carry sport. Check "The Founder's Intent." Encouraging MIL/LEO to get involved is one thing. Drop leg holsters, no retention and no concealment was never the intent for the duty gear exemption.

The outrage is a bit over the top.

Example 2 - High level LEO shooter shows up with a Glock in a kydex holster, no retention on either the gun or the magazines. If the guy says it is duty gear, it is a little late for a note from the chief.

[theblacknight]

The rule book says it must be patrol type gear with at least 1 retention devise on the holster.

Show up with improper firearms mods=DQ.

Underpowered ammo=DQ.

Follow the yellow brick road.

If IDPA was in fact a concealed carry sport shooting event, then my AIWB holster would be legal and I wouldnt have started this thread.

I do wish that IDPA would fix one of these areas, because I greatly enjoy shooting stages from actual cars(not props like USPSA) but IDPA is increasingly becoming more irelevant.

[Steve Koski]

As noted above, folks were showing up at sanctioned matches with near race gear claiming it was duty gear. It was causing problems, hence the rule change.

A two minute phone call would solve the problem? That's a laffer! I'm sure that couldn't be abused by the same folks/type that were abusing the old rule.

[rrickysee]

8.7. Duty Gear Exemption

8.7.1. This duty gear exemption is for patrol type gear worn by uniformed personnel, not under cover,

plainclothes, or investigative type gear.

8.7.2. Police and military personnel are allowed to use their duty rigs as follows:

8.7.3. The duty holster must be a strong side belt or thigh holster with at least one retention feature.

8.7.4. All retention features of the holster must be used.

8.7.5. All belt equipment holders must be present. The shooter may decide which belt equipment is present.

8.7.6. Police and military personnel using the duty gear exemption are exempt from:

8.7.6.1. Using concealment garment.

8.7.6.2. Holster design and placement requirements (other than listed above).

8.7.6.3. Ammunition carrier design and placement requirements.

8.7.6.4. Belt design and placement requirements.

8.7.7. Police and military personnel who carry a weapon mounted light and/or laser on duty may compete

with a weapon-mounted light/laser using their duty holster. The light/laser may not be activated during a

string of fire. With the light/laser removed, the firearm must meet all division requirements.

8.7.8. The duty gear exemption is for Tier One (1) local club matches only and does not apply at sanctioned

matches.

Why does this rule exist? I would really like to do some bigger races with my duty gear.

Because many of us have seen competitors show up to a sanctioned match without retention holsters and mag pouches, running STIs and saying "WTF?"

If you have "duty level" retention on your gear, concealment is not an issue. Those who chose to take advantage spoiled the intent of the previous rule set.

This was one change IDPA got right. Maybe the only one.

It's real easy, that isnt patrol type gear and a quick fone call can confirm is what the shooter has is issued or not.

Here is how the phone call would go.PD "Hello" MD " Yes ma'am I'm calling to confirm what kind of holster and mag pouches your department issues." PD "Who is this" MD "I am the match director for blah blah blah" PD "Director for what?"

MD "It is blah blah blah pistol shooting competition" PD "Are you calling to report a shooting?" MD "No no no, I am calling to verify what kind of equipment you issue" PD " What equipment?" MD " Holster and mag pouch" PD "Sir you're going to have to call back during the week between nine and five when the department purchasing agent is here." Click

[swatcop]

I am a LEO who started with my duty gear. Didn't have anything else. I think the rule makes since to ensure that everyone has a fair shake. In theory normal duty gear is a disadvantage over normal IDPA gear. But there is no standard issue set of gear. Sooner or later somebody will modify whats on there belt and claim its there duty gear. Example: swapping your duty mag holders that have flaps to open top pouches or showing up with a serpa level one when they really carry a level 3 at work. Everytime I go to a law enforcement only match, somebody complains about what someone else is wearing. One size fits all rule works the best.

[MJPLEO]

I started the same way Swatcop did as it was all I had available. My duty rig does have open top mag holders and a Safariland level 2 holster. When I run it (still do on occasion), I have everything in place (ASP, cuffs, loaded M4 mag, light, etc) except my duty radio. At my club, the guys like when I run it as they know it's a lot of extra weight regardless.

In the end, I'm much faster w/out all the extras (and my STI, lol) but I like having the choice at club level matches. My problem is getting other LEO's to get out of their comfort zone and come shoot. None of the shooting sports are tactically sound (some are more than others obviously) but it is trigger time and good practice moving and shooting with the gear you carry daily.

Just my .02,

Matt

[AWLAZS]

My duty gear is not much slower then my USPSA gear. There is a greater risk of messing up a draw because of the retention features on my holster.

[Steve Moneypenny]

This is there, because in all honesty many of IDPA's founders were police officers too, everyone wants police officers to be better shooters, and asking them to buy a special holster just to shoot a match is a bit dumb, MOST duty rigs are dropped and offset.

I have a 6004 leg holster I can draw about .10 slower than my uspsa rig because it's right under my hand. There have been numerous folks shoot IDPA matches with those rigs. The only annoyance is the folks that think they should get to start without the hood up, or the retention features locked. they take the straps off their mag pouches, etc.

The rule is there to show if your going to spend the money to go to a big match, get the gear to go to it. you WANT to be a competitor, not just shooting for fun.