StravIs09 Posted February 15, 2012 Share Posted February 15, 2012 (edited) top of the line production gun/best gun to shoot uspsa production with. ? Edited February 15, 2012 by StravIs09 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
59Bassman Posted February 15, 2012 Share Posted February 15, 2012 I believe the correct choice in your poll is "yes". Part of the beauty of Production is that there are so many competitive choices. If there is a full-size Double Action/Single Action, Double Action Only, or Striker Fired 9mm you shoot well, it's going to be an acceptable choice for Production, assuming it's on the list. I've seen folks shooting Glocks, M&Ps, XDs, CZs, Berettas, Sigs, Rugers, Caracals, EAAs...they all work well assuming you put in the time to practice and learn the gun. The differences may come down to availability of aftermarket parts that you may want such as sights, holsters, or trigger kits. But that has less to do with the suitability of the gun, and more to do with the overall popularity. Everyone will have a preference. For example, I shoot a CZ 75 Shadow in Production, and have been very happy with the choice. But someone will come along shortly to explain why a Glock 34 is a better choice due to consistency of trigger pull, availability of aftermarket parts, and sight radius. Someone who shoots an XDm 5.25 will then explain why the XDm is superior due to ergonomics. You get the picture - everyone has spent money on one of these guns, and everyone has reasons why it's the choice for them. In my opinion, your best bet is to try to get to a range where you can try as many of them as possible. Or ask after a match when a competitor is using a gun you're interested in - most guys won't mind you shooting their gun a bit to see if you like it. Pick a gun that feels good in your hand and that you shoot accurately. Buy one. Buy some more mags, a holster, and pouches. Then shoot that gun until you wear it out. By that point, you'll know what your next one needs to be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Torogi Posted February 15, 2012 Share Posted February 15, 2012 I believe the correct choice in your poll is "yes". Part of the beauty of Production is that there are so many competitive choices. If there is a full-size Double Action/Single Action, Double Action Only, or Striker Fired 9mm you shoot well, it's going to be an acceptable choice for Production, assuming it's on the list. I've seen folks shooting Glocks, M&Ps, XDs, CZs, Berettas, Sigs, Rugers, Caracals, EAAs...they all work well assuming you put in the time to practice and learn the gun. The differences may come down to availability of aftermarket parts that you may want such as sights, holsters, or trigger kits. But that has less to do with the suitability of the gun, and more to do with the overall popularity. Everyone will have a preference. For example, I shoot a CZ 75 Shadow in Production, and have been very happy with the choice. But someone will come along shortly to explain why a Glock 34 is a better choice due to consistency of trigger pull, availability of aftermarket parts, and sight radius. Someone who shoots an XDm 5.25 will then explain why the XDm is superior due to ergonomics. You get the picture - everyone has spent money on one of these guns, and everyone has reasons why it's the choice for them. In my opinion, your best bet is to try to get to a range where you can try as many of them as possible. Or ask after a match when a competitor is using a gun you're interested in - most guys won't mind you shooting their gun a bit to see if you like it. Pick a gun that feels good in your hand and that you shoot accurately. Buy one. Buy some more mags, a holster, and pouches. Then shoot that gun until you wear it out. By that point, you'll know what your next one needs to be. +1. And Its good that you placed this under "other" to get less bias. However, I would agree with previous post, it would depend on your budget too, but ultimately, whatever fits your hand well, get it, buy lots and lots of ammo betteryet, reload, then shoot the %#$^ of it. In reality, its easier said than done. There will ALWAYS be that voice that will tell you that there is a better gun out there. IMO, we all were there, tried it, and we always go back to saying stick with one as an advise. Make sure when you try other guns, try the most customized one. YMMV. Because sometimes I won't stop looking for the 'magic' part that will prevent my sight from lifting Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CareyH Posted February 15, 2012 Share Posted February 15, 2012 buy a CZ, send it to stuart(eerw) and your done:) They are really all good choices, I just like CZ's. They feel the best in my hands. Like bassman said if you can, get your hand on one of each and see how they feel. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xander Posted February 17, 2012 Share Posted February 17, 2012 CZ Shadow, bar none Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tbarker13 Posted February 17, 2012 Share Posted February 17, 2012 CZ Shadow, bar none Love the CZ Shadow, but I do wonder if I will ever truly be comfortable withe DA on the first shot. Lots more practice to do before I'm willing to try it in a match. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
59Bassman Posted February 17, 2012 Share Posted February 17, 2012 CZ Shadow, bar none Love the CZ Shadow, but I do wonder if I will ever truly be comfortable withe DA on the first shot. Lots more practice to do before I'm willing to try it in a match. I was concerned with the DA first pull. From everything I'd read, the DA pull was responsible for cancer, global warming, and the real estate crash. So I used a Beretta 92 for a couple of 3 gun matches. And what I found was that when the buzzer went off, I was aware that the first pull was different, but I never felt it. I will try to make it easier by drawing to a full target whenever I can, I can't recall an instance where the DA pull bit me. It's MUCH different on a square range firing line. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neomet Posted February 18, 2012 Share Posted February 18, 2012 (edited) A non-intuitive observation, not only from my own shooting, but also discussing with very, very, very good CZ shooters here in Phoenix is that it isn't the DA shot that most have trouble with, It is the first SA shot. Either way, it is all about learning. I'll just chime in that the choices are like everything you will try, short of picking a Jennings 380, it is all personal choice. I run a 75 Shadow pushing 160 molys and love it. Others will say that the 75 is too heavy (the plastic brigade), too light (those that love the regular Shadow), DA/SA sucks, too short a sight radius, 160s are too sluggish.... you get the idea. Truth be told whichever you pick some will think you got the best, others will think you picked the wrong one, including yourself at times when you don't do well and hit the easy button of saying it is the gun. Those moments of self-doubt are perhaps the hardest. Enough of the guided introspection... Either of your choices are great. Top GMs shoot both, so do D class shooters and both pistols do a fine job for them and everyone in between. Edited February 18, 2012 by Neomet Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ck1 Posted February 19, 2012 Share Posted February 19, 2012 Since the "whatever YOU like best..." point has been made quite eloquently by a few already... Please permit me to give my pure, unreserved, and tactless opinion: compared to a CZ Shadow, the others suck. If you're just basing your comparison 100% on the hardware (no indian, all arrow), having shot thousands of rounds through all the ones you've listed, I don't know how anyone who's shot them all for any amount of time/rounds could look you in the eye and tell you the Shadow doesn't plain rule. The DA/SA thing will not cause you to be hit by lightening, contract leprosy, or force you to talk to your doctor about erectile dysfunction. The truth is that a Shadow's DA pull is in many ways actually better then most of the guns listed, as it's free of any hitches and is pretty much on par with that of a top-shelf revolver's (I hear that Miculek guy seems to do fairly well with those), the thing that requires practice is the transition from DA to SA, but even that is really WAY overblown to the point where it's more "fish story" than reality. Besides, after that one measly DA shot is over, the SA on a Shadow is very much, no BS, about as good or better than the best 1911 you've ever shot (especially if it's a Custom Shadow or one that has a CZCustoms competition Hammer which is even nicer than the already awesome factory Shadow's hammer). I've had M&P's with crazy good trigger-jobs and every single Apex thingy made installed; next to a Shadow's trigger, they suck. I've tried XD's that have had very $$$ trigger-jobs from both Springfield's custom shop and Springer; compared to a Shadow's trigger, they sucked. This is pure unbridled opinion, so please don't flame me and freak out if I've hurt anyone's feelings who is a fan of the other pistols. I'm just sharing my take on this particular thread/question and hope others will do the same without taking any offense. IMHO, there list is much shorter: Shadow or STI GP6 (Grand Power K100)? - That STI-imported Slovak blaster is like a polymer Shadow that does a couple cool tricks that the Shadow or really no other gun I'm aware of can do: in SA it's got next to zero take-up slack, the trigger acts exactly as it's an SAO and might as well be a 1911 except the reset is actually shorter than a 1911's! It's only real drawback is that it's aftermarket support is real limited (at least for now until more guys try one). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steel1212 Posted February 19, 2012 Share Posted February 19, 2012 A Stuart tuned CZ is like good bourbon....oh so smoooooth. The double action first shot can be tuned to a none issue. The single action is like a fine 1911 trigger. I've got about 650 into my back up Hume and about 750 in my primary. Just simple pre b 75s. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DoubleA Posted February 19, 2012 Share Posted February 19, 2012 I have never held a gun that fit my hand so perfectly as a sp01 shadow. Not only that, but the trigger just stupid good. I can't even imagine how good one from Stuart would feel. As far as the DA pull goes, I like it. It is a blessing, not a curse. In dryfire you are basically working out your trigger finger and learning to deal with a much more "difficult" pull than you will actually be using. Sort of the train for the worst and hope for the best kind of mentallity. I had just gotten off a year of exclusive g35 and was ready for something with a real trigger. I have shot and held xdm's and M&p's. At the time of purchase it was down to the M&P with a sweet trigger job or the sp01 shadow custom. I held the M&P first dry fired a couple times and commented on how good the trigger felt. Then I picked the CZ up and instantly the decision was made. Seriously, CZ is the STI of production. No question. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ck1 Posted February 19, 2012 Share Posted February 19, 2012 An important thing to mention just in case it doesn't get pointed out is that a few of us are singing the songs of a Shadow or "Shadow-like" CZ, which means a CZCustoms competition hammer installed or a Cajun Gun Works hammer-job or maybe a trip to Stuart aka "eerw" and lighter hammer-spring... A regular ol' SP-01 or 75 is a fine gun, but a regular, standard CZ trigger isn't going to make anyone coo or get wide-eyed, the hammer-hook geometry on a regular CZ is super conservative as compared to how the hammer/sear geometry can be set, so a suped-up hammer is pretty much required to get what we're talking about. Shadow-ish spec guns are not ubiquitous and are actually pretty rare, you almost never catch them for sale used for a reason and they are a different animal the a run o' the mill CZ, but man are they worth the extra cash, plainly-said most guys who get to try one end up buying one so it would be expected and typical to not get a lot of real feedback about them other than from guys who've really felt/shot one... in most comparisons to other production guns the CZ's get dogged because not that many know the difference between a factory CZ-75B-variant and the thing we're talking about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steel1212 Posted February 19, 2012 Share Posted February 19, 2012 Yup get a pre b and drop a Cajun kit in and go race Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xander Posted February 19, 2012 Share Posted February 19, 2012 Here in the Philippinse, CZ Shadows are the dominant PD pistol, almost 80% of the shooter here runs a CZ, followed by Tanfoglios, Glocks and XDM's Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darrell Posted March 1, 2012 Share Posted March 1, 2012 I started production division with a G17, then a G34, went to an XD tactical custom from Canyon Creek (should have kept that one), then to the M&P. I finally got a Shadow from the custom shop after my M&P had a hickup 2 days before the Gator Classic and have been shooting it ever since, even at the Nationals. I purchased and XDM 5.25, didn't like the factory trigger, put a springer kit in it and a thinner dawson front sight and I still didn't shoot it as good as my Shadow. I sold the XDM and if I get another production gun it will be another shadow. It is by far the best production gun for me, and several people who have shot mine ordered one for themselves. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobert1 Posted March 1, 2012 Share Posted March 1, 2012 A GOOD pistol shouldn't need so much BS. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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